Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 11
09-07-2011, 07:02 AM
And watch an 8 beam Cruiser buddy, they all fire together in a broadside. You're just thinking that because some weapons can't fire simultaneously like DHC's which fire in sequence one behind the other (like a .5s delay) allowing turrets to slip in between the firing cycle in a domino effect. Beams and Turrets don't have that problem, you press fire all and they're all going to light up.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 12
09-07-2011, 07:35 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by NohMalkiri
And watch an 8 beam Cruiser buddy, they all fire together in a broadside. You're just thinking that because some weapons can't fire simultaneously like DHC's which fire in sequence one behind the other (like a .5s delay) allowing turrets to slip in between the firing cycle in a domino effect. Beams and Turrets don't have that problem, you press fire all and they're all going to light up.
Go to your power bar and select one of your guns. Beam, turret, cannon, whatever. See that TOGGLE (x) on the list?

DC TOGGLE (3)
DHC Toggle (2)
Beam Array Toggle (4)
DBB Toggle (4)

etc, etc.

That's how many guns fire per volly. Or so I'm told, which is what this conversation is based on. There has been no confirmation from the Devs on this.

Turrets by the way, toggle 2.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 13
09-07-2011, 07:54 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mongoson View Post
Weapon slot overloading works well for tac captains, not so much for sci or engineer captains.
Actually I run an engineer captain with beams and Beam Overload. With EPS transfer, I get a boost to my weapon power, and when the Overload hits, my power levels bounce back faster, so I get a higher sustained damage over time. Science can get a similar effect to Attack pattern alpha with their Sensor scan, AND can remove debuffs with the Subnuke beam.

Oh, and I would understand your arguement of that, "Yeah, well, um.... well at least I do more damage!" Maybe, but every fleet action I've been going into, I've been getting first place in my beam escort every time. So take those results however you'd like.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 14
09-07-2011, 03:16 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sprint01
Go to your power bar and select one of your guns. Beam, turret, cannon, whatever. See that TOGGLE (x) on the list?

DC TOGGLE (3)
DHC Toggle (2)
Beam Array Toggle (4)
DBB Toggle (4)

etc, etc.

That's how many guns fire per volly. Or so I'm told, which is what this conversation is based on. There has been no confirmation from the Devs on this.

Turrets by the way, toggle 2.

http://forums.startrekonline.com/arc.../t-114019.html

Toggle max is the fire time of a skill. What happens when you fire a beam weapon is it fires for 4 seconds or 4 max after that it turns the toggle off and has to recharge for 1 second. You will notice this on all attacks that have a duration like attack. Tachyon beam fires for 3.6 second or toggle 3.6 max, extend shields unless they changed it recently was toggle 30 max or 30 seconds.


From another post


This is not entirely true. Toggle max is the maximum amount of time that weapon or skill will fire. In this case all Beams have a toggle max 4 or they fire for 4 seconds per salvo. Single and Dual Cannons, and Turrets have a toggle max 2 or they fire for 2 seconds per salvo. While Dual Heavy Cannons have toggle max one and only fire for one second. Extend Shield skill has a toggle max of 30 last I looked meaning it will continue to fire pulses for 30 seconds then shut off. Recharge time of all toggles doesn't kick in till after the toggle turns off.

All Beams and Turrets can fire at all times unless you don't have the weapon power to fire them even if you could equip 20 they would all fire.

.



These are from the forums going back to last year, I did a search and found dozens of threads with the same explanation in each. the Toggle number is the amount of time the weapon fires before you need to activate it again this includes its cooldown.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 15
09-07-2011, 08:42 PM
I've got an engineer in a star cruiser that has 8 anti-proton turrets. It's a viable build, but it's not going to get me to the top of the DPS charts. I like to think of it as a lazy build, because you don't really have to care which way the ship is facing, just that your target is within 5k so you're getting decent damage.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 16
09-07-2011, 10:19 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brakner View Post
http://forums.startrekonline.com/arc.../t-114019.html

This is not entirely true. Toggle max is the maximum amount of time that weapon or skill will fire. In this case all Beams have a toggle max 4 or they fire for 4 seconds per salvo. Single and Dual Cannons, and Turrets have a toggle max 2 or they fire for 2 seconds per salvo. While Dual Heavy Cannons have toggle max one and only fire for one second. Extend Shield skill has a toggle max of 30 last I looked meaning it will continue to fire pulses for 30 seconds then shut off. Recharge time of all toggles doesn't kick in till after the toggle turns off.

All Beams and Turrets can fire at all times unless you don't have the weapon power to fire them even if you could equip 20 they would all fire.

.
^ This.

I've flown a Cruiser for years. Trust me, I know I can fire all beams at once. It's quite devastating with supporting consoles, max weapon power and EPS or Nadion running. That's why it's such a viable build for an Engineer Cruiser (6-8).

http://www.youtube.com/user/greatlor...27/Ol3mdmVFLYM - This is pretty much the only video I have of Veritas in PvP. You'll see my Cruiser at 7:33-7:40 firing all it's beams between two targets as I swap targets and again at 7:55-8:10 in the top of the frame. I think I'm running 6 beams + 2 Chroniton mines.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 17
09-08-2011, 10:06 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brakner View Post
Do you have proof of this? I just watched my tray and beam graphics through 6 consecutive Borg sphere fights and I can tell you that all my beams were firing at once in several fights 9Based on how I entered combat). At one point I did not take my eyes off of the tray (almost died ) for the entire engagement to make sure. In fact I even took my beams off of auto fire and attached them back to the space bar and used that for two fights. I could easily get all 6 beams to fire in a salvo over and over.
Quote:
Originally Posted by dan6526 View Post
I distinctly see six beams fire per broadside myself too. Sometimes FaW will not want to fire all of the phasers, but I can manually select them all. My weapon power gets down to just above 50% power levels too so it's not weapon power being the problem.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Naekuh View Post
yeah if i dont have the required weapon power then yes... i dont see all of them firing.

But on ARiS, power allocation problems is not a possibility unless i get drained by something.

Like others im running 6... with a front torp, and rear tric mine... ive seen all 6 light up on a side barage.
You are all aware that a BA and a DBA fires a 3 shot blase as its initial volley of damage yes? but it is still 1 weapon firing.

it is a game mechanic, only 4 energy weapons will fire at once, then rotation begins.

Now, understanding "salvo" is a large term, you can do the test I described above and you can watch the rotation or "salvo" if you like of the weapons (with no FAW buff) run through its rotation. only 4 weapons fire at a time. This is true for turrents, beams, cannons.

Now as one weapon system powers down, you will see the next weapon system kick in, several patches ago they removed the power drain, so when a weapon finishes firing, it replaces all of the power it used back into the power block. When you have similar weapons, you will watch a weapon system kick in as the other powers down, this aludes to the you seeing the "6" weapons firing, as they each get a turn in the sequence. Also the multiple beams that a BA tosses out that can seem confusing as well.

I personall run on all my cruisers 2 DBA, 4 BA, 2 Torps. I like that setup best. Some prefer the 6 BA, 2 torp set, and some the 8 BA set with no torps and they use Beam Overload and Fire at will to augement their their output. Still does not change the fact, with no powers to change base firing, only 4 weapons will fire at at time.

Understanding the weapon firing sequence is the key to making more damaging ships. It really is based on how you build your setup to take advantage of that. 8 beam boats use to be awesome things, but because of them being OP, this base mechanic was put in place to eliminate that from PVP to rebalance them. Then along came Fire at Will (FAW) and the beam monster came back. Still under normal conditions, all weapons systems included only 4 will fire at once. Its the key to the salvo that matters, as weapons will sequentially follow suit as othes go in cool down.

But you dont have to to take my word for it, do testing yourself. Come to you own conclusions, note the weapon firing, and the amount of energy your loosing from your max. just do the math. *shrug*

I pointed this out due to why escorts overload weapons to a facing to make best use of other weapon cooldowns to get max damage. Cruisers can do the same thing, but there are many more variables that can come into play.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 18
09-08-2011, 10:30 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mongoson View Post
You are all aware that a BA and a DBA fires a 3 shot blase as its initial volley of damage yes? but it is still 1 weapon firing.

it is a game mechanic, only 4 energy weapons will fire at once, then rotation begins.

Now, understanding "salvo" is a large term, you can do the test I described above and you can watch the rotation or "salvo" if you like of the weapons (with no FAW buff) run through its rotation. only 4 weapons fire at a time. This is true for turrents, beams, cannons.

Now as one weapon system powers down, you will see the next weapon system kick in, several patches ago they removed the power drain, so when a weapon finishes firing, it replaces all of the power it used back into the power block. When you have similar weapons, you will watch a weapon system kick in as the other powers down, this aludes to the you seeing the "6" weapons firing, as they each get a turn in the sequence. Also the multiple beams that a BA tosses out that can seem confusing as well.

I personall run on all my cruisers 2 DBA, 4 BA, 2 Torps. I like that setup best. Some prefer the 6 BA, 2 torp set, and some the 8 BA set with no torps and they use Beam Overload and Fire at will to augement their their output. Still does not change the fact, with no powers to change base firing, only 4 weapons will fire at at time.

Understanding the weapon firing sequence is the key to making more damaging ships. It really is based on how you build your setup to take advantage of that. 8 beam boats use to be awesome things, but because of them being OP, this base mechanic was put in place to eliminate that from PVP to rebalance them. Then along came Fire at Will (FAW) and the beam monster came back. Still under normal conditions, all weapons systems included only 4 will fire at once. Its the key to the salvo that matters, as weapons will sequentially follow suit as othes go in cool down.

But you dont have to to take my word for it, do testing yourself. Come to you own conclusions, note the weapon firing, and the amount of energy your loosing from your max. just do the math. *shrug*

I pointed this out due to why escorts overload weapons to a facing to make best use of other weapon cooldowns to get max damage. Cruisers can do the same thing, but there are many more variables that can come into play.
Goof info Mongoson, any good tutorial about this here?

thank you!
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 19
09-08-2011, 11:08 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by NohMalkiri
^ This.

I've flown a Cruiser for years. Trust me, I know I can fire all beams at once. It's quite devastating with supporting consoles, max weapon power and EPS or Nadion running. That's why it's such a viable build for an Engineer Cruiser (6-8).

http://www.youtube.com/user/greatlor...27/Ol3mdmVFLYM - This is pretty much the only video I have of Veritas in PvP. You'll see my Cruiser at 7:33-7:40 firing all it's beams between two targets as I swap targets and again at 7:55-8:10 in the top of the frame. I think I'm running 6 beams + 2 Chroniton mines.
that is because you use FAW.
still does not change the fact the game mechanic is set 4 energy weapons firing at once. *shrug* that is the base mechanic.

you can use Bridge Officers powers to change this, Such as FAW, which is the only way you can attack 2 targets at once, but without it, on a regular fire pattern, only 4 energy weapons will fire at once and then begin cycling through to the next weapon.

Once you understand this, you can plan basic mechanics and attack powers, stacking and the like.

I think you all are thinking only 4 weapons firing period. I do not think you all are understanding a basic game mechanic that is being explained.

This is why I point this out. SImply building a 6 BA or 8 BA will not make you do the things that some are claiming here. You will need the base game BO powers to make use of those setting and some of the things that are being described. I have played since closed beta, I mention this to help folks understand the base of the attack mechanic, you can build from that with BO powers, mechanics and weapon sets.

Still, again you dont have to take my word for it. *shrugs* Do your own testing, as I have done since closed beta.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 20
09-08-2011, 11:35 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brakner View Post
http://forums.startrekonline.com/arc.../t-114019.html

Toggle max is the fire time of a skill. What happens when you fire a beam weapon is it fires for 4 seconds or 4 max after that it turns the toggle off and has to recharge for 1 second. You will notice this on all attacks that have a duration like attack. Tachyon beam fires for 3.6 second or toggle 3.6 max, extend shields unless they changed it recently was toggle 30 max or 30 seconds.


From another post


This is not entirely true. Toggle max is the maximum amount of time that weapon or skill will fire. In this case all Beams have a toggle max 4 or they fire for 4 seconds per salvo. Single and Dual Cannons, and Turrets have a toggle max 2 or they fire for 2 seconds per salvo. While Dual Heavy Cannons have toggle max one and only fire for one second. Extend Shield skill has a toggle max of 30 last I looked meaning it will continue to fire pulses for 30 seconds then shut off. Recharge time of all toggles doesn't kick in till after the toggle turns off.

All Beams and Turrets can fire at all times unless you don't have the weapon power to fire them even if you could equip 20 they would all fire.

.



These are from the forums going back to last year, I did a search and found dozens of threads with the same explanation in each. the Toggle number is the amount of time the weapon fires before you need to activate it again this includes its cooldown.
Thank you! I'll correct that with the folks who gave me the info int he first place. Cheers
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