Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 101
09-19-2011, 06:54 PM
Reduce the durations and fix the clearing
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 102
09-19-2011, 07:09 PM
Honestly, now that we know a fix for clearing it is in the pipe, I think most of us would be happy with that and a hard resistance (like with stuns) after it's cleared/expired.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 103
09-19-2011, 07:32 PM
For scramble sensors how about a change in the mechanic in how it works.

Why not have scramble sensors reduce the accuracy of your weapons.

For being specced into Operations, Sensors, Sensor Array and Sensor Probes the debuff could look like this.

Level 1 -10% Accuracy for 6 seconds
Level 2 -20% Accuracy for 12 seconds
Level 3 -30% Accuracy for 18 seconds

Without being specced into them

Level 1 -6% Accuracy for 3 seconds
Level 2 -12% Accuracy for 6 seconds
Level 3 -18% Accuracy for 10 seconds

You could still target normally without it jumping all over the place and you could still cleanse yourself. You would not have to change the effect of it scrambling targets in the blast radius.

Science team would clear the debuff as normal or if they change the mechanic of tactical team to give you an accuracy bonus it would reduce the debuff effect.

Disclaimer. I am not a hard core pvper. However I do pvp everyday, that I can. I have felt the effects of chain scrambles in pvp and having my abilities misfire during a game makes me want to bite the heads of chickens.

Proposed Tactical Team changes. I am not to sure on this mechanic. Flying my raptor, I rely on two copies of this, 1 and 2. However I would be willing to change if they made TT3 worth while to my survivability
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 104
09-19-2011, 07:33 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Husanak View Post
Of course if your Fire on my mark.... worked because people where not spamming Tac team that can remove it and prevent it for 10 seconds... and if you where able to use Attack Pattern Beta again... perhaps your targets would die before you got in so much trouble.
I think that this would be the best thing about separating the distribute shield effect from Tac team. That and lowering the time to 5 seconds. It would open more windows for a spike to get in.


As for a replacement for the distribute shield effect I vote for a boost to an attack pattern currently active, as was suggested earlier in the thread. That would allow an improvement of an attack buff (APB), a defense de-buff (APD) or a defensive buff (APO) depending on the situation.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
Quote:
Originally Posted by Husanak View Post
I don't think adding more skills to the game is nerfing anything. It was the entwining of basicly two skills that has caused the issue we have now... which is a tac team that is basicly a required skill.

I think you can view this as an omission by Cryptic that Tac team is in fact a bit OP as it really is two skills in one.

They also havn't stated exactly what this new skill will be in total... only that it will be Tactical it will start at Ensign and will include a shield distribution mechanic.

Coupling Shield heals with resists and cleanses has sort have been something they have been moving away from for a long time... Sci team and Engi team both lost thier resist numbers long ago as it was viewed as OP and those resists where spun into other powers.

This change to tac team seems pretty logical when we look at that past history of Team Skill changes.

Tac team can still include a new mechanic as it was underpowered before... and the new tac shield skill.... depending on level may end up being much better then the tac team component now.

Nerf... hardly. So far I like what they are thinking there is a nice symmetry to the idea.
You can't make a skill a subset of the previous skill without it by definition being less than the set. Since you guys have complained about the shield redistribution being op, it's a cinch that the "new" skill (which is actually just half of the old skill) will not be buffed; ie it will not have a longer duration or a better function. It is, by anyone's definition, only part of TT, which means splitting it off is a big nerf. I don't see how that is in dispute. You can say TT was so OP that it had to be split, which I humbly disagree, especially for pve, but splitting the skill in half does make it a nerf of perhaps 50% of it's previous power. Maybe you're right in that they'll add something to the shield dist skill to make it not a huge nerf; we don't know anything in particular about that proposed skill yet.

TT will apparently get a new mechanic to bring it into line with the sci and eng team skills. It would have to be fairly powerful to make it not a huge nerf when it loses it's best part of its functionality; ie the shield dist. I still say acc is only useful in pvp so I hope it's not the new addition to TT. This nerf is for pvp primarily so it should not be pve that takes the biggest hit from this change. If anything, give TT something that benefits pve more than pvp, like sensor analysis did for sci.

This isn't a terrible thing...yet. The devil is in the details. But it's clear that a subset < the whole set it came from. That's a nerf in my book.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
Quote:
Originally Posted by SteveHale View Post
Scramble Sensors:
I am concerned that a hard cap might have an unpleasant side effect of an even greater spam explosion. While it may be necessary, assuming a radius of effect reduction isn't possible (what is the radius again anyway?), can it be bumped up to 10 or 15 targets? Is there any way to give effect priority to a player ship or NPC over something like mines?

Right now, if Blue Team scrambles Red Team, Red Team can see anyone who is currently cloaked on Blue Team. Has this also been addressed?

Tactical Team:
The duration reduction from 10 to 5 seconds is going to be great for for Boarding Parties, Tactical Debuffs, and alpha strikes in general. If the shield redistribution is to be fixed it would be nice to see a pretty significant, and skill point dependent, boost to something like critical severity, chance or accuracy. I'm not sure just how much the current numbers translate to those things but something more obvious might be nice. Tactical Team still remains a powerful debuff remover without being something you spam just because every time is the right time to have it active.

Shield Redistribution:
I'm not really sure that this has to be converted into an entirely separate ability but if it is I hope that some of the existing issues are addressed. The redistribution rate is just too efficient for too long and makes it almost mandatory. I wouldn't be opposed to keeping it if it were reduced and also more dependent upon skill points.

Thank you for taking these things seriously. Any of your changes are a good step in the right direction. If we can get some clarification on some of them and maybe consider a few modifications things could be great.
They're already splitting off the shield dist from TT and making it its own skill. That makes it half of the power of TT already. Nerfing it even farther just makes it worthless in my opinion. Unless of course they add something extra to it like they're going to do to TT.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 107
09-19-2011, 08:34 PM
Split Tac Team into two powers.

Tac Team: 5 second debuff cleanse, 5 second shield resistance debuff to anything that your weapons hit (like beta/delta) 10% lvl 1, 15% lvl 2, 20% lvl 3.

Shield Balance: 10 second buff to shield balancing (self target only, does NOT auto-balance shields) 2x lvl 1, 3x lvl 2, 4x lvl 3.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 108
09-19-2011, 08:56 PM
Change to Tactical team.. Perhaps instead of the shield ability it does, it would reduce cool down or global cool down of Weapon fireing for 10 seconds. Kind of like removing the Global Cool down on weapons or sometihing..

New Skill (Maybe a new Attack Pattern)

Gives your weapons the ability to weaken the warp field of your target, causing them to lose speed and accuracy to their weapons due to the sudden changes in speed.

Game effect: Energy Weapons cause Speed reduction and an Accuracy penality to each target they strike for 5 seconds, but can be reapplied during the duration.
(This would basically copy how Attack Pattern Beta works, but affecting different stats. Where Attack Pattern Beta affects Damage resistance, this would affect Ship speed and Accuracy)

Rank 1: -5% Speed, -3% Acc
Rank 2: -10% Speed, -6% Acc
Rank 3: -20% Speed, -12% Acc

This would give another reason to keep Tactical team's clear ability..
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 109
09-19-2011, 09:07 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shakkar View Post
You can't make a skill a subset of the previous skill without it by definition being less than the set. Since you guys have complained about the shield redistribution being op, it's a cinch that the "new" skill (which is actually just half of the old skill) will not be buffed; ie it will not have a longer duration or a better function. It is, by anyone's definition, only part of TT, which means splitting it off is a big nerf. I don't see how that is in dispute. You can say TT was so OP that it had to be split, which I humbly disagree, especially for pve, but splitting the skill in half does make it a nerf of perhaps 50% of it's previous power. Maybe you're right in that they'll add something to the shield dist skill to make it not a huge nerf; we don't know anything in particular about that proposed skill yet.

TT will apparently get a new mechanic to bring it into line with the sci and eng team skills. It would have to be fairly powerful to make it not a huge nerf when it loses it's best part of its functionality; ie the shield dist. I still say acc is only useful in pvp so I hope it's not the new addition to TT. This nerf is for pvp primarily so it should not be pve that takes the biggest hit from this change. If anything, give TT something that benefits pve more than pvp, like sensor analysis did for sci.

This isn't a terrible thing...yet. The devil is in the details. But it's clear that a subset < the whole set it came from. That's a nerf in my book.
I would not expect them too add anything to do with ACC to tac team... they sort of said they where looking for ideas that would not add to the skills offensive capabilities. Adding ACC falls under that I would think.

I guess I just consider Nerf to be a bad word... and honestly I don't see unifying the way the skills work in general as a bad thing... even if something needs to be reduced in strength somewhat... I'm sorry its hard to argue that tac team is not better then sci and engi team, whos only real major use is debuff clearing.

On the new shield skill... honestly if you where given a 10 second auto rebalance at ensign level that lasts the same length 10 seconds... yes that could seem like a nerf... however if the higher levels 2 and 3 lasted longer it would hardly be a nerf.

I do see where your coming from... I just think its sort of a needed change. I do think that arguing tac team as not being "too good" is the wrong side of the argument.

We are talking each other in circles as usual, I guess we disagree somewhat.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 110
09-19-2011, 09:14 PM
................


I'd say, leave Tactical Teams Shield distrubution duration at 10 seconds.
Nerf the 'strength' of the distribution as a whole, give escorts a bonus to this strenght.
Furthermore the strength should be dependent on skillpoint investment in lets say, Tactical team leader, and rank. Remove the useless Energy Weapons/Projectiles training buff and add +5/10 accuracy to Rank I and +10 for every rank increase.

This would somewhat balance out the professions in this game against Science Online and Cruiser Online.
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