Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 51
07-25-2011, 02:48 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by MajorFury View Post
Let's see, my list of broke abilities that I would fix if I worked at cryptic:


1. Extend Shields
2. Carrier pets tracking cloaked ships across a map
3. Energy weapon procs across the board
4. Science Fleet
5. Shield resist stacking in general
Meh, I don't really find ES that problematic against or with high caliber players. One stun and it's gone, SNB IIRC will also remove it off the ship projecting it (and probably take out the EPTS powering it).

Course then there's the mass CPB and shield drain it away method.

Carrier pets, yeah that's stupid utterly stupid.

Sci Fleet, meh it's still removed by SNB, or the target ship can have it's shields completely drained away by CPB. (which imo is > PSW, even CPB2 is pretty stout when jacked up with an aux bat)

I think the problem with shield resists, is there just isn't anything to debuff them. We can completely strip shields, or have to wear them down but there's no middle step.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 52
07-25-2011, 04:07 PM
I see a disturbing trend...

ENG: Heal too much, nerf their healing... (You people realize Science healing can account for a large percentage of our outgoing heals to teammates...and ES is not the end all ability, several things can drop or negate it...)

SCI: Too powerful, nerf their abilities... (These guys can make or break a team, only a few of their abilities need to be looked at - specifically Scramble Sensors which need shorter durations like RSP (or immunity timers) and of course version 3 just needs plain fixing)

TAC: Too weak, needs uber buffs... (Yes Tac's need some love, but to say they don't do enough damage? Yeah... And yet I still see some of the popping people in < 5 seconds.)

If Cryptic did everything everyone is whining about all at once, it would be a mess with Eng's and Sci's getting train-wrecked left and right.

Cryptic should make a list of things that need fixing / tweaking and implement each individual change (starting from the most important first) every few days on the live server so we all have a few days to check it out and see how balanced (or just less retarded) it makes PvP.

Small (but quick) steps Cryptic, no more huge overhauls to the combat system.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 53
07-26-2011, 03:00 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by NohMalkiri
I see a disturbing trend...

ENG: Heal too much, nerf their healing... (You people realize Science healing can account for a large percentage of our outgoing heals to teammates...and ES is not the end all ability, several things can drop or negate it...)

SCI: Too powerful, nerf their abilities... (These guys can make or break a team, only a few of their abilities need to be looked at - specifically Scramble Sensors which need shorter durations like RSP (or immunity timers) and of course version 3 just needs plain fixing)

TAC: Too weak, needs uber buffs... (Yes Tac's need some love, but to say they don't do enough damage? Yeah... And yet I still see some of the popping people in < 5 seconds.)

If Cryptic did everything everyone is whining about all at once, it would be a mess with Eng's and Sci's getting train-wrecked left and right.

Cryptic should make a list of things that need fixing / tweaking and implement each individual change (starting from the most important first) every few days on the live server so we all have a few days to check it out and see how balanced (or just less retarded) it makes PvP.

Small (but quick) steps Cryptic, no more huge overhauls to the combat system.
TAC is fine after they fix heals and sci sh.t, maybe too good then
Overhaul is not craptic's strenght
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 54
07-26-2011, 03:59 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by NohMalkiri
I see a disturbing trend...

ENG: Heal too much, nerf their healing... (You people realize Science healing can account for a large percentage of our outgoing heals to teammates...and ES is not the end all ability, several things can drop or negate it...)

SCI: Too powerful, nerf their abilities... (These guys can make or break a team, only a few of their abilities need to be looked at - specifically Scramble Sensors which need shorter durations like RSP (or immunity timers) and of course version 3 just needs plain fixing)

TAC: Too weak, needs uber buffs... (Yes Tac's need some love, but to say they don't do enough damage? Yeah... And yet I still see some of the popping people in < 5 seconds.)

If Cryptic did everything everyone is whining about all at once, it would be a mess with Eng's and Sci's getting train-wrecked left and right.

Cryptic should make a list of things that need fixing / tweaking and implement each individual change (starting from the most important first) every few days on the live server so we all have a few days to check it out and see how balanced (or just less retarded) it makes PvP.

Small (but quick) steps Cryptic, no more huge overhauls to the combat system.
I find that trend disturbing as well. But as far as the changes to BO abilities the OP mentions, I fully support each one being looked at for the said reasons.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 55
07-26-2011, 04:52 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mavairo
Meh, I don't really find ES that problematic against or with high caliber players. One stun and it's gone, SNB IIRC will also remove it off the ship projecting it (and probably take out the EPTS powering it).
I dunno, It is the most powerful power in the game, i would argue.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 56
07-26-2011, 07:57 AM
Biggest issues: Shield resists from Sci fleet, EPtoS, Extend and TSS. Makes for perfect shield easily.

At least make AP:Beta affect shield resist as well! (or affect only shield resist)


For the weapon types, just give plasma, tetryon and polaron faster and more effective boosts.


Hull heals are not a big issue. Even a 17k ET3 is negated with one round from a cannon escort, unless it's protected by a shield or strengthened by hull resists.


The bugs need fixing. SS clearing and cloaking bugs mostly.


Some abilities should be brought in line, to make them equally useful, like EPtoXs and teams.


And finally a big one! Resistances to make spamming less efficient! The CC skills should "all" give a resistance that equals the up-time. A 30 second SS should give 30 second resistance upon expiration etc. Then the CC skills could all be given a good boost. The boosted abilities would make one sci ship a lot more dangerous, but the cooldown would make multiple sciships less efficient, unless they run different setups. More variation=more fun.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 57
07-26-2011, 09:40 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dassem_Ultor

And finally a big one! Resistances to make spamming less efficient! The CC skills should "all" give a resistance that equals the up-time. A 30 second SS should give 30 second resistance upon expiration etc. Then the CC skills could all be given a good boost. The boosted abilities would make one sci ship a lot more dangerous, but the cooldown would make multiple sciships less efficient, unless they run different setups. More variation=more fun.
As much as I want SCI powers looked in to a 1:1 immunity is too long 4:1 is the max length for an immunity. anything more is a hardcore nerf.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 58
07-26-2011, 01:16 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mavairo
Meh, I don't really find ES that problematic against or with high caliber players. One stun and it's gone, SNB IIRC will also remove it off the ship projecting it (and probably take out the EPTS powering it).

Course then there's the mass CPB and shield drain it away method.

Carrier pets, yeah that's stupid utterly stupid.

Sci Fleet, meh it's still removed by SNB, or the target ship can have it's shields completely drained away by CPB. (which imo is > PSW, even CPB2 is pretty stout when jacked up with an aux bat)

I think the problem with shield resists, is there just isn't anything to debuff them. We can completely strip shields, or have to wear them down but there's no middle step.
Actually a smart player can hit Aux2ID before he casts ES making himself invunerable to PSW.

Yes you can try to build an entire team around mass CPB in an attempt to counter a simple "fire and forget" skill like ES that offers an incredible defensive buff at very minimal sacrifice to the caster. If only 1 or maybe 2 ships had it then fine but there are teams running around with 4 or 5 ES and now with the increased range of its effectiveness....well it would definitely be a skill I think should get tweaked.

Carrier pets....everyone should agree, just plain dumb!

Any of the "fleet"abilities technically can be stripped but the other two are nowhere near as effective as Science Fleet. Its just another example of why you can't have too much science in a group. If I was forced to choose between a team of 5 engineers, 5 tacs, or 5 Science it wouldnt even be close to a debate....the 5 science in a hearbeat.

An as far as shield resists go, yes they need to be susceptible to debuffs. It would go a long way toward balancing out the insane shield tanking right now if you could at least throw some debuffs on them. Now I might be completely wrong on this but I also thought that shield resist values were calculated differently then hull resist values no? It was my understanding that they effectivelly "stacked" thereby making it relatively simple to hit the shield resist cap? Again, I might be wrong on that but I'm sure someone can clarify.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 59
07-26-2011, 02:00 PM
Which then puts his ASIF2 (or 3 depending on which ES he's running) onto CD, a fifteen second CD.

For ten seconds of stun immunity, so there's still 5 seconds that ES can simply be knocked off.

I've found with CPB you really don't need a full team to completely hose someone. 2 ships is adequate for the job especially if you've got some strong burst dps on the team. If one of the Bursters is an MVAM or BOP you can up the CPB to 3 ships pretty readily, which hoses -everyone- in the vicinity's shields I've found. Making a horrendous guessing game as to which ship is going to need the mega shield heals and resist boosts before the burst smacks someone. The worst part is, there's not quite enough shield heals generally going on, to heal 5 ships enough to with stand a full teams focus fire, making the old Jump Target even more dangerous for a healer to cope with.

CPB1 isn't terrible but aux bats are pretty much mandatory to get it to work, so if you were really crazy you could have 4 ships on a damage focused team packing it.

Someone will die at that point on the shield drained team. It's just a matter of who.

There's also tachyon beam 3 that works very well.

The main problem is, no one really thinks to carry those skills as a whole.

Also, with the Scrambles, being thrown about causing target jumps ES is hardly a fire and forget. (My current record. ESing a Tric, then a Chroniton mine, and then a scorpion fighter while scrambled in the same match)

If I had to pick which five, it'd be all engies personally. 5 Miracle Workers, assuming even moderate healing is going on, that's a zombie team, even against a sci and tac heavy enemy team. Then with The Crack (Eps powerflow) and Nadion inversion the damage can get cranked up pretty severely.

Shield resists also stack with diminished returns.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 60
07-26-2011, 06:50 PM
I think we can all agree that the first thing that needs fixing is Scramble. Either nerf the durations or add immunity timers and just plain fix version 3.

ES is not the most powerful ability in the game either, SNB was and still is. It can make anyone go from Hero to Zero. And there are so many counters to it, both hard and soft, it's not even funny. Unless we're fighting PUG's, my Extends rarely stay on my target for the full duration anyway. They normally get knocked off by PSW or my target is shield stripped / repulsed out of range or I get held / GW'd / Engine Disabled while my target goes out of range.

As to shield resists... They need to be that powerful because there's so much crap that can take shields down with little or no actual damage... CPB, TachBeam, TSSub, Phaser Procs, SNB (with a moderate alpha), etc...

Mostly though, I just hate people abusing a broken/questionable skill en mass and thinking they're good because of it.

And no, I'm not talking about HarPengs. Go ahead and shoot me with them. I LAUGH at your measly 2% hull damage when I don't have a resist buff up to negate it completely or a Hazards running to clear it. 99% of the time my natural hull regen or Borg proc heals any and all LAWLPeng damage without any input from me.
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