Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 51
08-31-2011, 09:55 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by mvs5191 View Post
While I can't speak for the rest of SOB, I abhor Scramble and will not use it. Haven't used it in months and refuse to use it. That being said, other people in SOB use it. While I don't advocate it, far be it from my place to say, "Hey, stop using Scramble. Some people hate it."

But we DO usually run Sci-heavy teams, whether it's Sci captains or Sci ships... SOB stands for "Science or Bust" after all.
I just simply point out what people are complaining about all the time. Almost every premade pvp fleet in this game has members who are whining on the forums nerf this nerf that and oh the bad Rhode Island ect... and on the other hand i see those who complain here using it in game. Because everybody thinks they can't win any other way. Its fine with me personally really, yes SS is a pain in the rear but its not that this skill is broke since yesterday. Every patch Cryptic brings out breaks other things, i just say my aft torpedo arc is messed up since yesterday. All together it makes it less fun less people do pvp and the ones who do don't do it seriously because they only want their emblems and good is. I m not sure if you noticed but waiting time to get into a PVP has been increased lately alot. Though at times you see alot on and there is times you wait 30 minutes if you signed up for CH and Arena. But since i m on almost every day over an entire day I noticed that less and less people play PVP. PVP was the only thing to do for me in the last year because Cryptic wasn't able to bring out more content (of course we all know its Atari's fault).

I have 13 or so VA/LG, on Q weekend i leveled from Ensign to VA in 2 days. So what do i do i go back to PVP with the result being the same. I have grown tired of this game entirely so has the rest of my fleet. PVP being the only real challange this game. But we be nice to the STO communitiy we will offer a PVP tournament with rather unliked rules in September for everyone who wants to be part of it. I m just not sure if we can post it here on the forums because we offer ingame items and ec for prices which i think is not allowed on the forums. But somehow i have to give up 500 mil EC and the 1000+ purple gear and make use of the 3500+ emblems before my sub runs out. My faith in cryptic turning this game around is not high enough actually i think it will go down the hill ones it gets F2P because content like weekly episodes and fun are going to end up in the C-Store....

But anyway I call out all the major fleet names in that post because i want to point out that none of your fleets can live without broken stuff and the excuse for that is well they use it so we have to use it to beat them...
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 52
08-31-2011, 10:00 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by inktomi19d View Post
Give SS a reliable counter, and much of the complaint about it would vanish
DEAD ON THE MONEY.

I don't care if it lasts 2 minutes. The target switching is off the chain. I have been playing this game since Closed beta, as a healer. Back when SS worked well (no target switching), it was a decent power.

1) It messed up any AOE attacks you would throw

2) It allowed for a couple of seconds hesitation as you had to MANUALLY target your enemy, because tab targeting would most likely grab a friend.

It had uses then and still does now. But to create a function of the power that basically removes any reliable way to counter it is BROKEN.

To sit here an read about this"100% clear rate" if you target a friend and how it is just us players that need to be "hand held" who are complaining ...

That is just intellectually dishonest from top to bottom

This power is a crutch for weak sauce players to lock down the entire enemy team using 1 or 2 guys... worse if they have more for that infinite scramble goodness.

Elite.. HA.

Drop the broken toys children.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 53
08-31-2011, 10:34 AM
Ok instead of replying individually, i will reply to the main points:

-If your entire team is scrambled, that is poor positioning on YOUR part. Spread out.

-There already IS a counter, it is called Sci team. You can even use it on yourself after you get hit by the green ball but before youre scrambled.

-Learn how to play through scrambles. Not everyone needs a sci team. Escorts without buffs for another 15 seconds do not need it. Sci ships with its offensive abilities on cooldown do not need it. Full healing cruisers should still be able to heal teammates with no problems. Ive played with some other teams on vent/Ts when my guys arent on, and I find there is way too much panic over it.

-Taking 3 sci ships makes your team pretty squish and I would not recommend it.

-The mobility hindering abilities can easily be placed on a single sci ship. No teammates required.

-No, we do not have AoE sci teams in Qew. What we do have is communication and a well balanced team prepared to deal with it. Everyone knows what everyone has and the team operates as a single unit instead of 5 individuals, and build 5 man setups that are all made to work with one another. example of a document we all have access to: http://imageshack.us/f/703/qewsetupexample.jpg/

-If a team is *not* using SS III and still has the potential to perma scramble you, they are giving up *a lot* to do it. It would have to be at least 3 sci ships and 5 or 6 scrambles between them. That means they have three squish ships with 5 or 6 less transfers/hazards.

-It is actually impossible for Qew's setup to perma scramble even 1 target, let alone five, yet people claim we have 4 scrambles. Up until last week, at most we had 1 crappy SS1 and people would still moan about it. Honestly, I think scramble has such a huge mental effect on people that they give up or assume the other team has unlimited copies. It simply is not the case.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 54
08-31-2011, 10:40 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Beagles View Post
Ok instead of replying individually, i will reply to the main points:

-If your entire team is scrambled, that is poor positioning on YOUR part. Spread out.

-There already IS a counter, it is called Sci team. You can even use it on yourself after you get hit by the green ball but before youre scrambled.

-Learn how to play through scrambles. Not everyone needs a sci team. Escorts without buffs for another 15 seconds do not need it. Sci ships with its offensive abilities on cooldown do not need it. Full healing cruisers should still be able to heal teammates with no problems. Ive played with some other teams on vent/Ts when my guys arent on, and I find there is way too much panic over it.

-Taking 3 sci ships makes your team pretty squish and I would not recommend it.

-The mobility hindering abilities can easily be placed on a single sci ship. No teammates required.

-No, we do not have AoE sci teams in Qew. What we do have is communication and a well balanced team prepared to deal with it. Everyone knows what everyone has and the team operates as a single unit instead of 5 individuals, and build 5 man setups that are all made to work with one another. example of a document we all have access to: http://imageshack.us/f/703/qewsetupexample.jpg/

-If a team is *not* using SS III and still has the potential to perma scramble you, they are giving up *a lot* to do it. It would have to be at least 3 sci ships and 5 or 6 scrambles between them. That means they have three squish ships with 5 or 6 less transfers/hazards.

-It is actually impossible for Qew's setup to perma scramble even 1 target, let alone five, yet people claim we have 4 scrambles. Up until last week, at most we had 1 crappy SS1 and people would still moan about it. Honestly, I think scramble has such a huge mental effect on people that they give up or assume the other team has unlimited copies. It simply is not the case.
Amongst other things I disagree with, the biggest part that I do is this: Everything you're mentioning is within a premade.

What about pugs?
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 55
08-31-2011, 10:48 AM
I have never liked scramble sensors, but not for the reasons everyone else hates it. I don't like it because it is random and unpredictable. When I use a power I want to know it does something! But because it is always unpredictable, I have never favored SS.

That said, when it does work it is annoying for the persons getting hit by it. That you can't even use powers on yourself reliably is nonsense and should go. I'm not opposed to 'wasting' a power when misfiring it, but I don't think enemies should benefit from misfired buffs and heals. I also do not like the fact that it can misfire self-only powers like evasive manuevers. That is nonsense.

However, having been hit by it many times, I do not agree with the assertion that SS3 has an inherently higher proc chance than SS1. I have never felt more affected by SS3 than SS1 or 2, personally. SS3 lasts longer, and that is the only reason I think anyone perceives that SS3 is somehow more effective with its target switching.


I will just repeat the suggestion I made long ago for SS. Change it entirely, remove the target switching mechanic. Make it a straight debuff to accuracy and heals used by the scrambled person. I would suggest SS1 debuffs accuracy and healing by 10%, SS2 by 20%, and SS3 by 30%. It would effectively retain its role as healing/targeting debuff without the randomly frustrating mechanics. It would allow all those people who think ST is a must to go without and risk being debuffed, yet still able to function just fine.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 56
08-31-2011, 10:49 AM
I dont care about pugs, just like I dont care about 1v1. This is obviously a team game when ships specialize in a single role like they do. I pug but I dont expect much out of teammates. If I am upset by scrambles then I shouldnt have gone in without some friends in support ships.

Maybe if more people had a premade mentality and learned how to play as a team, pug skill levels would increase as well. I know when I get matched up with players from RE or TSI that I can work with them and make things happen. Sure, it may not be as efficient due to not having VoIP, but at least there is some sort of teamwork going on. I dont see why anyone should care about being stuck with the average joe in a useless pug match at all.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 57
08-31-2011, 10:51 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Beagles View Post
I think scramble has such a huge mental effect on people that they give up or assume the other team has unlimited copies.
I actually agree with you on several points.. Since I often fly Tac Escort or Cruiser, I tend to stay on the edge of the fight.. If focused I can evasive to the "other side", instead of making a 20k dash, and be in relative safety..

For a little while Ive tried to hold many of my abilities while under fire.. Instead of spamming spacebar, I try to tab to a target, activate one ability, then manually click the fire all weapons icon.. It works for the most part, even though it takes a little longer than facerolling the regular buffchain.. The point is that this mental effect you talk off becomes quite apperant in hindsight.

As long as I keep the target and dont activate to many abilities at once, target jumping is minimal, even under SS3.. I tend to save the majority of buffs for when the scramble is cleared or expires (buffing for an alphastrike is certain to mess up targetting completely)

I still hate SS though.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 58
08-31-2011, 10:52 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Beagles View Post
I I dont see why anyone should care about being stuck with the average joe in a useless pug match at all.
Well now imagine, why should average joe care about those elite pvpers ? obviously top pvpers are minority in this game, so do not be suprised when the game is adjusted to the level of majority...
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 59
08-31-2011, 10:54 AM
Average joe doesnt care about anyone, thats why average joe is in a cruiser with EptS III
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 60
08-31-2011, 10:56 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Beagles View Post
Average joe doesnt care about anyone, thats why average joe is in a cruiser with EptS III
Average Joe *could* be a DPS cruiser there to blow **** up, not to heal :p

EPS3 is huge overkill though.
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