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Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 11
09-12-2011, 03:54 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Aisling
Oh great, forum trolls are blaming Han Solo for killing MMOs... first Greedo in the Cantina, now MMOs.

WHEN WILL IT END, SOLO!? When will your blood thirst be abated!?
*SPLORF* You win, have this shiny Internet. It makes the Kessel Run in under 10 parsecs!
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 12
09-12-2011, 03:58 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by V-Mink
*SPLORF* You win, have this shiny Internet. It makes the Kessel Run in under 10 parsecs!
*hands Mink a towel* <,< hehe
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 13
09-12-2011, 04:54 PM
While I agree with many of the guys points, you will never get the new age MMO player to agree to any of it. The day of the sandbox has come and gone, now you just hop on a theme park and play till it gets old and then hop onto the next one. It is the "now" mentality that is largely to blame.

Modern MMOs are what they are. Would I play something like UO, AC, or SWG again? sure if there was a community to support it, but there seems to be no developers that want to cater to that niche market, and that (while sad it may be) is what we are, a small market share that may never get supported.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 14
09-12-2011, 05:24 PM
Well I for one am glad to see the day's of forced grouping to get anything done in an MMO gone. Or to get the best gear. Hopefully for good. While I do miss the huge sandbox that was SWG pre-NGE. It always bothered me that I had to be grouped to get some of the better gear and missions done. It was so limiting and really ruined some of my fun.

At least in STO I have the option of whether or not I want to group up with people, due to real life issue's as others have mentioned. I really do not have the time to LFG just to go on one or two missions. Now I can log on, get what I want to get done, done and feel like I actually accomplished something and log back out. No muss no fuss and not have to worry about hurting the team I may happen to be on due to those RL issue's that crop up at any given moment.

I play STO not because it's an MMO, (could care less about that part), but because it's an RPG set in the Star Trek universe, one of my favorite Sci-Fi settings. I'll be playing SWTOR for the exact same reasons when it is released later this year. Not because it's an MMO but because it's Star Wars and like STO it sounds like I will be able to play it my way and at my own pace..........PERFECTION!!!
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 15
09-12-2011, 05:59 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by wildcard454 View Post
Well I for one am glad to see the day's of forced grouping to get anything done in an MMO gone. Or to get the best gear. Hopefully for good. While I do miss the huge sandbox that was SWG pre-NGE. It always bothered me that I had to be grouped to get some of the better gear and missions done. It was so limiting and really ruined some of my fun.

At least in STO I have the option of whether or not I want to group up with people, due to real life issue's as others have mentioned. I really do not have the time to LFG just to go on one or two missions. Now I can log on, get what I want to get done, done and feel like I actually accomplished something and log back out. No muss no fuss and not have to worry about hurting the team I may happen to be on due to those RL issue's that crop up at any given moment.

I play STO not because it's an MMO, (could care less about that part), but because it's an RPG set in the Star Trek universe, one of my favorite Sci-Fi settings. I'll be playing SWTOR for the exact same reasons when it is released later this year. Not because it's an MMO but because it's Star Wars and like STO it sounds like I will be able to play it my way and at my own pace..........PERFECTION!!!
Pre-NGE SWG the best paying missions where solo-able, in fact I think SWG was one of the most solo friendly games I had played up to that point. There really was no "Raid" or what is now looked at as endgame back then. Get a good set of composite, doc buffs and go run Dant missions all afternoon. make a fortune so you could buy your krayt pearl scatter pistol so I could go kill some Jedi (now Jedi Hunting in the early days was a group affair:p)
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 16
09-12-2011, 06:06 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Aisling
Oh great, forum trolls are blaming Han Solo for killing MMOs... first Greedo in the Cantina, now MMOs.

WHEN WILL IT END, SOLO!? When will your blood thirst be abated!?
Sigh - poor Greedo. Never had a chance.

Good stuff.

On-topic: Solo-able is good. I think a lot of us are here because we want to play a Trek game. The only option we currently have is STO. If it made me team up more than it already does, they'd lose my business.

Thanks,
Captain Anti-Social
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 17
09-12-2011, 06:06 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Igax View Post
Pre-NGE SWG the best paying missions where solo-able, in fact I think SWG was one of the most solo friendly games I had played up to that point. There really was no "Raid" or what is now looked at as endgame back then. Get a good set of composite, doc buffs and go run Dant missions all afternoon. make a fortune so you could buy your krayt pearl scatter pistol so I could go kill some Jedi (now Jedi Hunting in the early days was a group affair:p)
Not true, there was a raid into the DEATH WATCH bunker for the Mando Armour, there was a raid on a Star Destroyer, cannot remember what it was for. The Jedi Trials were impossible unless you were grouped.

The missions on Kash and Mustafar where also impossible to complete without a group. There was one that you did for the ghost of Obi-Wan that was really tough.

I think you are thinking about the missions you got from terminals, those were pushovers, but some of the higher level missions that dealt with the story of the game, you had to be grouped for the most part to get them done. You could solo some parts to be sure, but they were certainly not what I would call solo friendly.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 18
09-12-2011, 06:16 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by wildcard454 View Post
Not true, there was a raid into the DEATH WATCH bunker for the Mando Armour, there was a raid on a Star Destroyer, cannot remember what it was for. The Jedi Trials were impossible unless you were grouped.

The missions on Kash and Mustafar where also impossible to complete without a group. There was one that you did for the ghost of Obi-Wan that was really tough.

I think you are thinking about the missions you got from terminals, those were pushovers, but some of the higher level missions that dealt with the story of the game, you had to be grouped for the most part to get them done. You could solo some parts to be sure, but they were certainly not what I would call solo friendly.
As for the Star dsestroyer, I am not 100% sure but I think those are post NGE.

Mustafar was for Sure post NGE, and Kash was post CU. So, pre CU, I am not even really sure about the Kash missions as I never really did them, there was no real group content.

The only time I recall ever really needing a group pre JTS was when a friend wanted a krayt pearl or some other crafting material.... or we wanted to go Rancor hunting, and even then those could almost be soloed as well (the Rancors, well.... if pulled right).
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 19
09-12-2011, 07:09 PM
The Heroic Encounter "Star Destroyer" was much later after the NGE.

When you think about it, at what point do you cross the line and are nolonger an MMO but nothing more then a glorified singleplayer game?

Case and point, for all the players that are adverse/or never join a group, that only play 15 minutes a day or even a week, who never join a fleet, couldn't STO really be just a singleplayer Star Trek game? One with downloadable expansions like Dragon Age instead of paying 15 bucks a month for server access, you just buy the game like any other single player game and play to your hearts content. The money you save, you just buy the extra fluff.

Once upon a time there were single player games. Then MMO's came along which were considered group player games. The Group/Community ideals of the original MMO weren't just about the gear, they weren't just about the raids. It was about exploring and finding "cool places" with friends, it was about building cities or guild halls and decorating them together. It was about helping and celebrating the successes of your fellow gamers. It was providing entertainment for your fellow gamers, and making your own adventurers. It was the unexplainable enjoyment , that the original MMO players derived from the success of not only themselves but their teammates.

The problem was singleplayer minded gamers stumbled into these worlds and became confused.
"How can you play a video game that requires other people?" "How can I be the hero, if I must work with others?". They didn't want to wait, they didnt want to group. What they wanted was a singleplayer game in whatever setting the game was based in, just not the people.

Its not that original MMO players want a return to the the old days, its that they wanted to see them built upon. There could have been room for both Solo and Group content. There can be room for simplistic and complicated game play. There can be room for world building, and casual adventure. The issue is when, a new MMO company hamstrings itself through their game engine, and approach, where they only cater to a certain type of player. One that no matter how much you try to appease, they will be gone the minute the next new release comes out.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 20
09-12-2011, 08:00 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lodar-Duggs
The Heroic Encounter "Star Destroyer" was much later after the NGE.

*Snip*

Its not that original MMO players want a return to the the old days, its that they wanted to see them built upon. There could have been room for both Solo and Group content. There can be room for simplistic and complicated game play. There can be room for world building, and casual adventure. The issue is when, a new MMO company hamstrings itself through their game engine, and approach, where they only cater to a certain type of player. One that no matter how much you try to appease, they will be gone the minute the next new release comes out.
I thought all the heroic stuff was well after NGE, I remember there being nothing and no direction in SWG in the beginning, I really enjoyed it though, so not a complaint. Just feel it was one of the big ones that started the push toward solo play but yet, oddly enough, still encouraged a community with its diverse class system and noncombat and non crafting classes.


I have a hard time seeing any MMO pull off the "make solo and group/raiders happy at the same time". Some have tried, EQ2 was one that claimed you "COULD" solo but group play was encouraged. WOW was one that went the other extreme, I mean in most instances for the lvl grind grouping with a pug only slowed me down, which I have found in just about every MMO out these days. *** I could lvl way faster alone all the way to the top. STO was the same, quicker and easier to lvl up alone, grouping in a pug only slowed one down. Rift seemed very solo easy up to about the last tier of lvls. And I really expect TOR to be a solo MMO lovers dream come true, single player game with a chat system.
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