Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 61
07-26-2011, 07:44 PM
Sooooo Veritas.....let me get this straight. You think shield resist stacking combined with no debuffing of shield resistances is A OK? I'm just asking for clarification on what your opinion is. Perfectly fine for us to have varying opinions of course but I don't want to put words in your mouth so to speak.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 62
07-26-2011, 08:03 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by NohMalkiri
As to shield resists... They need to be that powerful because there's so much crap that can take shields down with little or no actual damage... CPB, TachBeam, TSSub, Phaser Procs, SNB (with a moderate alpha), etc...
Shield resists don't help you against CPB or Tachbeam... ot TSsub... or Phaser Procs... or SNB. Shield resist make Pew Pew pointless.... there for ensuring every serious team is going to have a couple sci with CPB TACH that ignore resists, and that same team is likely all going to be shooting phasers for a reason.

If resists did not stack... suffered diminishing returns. Or had some other tangible means too reduce them from supper hard... the need for skills that ignored those values would not be a necessity.

What I would love to see happen... although Cryptic doesn't have the know how to do it properly.
Would be;

For Shield resists suffering diminishing returns just like hull resists. Making stacking TSS and EPTS less effective... and things like ES far less effective... or more if you where to say drop your teams EPTS for ES instead or something. I would reduce the amount of resits given by shield power(By ALOT) and UP (as in double) the regen rate tied to the power mechanic. Sci fleet needs a proper nerfing for this to work as well. EPTS was a lazy move by Cryptic... 30 second resists numbers ?? It doesn't function at all like the other EPT skills, it was added because they couldn't balance things properly it was just lazy.... as was making a skill call "TRANSFER" Shield strength self castable. lol (really where the heck is that extra shield strength coming from... and why wouldn't you just use that strength all the time, I mean it seems to come from thin air and all)

In trade CPB / Tachyon would NOT ignore shield resist numbers....
Tet weapons would be given a shield resist debuff....
Crew would be tied to the Subsystem repair trait... and it would work...
Tac team would be reduced to 5 seconds like the other team skills...

Bottom line... weapons would cut through shields easier... regenerating shields could be done with power settings much easier.

Of course Cryptic would never get it right and we would end up with a bigger mess then we have.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 63
07-26-2011, 09:23 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by MajorFury View Post
Sooooo Veritas.....let me get this straight. You think shield resist stacking combined with no debuffing of shield resistances is A OK? I'm just asking for clarification on what your opinion is. Perfectly fine for us to have varying opinions of course but I don't want to put words in your mouth so to speak.
Perfectly. I don't think it's very Trek'ish so see shields go up, down, up, down, up, down in terms of capacity. Resists make the shields actually last long enough to be worth a damn.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 64
07-26-2011, 09:27 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Husanak View Post
Shield resists don't help you against CPB or Tachbeam... ot TSsub... or Phaser Procs... or SNB. Shield resist make Pew Pew pointless.... there for ensuring every serious team is going to have a couple sci with CPB TACH that ignore resists, and that same team is likely all going to be shooting phasers for a reason.

If resists did not stack... suffered diminishing returns. Or had some other tangible means too reduce them from supper hard... the need for skills that ignored those values would not be a necessity.

What I would love to see happen... although Cryptic doesn't have the know how to do it properly.
Would be;

For Shield resists suffering diminishing returns just like hull resists. Making stacking TSS and EPTS less effective... and things like ES far less effective... or more if you where to say drop your teams EPTS for ES instead or something. I would reduce the amount of resits given by shield power(By ALOT) and UP (as in double) the regen rate tied to the power mechanic. Sci fleet needs a proper nerfing for this to work as well. EPTS was a lazy move by Cryptic... 30 second resists numbers ?? It doesn't function at all like the other EPT skills, it was added because they couldn't balance things properly it was just lazy.... as was making a skill call "TRANSFER" Shield strength self castable. lol (really where the heck is that extra shield strength coming from... and why wouldn't you just use that strength all the time, I mean it seems to come from thin air and all)

In trade CPB / Tachyon would NOT ignore shield resist numbers....
Tet weapons would be given a shield resist debuff....
Crew would be tied to the Subsystem repair trait... and it would work...
Tac team would be reduced to 5 seconds like the other team skills...

Bottom line... weapons would cut through shields easier... regenerating shields could be done with power settings much easier.

Of course Cryptic would never get it right and we would end up with a bigger mess then we have.
Thanks for saying what I'm trying to say in a way that makes sense lol.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 65
07-27-2011, 12:51 AM
Shield Resistances _have_ diminishing returns. They work differently than for hull, but they are not addtive, but multiplicative. A shield resistance bonus is effectively a damage multiplier (lower than 1), and you multiply all of them. So 2 x 30 % resistance don't equal 60 % but 51 %.

It would make most sense to me if they used the same mechanic as for hull resistance, admittedly. Still, ultimately
we kinda need the resistance bonus we got because you can also stack damage to ridicilious heights. That is in a way a fundamental flaw in the system. Changing resistance stacking fundamentally would require changing damage output fundamentally as well.

I think the system isn't that badly balanced overall. It might not necessarily create the gameplay you expect from the franchise, but overall it leads to battles with a certain degree of complexity and strategy to them, and it still allows a variety of ship and team setups.

I would currently focus more on fixing some of the outliers like the Hargh'Peng and buff the "useless" skills and weapons.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 66
07-27-2011, 03:41 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by MustrumRidcully View Post
I think the system isn't that badly balanced overall. It might not necessarily create the gameplay you expect from the franchise, but overall it leads to battles with a certain degree of complexity and strategy to them, and it still allows a variety of ship and team setups.

I would currently focus more on fixing some of the outliers like the Hargh'Peng and buff the "useless" skills and weapons.
I'm new around here, but I tend to agree with this based on my experience thus far. Yes, it can be difficult to take certain specs down through all of their defense... but that's the point of their spec, if that's the case.

The way I see it, right now, there's a lot of investment in defensive abilities because there's a lot of damage output flying around out there. Alpha strikes from Tac Escorts are brutal enough to justify the general level and power of defensive abilities that augment shields and hulls, IMO. Regardless of how much defense is being stacked, these types of specs can still be taken down with the proper coordination and combination.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 67
07-27-2011, 07:54 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Captain Data
As much as I want SCI powers looked in to a 1:1 immunity is too long 4:1 is the max length for an immunity. anything more is a hardcore nerf.
I think being scrambled 50% of a match is bad enoug... and because the immunity on most abilities will be shorter than the cooldown on the sci ship casting it, a single sci ship would not feel any nerf at all. Only multiple ships spamming the same ability would be affected, and that would be good. Would be much more fun if the sci challenge was to cast the right ability at the right moment, rather than just trying to keep one ability permanently up.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 68
07-27-2011, 08:46 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dassem_Ultor
I think being scrambled 50% of a match is bad enoug... and because the immunity on most abilities will be shorter than the cooldown on the sci ship casting it, a single sci ship would not feel any nerf at all. Only multiple ships spamming the same ability would be affected, and that would be good. Would be much more fun if the sci challenge was to cast the right ability at the right moment, rather than just trying to keep one ability permanently up.
While agree I will say a 1:1 would set a bad precedence. SS should have a similar resist to timers as PSW and other stunners. Of course if they fix the skill all together it may not need a resist to timer on it.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 69
07-28-2011, 04:02 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Captain Data
While agree I will say a 1:1 would set a bad precedence. SS should have a similar resist to timers as PSW and other stunners. Of course if they fix the skill all together it may not need a resist to timer on it.
I still think it should have a mechanism that prevents it from being applied permanently to a ship by a gang of sci ships. Unless this fix was a major change to how it works.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 70
07-28-2011, 07:33 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dassem_Ultor
I still think it should have a mechanism that prevents it from being applied permanently to a ship by a gang of sci ships. Unless this fix was a major change to how it works.
I agree that no ship should be perma-SS but 1:1 uptime to resist would pretty much be a nerf to SCI ships and a buff to already strong to OP'd healing. I mean besides SNB there really is no way to slow a zombie cruiser.
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