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Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 31
10-04-2011, 02:14 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rehpic
We have tuned the difficulty of some of the problem encounters, including the one in Stop the Signal. This change will likely be in a patch later this week. Let us know how it works after the change, and if you find any of the other episodes excessively difficult.
That doesn't really address the problem present though.

When all missions are progression-locked, and you have to follow a specific question chain... what happens when there's a showstopper bug? Currently you can skip that mission and move on, then come back to it later when it's fixed if you so choose.

Now?

Let's say you have ten missions in the chain. You have to complete each mission to move onto the next. It proceeds like this:
A -> B -> C -> D -> E -> F -> G -> H -> I -> J
Unfortunately mission B is broken. Maybe a trigger doesn't work and a boss won't spawn, thus making it impossible to complete.

You now can't finish B, nor can you move onto C, D, E, F, G, H, I, nor J. That bug in mission B just made 90% of the missions unplayable.

Unless you can guarantee to never release another showstopper bug ever again you can't honestly think progression-locking missions is a good idea.

And this isn't even addressing the fact that people want more freedom in how they progress, not less.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 32
10-04-2011, 02:31 PM
For those stuck on Stop the Signal, here's a return to the old standby, as used by those of us who operated during the open beta (those of you who were there during or before will already know this, so ignore or modify as needed )

First - run through the entire mission solo.

Yes, you're probably going to die at the Undine dreadnought, but you might as well give it the old try, for forms sake.

Dead yet?
If not, then congratulations.
If yes, then welcome to what the rest of us had to do during the beta.
You've finished the earlier content, so you won't find any issue with this next bit.
Group up, get about 3-5 of you to be sure you have "superior numbers", get in there and whomp the blinking thing!

That's what we had to do during beta before the issue was fixed, and it still works here.
Keep one or two folks back to clobber the undine frigs, but mostly, just whomp the dread.
It'll burn fast.
However, don't go into the earlier parts of the mission in a group, or the AI *will* curbstomp you. I found myself on the recieving end of this during open beta. Not a fun experience. =/
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 33
10-04-2011, 02:39 PM
[quote=Dr.Mox]The recent trouble with Stop the Signal highlights an incredible weakness in the gameplay structure offered on tribble f2p build atm.

It would appear to me that if this remains the way it is then Cryptic is potentialyl taking a huge risk on discontent if a bug appears in any episodic chain content that prevents the chain advancing forward due to not being able to complete the episode as this severly stunts the leveling of the player and their options to level when there is a block in the chain.

I can see new players getting really confussed and the old guard even more grumpy. ^^

More flexibility needed on progression rather than railway linear high risk change. Unless ofc Cryptic can guarantee bug free episodic chains whenever a new build is delivered onto Holo.

Apologies to all and sundry "use the search" pedantic grumpy folks if someone has already commented about this, glad your reading my comments anyways. :p[/QUOTE

I agree it did seem a bit difficult to defeat the battleship(I assume that is what you are talking about) but it seemed that way on Holodeck with little light cruiser as well. Though I'm wondering if it was made hard intentionally. I kept getting fracked by it and gave up. Then joined up with 4 other people, and we kicked the crap out it in seconds. I wonder if cryptic is going to make it so you are forced to team-up like in the STFs. Just an observation.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 34
10-04-2011, 02:44 PM
My main issue is and it could strictly be because this is beta and will be fixed on Holodeck, but I didn't like the fact that I have to take a timeout from the Klingon progression missions and am forced to do the Devidian missions before continuing on. If there was a way to skip them, I couldn't find it. The devs shouldn't have the featured series missions forced into the game play. They should remain optional as they are currently are on Holodeck.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 35
10-04-2011, 04:06 PM
Conceptually speaking, I don't disagree with episodic break downs of missions. It allows you to present stories in a clearly linear fashion, where you can make sure people don't just skip missions or do them in the 'wrong order', especially where dialog refers to actions you've taken in the past.

What I disagree with is the manner in which we've attached episodes together, especially in some unusual groupings.

We see Franklin Drake as part of the Klingon Episode Arc - except we run into him, twice, 'before' the Devidian missions, even though the current progression places him "after".

Once in the Romulan Arc, where he's believed to be a traitor to Starfleet, and then again in the Cardassian Arc, where he does his usual Section 31-ness.

By the time the Devidian missions showed up, it was assumed the majority of the players had done the other content or at the very least all the involvement of him had "Chronologically" passed. But with F2P, you have players that haven't done these missions, which causes some continuity problems.

The Devidian missions should *definitely* be removed from the greater chain, and attached to their own "Devidian" Chain. While we're at it, we may want to reconsider how the Romulan Arc integrates the Remans into it.

Actually, Featured Episodes as a whole are kind of problematic. I am only lt. Cmdr 6 as of this writing, but it seems I can not access *any* of the Featured Episode content except the Klingon/Devidian stuff which I am in the middle of doing.

Has the nature of Features Episodes changed? Are we no longer doing them, and simply referring to them as just "Episodes" which act as mini-expansion packs? If so, does that means that you no longer get bonus items for doing the Episodes before a new Episode launches? And if that is the case, should you re-enable the old bonus content from the old episodes?

Fundamentally speaking, I understand people's concerns, but I think that the Episodes should be gated by levels of progression, rather than a single overwhelming linear arc.

Since the missions scale to your level, anyway, there's no reason why you should have to do them in order once you're 'level appropriate'.

Don't care about the Klingon Arcs? Just do patrols/explors/PVP. Quickly leveled up past Cardassian content? Just go do the Featured Episodes you skipped before, and unlock the Borg Content.

This gives people the ability to progress through all the arcs, or 'skip' through content without being tied to it, and also allows people to play the Featured Episodes anytime they wish.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
Did you watch the dialog closely in "Under the Cover of Night"? It's changed. It isn't Drake being sent into deep cover in Rom space anymore, it's some Vulcan girl. And she mentions in the hail that they have a 'mutual friend' in Drake. I'd wondered how they were gonna cover that myself, laughed just a little during that mission.



Quote:
Originally Posted by VulcanPhsyco
I agree that there needs to be a way to 'skip' broken, or just plain unpleasant missions (I'm looking at YOU taskforce Hipocrattes). But even with that, the interface IS nicer than what was in before.
Task Force Hippocrates doesn't strike me as being so bad, just boring. Divide et Impeum, however... back when they were 'remastering' episodes (and in truth, it's terrible form that ALL aren't remastered more before F2P, but I don't want them holding up other content for that), That was THE single most voted episode as "needing a fix", for forcing your captain to be a stupid fracking idiot without ANY recourse to ending it. Whoever wrote that mission, I hope they were dismissed form mission writing. Completely. That is just a form of suffering.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Elnaith View Post
You should probably add the last mission of the Devidian Series to it. Destroying the Comet takes a toll on you and your crew. I did this in a T2 Escort and died 5 times before I was done.
In addition you should add some of the Phantasm /Eidolons which will one shot you on ground.
All these will be huge problem for new starters and will raise nothing but frustration.
This, seriously. But I'm almost of two minds about it. One line of thought says "nerf the Phantasms/Eidolons and the 23rd century Starfleeters" (who also seem to kill you nearly instantly, since they evidently have blue versions of the Type 2 that are at a higher level than yours, and rip right through your 25th century shields), and another line of thought that wonders if they're not meant to be that way, for the gear we get from some of the missions. The 23rd century Starfleeters do seem more tolerable when I can get retrofit fore and aft phasers (Heck, I just did the mission 5 times in the last two days, for that).

The main things I'd like to see looked at in the devidian series are:
  1. The Multi-Spectral Shield from Skirmish. It seems to not be reducing damage from Devidian attacks, at all.
  2. Night of the Comet and the Bar Fight (Possibly Fixed) - I haven't run into it in the tribble build, so I'm wondering if it wasn't adjusted, but on the main game at least, having the bar fight people turn unkillable can be a HUGE halting error, because either the devidians don't show up, or if they do, your BOffs get distracted by the other fight. Either way, you die so many times that most people will give up on it. (Had that happen repeatedly with Kishera, I like the TOS phasers and wanted to outfit my whole landing party with them)
  3. The Anti-Proton rifle. I don't know if it's me, or not, but it appears to be less damage, or no more damage, a lot of the time, than other weapons do to the Devidians. And that isn't good for what is supposed to SPECIFICALLY be an anti-devidian weapon.
  4. The comet sequence is taxing on the crew and the one going through it. I had no idea that 23rd century weapons could do so much to a 25th century ship! Oh wait, that's because they probably shouldn't be able to. Duh. :p I'd assume SOME form of power output masking is used, so keep everything at full power. :p Still, the big thing to remember with the comet is that you need to destroy the main chunk, beat the D7s, destroy one fragment (destroy shards if possible then), beat the d7's, so on and so forth, and get rid of the final shards before B'vat gets close with his ram attempt.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 37
10-05-2011, 12:22 PM
At first I was liking that they chained the missions. However, after a few days of testing I find it to be a potential gamebreaker, you do lose out on access to gear that is nice to have at early levels. At a minimum, I would pull the FE's from the requirements to progress, but keep the level requirements on them that currently exist on Holodeck. With the new mission scaling, when you run through at higher ranks to gear up again, it will continue to be a challenge, and not a cake walk like it currently is. What happened to the philosophy of multiple paths to level up?
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 38
10-05-2011, 02:10 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by DeWitt_LSF
At first I was liking that they chained the missions. However, after a few days of testing I find it to be a potential gamebreaker, you do lose out on access to gear that is nice to have at early levels. At a minimum, I would pull the FE's from the requirements to progress, but keep the level requirements on them that currently exist on Holodeck. With the new mission scaling, when you run through at higher ranks to gear up again, it will continue to be a challenge, and not a cake walk like it currently is. What happened to the philosophy of multiple paths to level up?
This would also be very nice. Chaining the FEs so the Breen missions don't happen until latelate is counterproductive, I'd like to be getting the gear set along with the Devidian series retrofit phasers.

I'm something of a gear nut, though. I grind through devidian and Breen missions at every new rank, for the reward gear.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 39
10-05-2011, 04:28 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by AuroraKet View Post
This would also be very nice. Chaining the FEs so the Breen missions don't happen until latelate is counterproductive, I'd like to be getting the gear set along with the Devidian series retrofit phasers.

I'm something of a gear nut, though. I grind through devidian and Breen missions at every new rank, for the reward gear.
Well good news is that's easier to do since you can replay from the episode list now.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 40
10-06-2011, 12:54 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hartzilla2007 View Post
Well good news is that's easier to do since you can replay from the episode list now.
There's one minor issue with the episode list replay.

It fails to show when a mission isn't available yet due to having a cooldown. I've clicked missions only to have it do nothing. Once I went in and checked the ready room monitor version of the replays, it mentioned the cooldown still in progress.
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