Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 21
10-17-2011, 03:13 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Leviathan99
It isn't about realism or Trek.

It's about actively trying to NOT make it look so much like space that it disorients people. A surprising number of people get dizzy/sick without visual reference points and others still tend to get lost. So thery made a deliberate change.

Now... DS9 is actually supposed to be set against a purple nebula; they just didn't always have the budget to show it.

http://en.memory-alpha.org/wiki/File...pace_9_CGI.jpg

So the big thing is, it could stand to be toned down and purple.
That is the Denorios belt. It is where they found odo (long before DS9), and where the wormhole is located.

http://en.memory-alpha.org/wiki/Fileenorios_belt.jpg
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 22
10-17-2011, 03:24 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Leviathan99
It isn't about realism or Trek.

It's about actively trying to NOT make it look so much like space that it disorients people. A surprising number of people get dizzy/sick without visual reference points and others still tend to get lost. So thery made a deliberate change.
Visual reference points. You mean like planets, or other ships, or the star in the system you're visiting. A nebula is no sort of visual reference, because nebulae by definition are nebulous. You can't look at a smear of colored gas on the sky layer and say "Now I know which way is UP!" It doesn't work that way.

Besides, STO is not a 3D game. It operates with only 2.5 dimensions which means your ship can't roll or loop. How people can get disoriented playing a 2.5D game still blows my mind.

Fed space instances usually have a bluish nebula on the sky layer. KDF are red. Romulan are neon green. Cardassian, like DS9, are brownish-orange. Borg are lime green. The nebula colors on the sky maps of instances often match the colors of the sector blocks on the map, where those instances are located.

I'm guessing it's a visual aid for mouth-breathers, so they remember which sector block they're in.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Leviathan99
Now... DS9 is actually supposed to be set against a purple nebula; they just didn't always have the budget to show it.

http://en.memory-alpha.org/wiki/File...pace_9_CGI.jpg

So the big thing is, it could stand to be toned down and purple.
That nebula is a distant background object. It wasn't shown on a regular basis because:

A) It's not located in the Bajor system
B) DS9 orbits the parent star of Bajor
C) Due to DS9's orbit, background objects would change throughout the year


IMHO, DS9 and all space zones need to go au natural. Black with a star field. I'm tired of all the comic-book environments in STO. And if realistic is too boring, how about trying to at least be a little closer to the source material?
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 23
10-17-2011, 03:37 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jarnin View Post

That nebula is a distant background object. It wasn't shown on a regular basis because:

A) It's not located in the Bajor system
B) DS9 orbits the parent star of Bajor
C) Due to DS9's orbit, background objects would change throughout the year


IMHO, DS9 and all space zones need to go au natural. Black with a star field. I'm tired of all the comic-book environments in STO. And if realistic is too boring, how about trying to at least be a little closer to the source material?
No DS9 is in this field, and it doesn't move, check my link above, this is not a nebula, but an area of plasma discharge. It depends on the angle that ds9 is shown from as to wether or not you can see this. If you want to talk realsim, the lack if this really kills the realism for me.
Lt. Commander
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# 24
10-17-2011, 04:58 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sollaf View Post
No DS9 is in this field, and it doesn't move, check my link above, this is not a nebula, but an area of plasma discharge.
If that's the Denorious belt, then the artist that depicted it in that rendering did a really good job making it look like a nebula. Belts are rings and they rarely deviate very far from the plane of elliptic.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sollaf View Post
It depends on the angle that ds9 is shown from as to wether or not you can see this.
If you could see it at all, it should look like a feint line across the plane of elliptic, and it should be visible from any side-shot of DS9.
But of course we're talking about a fictional astronomical object. It would be pretty impossible to have a stable ring of plasma orbiting around a sun; solar winds would blow it all away.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sollaf View Post
If you want to talk realsim, the lack if this really kills the realism for me.
When I talk about realism, I mean, "that which is seen in reality". You're talking about canon. Big different there.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 25
10-17-2011, 07:51 PM
I agree that the brown space clouds should be removed and replaced by a subtle map-wide purple cloud effect with a prominent purple nebula to represent the Denorios belt.

The interior should also be re-touched a little more, if not replaced by a whole new interior (after F2P perhaps) that more closely matches the layout and appearance from the series.

I really appreciated the inclusion of the Promenade directory. I posted suggestions for a revamped DS9 in this old thread.



Along the same lines as the brown clouds being replaced by the more appropriate purple clouds/nebula, a similar situation exists at Deep Space K-7.

In both The Original Series, and in Deep Space Nine, K-7 was seen against only a black starfield:

Deep Space K-7 @ Memory-Alpha.org

While in Star Trek Online Deep Space K-7 is now orbiting a ringed green planet in green space:

Deep Space K-7 in Star Trek Online

The system is labeled as Sherman's System, so that tells us the green planet is Sherman's Planet; however, in both TOS and DS9, K-7 is not orbiting a planet, and is said to be "near" Sherman's Planet. Rather than having the planet so close to K-7, perhaps set it off in the distance a bit (not really approachable).



Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 26
10-18-2011, 09:46 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jarnin View Post
If that's the Denorious belt, then the artist that depicted it in that rendering did a really good job making it look like a nebula. Belts are rings and they rarely deviate very far from the plane of elliptic.

If you could see it at all, it should look like a feint line across the plane of elliptic, and it should be visible from any side-shot of DS9.
But of course we're talking about a fictional astronomical object. It would be pretty impossible to have a stable ring of plasma orbiting around a sun; solar winds would blow it all away.


When I talk about realism, I mean, "that which is seen in reality". You're talking about canon. Big different there.
If you watch the opening of DS9 it shows the Belt, wich is stationary on once seide of the station. That is why the viewing angle matters. Also remember the Denorious belt is artificial, so the laws of spatial mechanics do not apply to it (It was created by the wormhole aliens, or profits depending on who you ask). When I talk realism in STO I am talking Canon, to me they are one in the same, I want what I see on screen to be reflected in the game, I just don't go off on a bender about. However if they are going to change DS9, then I want them to reflect the Denorious belt, not just black out the starfield.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 27
10-18-2011, 11:42 AM
The changes to DS9 are very nice though it is a shame it hasn't been resized 'yet' someday maybe

As for the exterior the definitely need to get rid of that horrible brown/yellow Nebula and replace it with a more clear black starfield with the Denorious belt off to one side of the station, preferably behind and to the left of the station from where you warp in.

Edit: Also I just re-watched the DS9 Opening and STO is also missing the comet that goes past http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7UVqE...eature=related would make a nice little touch, they could even take the comet from the Dividian series and use that as it has a blue trail coming off it
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Join Date: Dec 2007
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# 28
10-18-2011, 02:23 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by UFP_Dodgers View Post
The changes to DS9 are very nice though it is a shame it hasn't been resized 'yet' someday maybe

As for the exterior the definitely need to get rid of that horrible brown/yellow Nebula and replace it with a more clear black starfield with the Denorious belt off to one side of the station, preferably behind and to the left of the station from where you warp in.

Edit: Also I just re-watched the DS9 Opening and STO is also missing the comet that goes past http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7UVqE...eature=related would make a nice little touch, they could even take the comet from the Dividian series and use that as it has a blue trail coming off it
The comet orbits Bajor on a 5 year cycle (I forget the epsiode they mention that in.) Maybe in the picture of Bajor in Sector space they could show a little comet.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 29 Ds9-2409
10-20-2011, 05:40 AM
After wondering around DS9 and taking in all the improvements to the interior I really do love it now (even if it's out of scale), however there is one thing that I think spoils it. No not the fact that the Bank should be 'on' the Promenade instead of an airlock or the shipyard being in a similarly odd place, what am talking about it the Crew of DS9 itself.

Yes the Crew or more importantly there Uniform, just look at Captain James Kurtland http://i.imgur.com/xQGpx.jpg he looks so dull and out of place, in fact all the crew of DS9 are in need of a make over so that the look the part and have a similar uniform.

So I would make a suggestion to the Devs to change all the crew uniforms on DS9 (or at least those in Ops) to what I like to call the DS9-2409 Uniform http://i.imgur.com/vfhya.jpg it would complete the look and feel of DS9 I think

Oh and one tiny little thing the Vulcan Tailor in a Bajoran Uniform http://i.imgur.com/YXEzp.jpg
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 30
10-20-2011, 07:01 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by UFP_Dodgers View Post
After wondering around DS9 and taking in all the improvements to the interior I really do love it now (even if it's out of scale), however there is one thing that I think spoils it. No not the fact that the Bank should be 'on' the Promenade instead of an airlock or the shipyard being in a similarly odd place, what am talking about it the Crew of DS9 itself.

Yes the Crew or more importantly there Uniform, just look at Captain James Kurtland http://i.imgur.com/xQGpx.jpg he looks so dull and out of place, in fact all the crew of DS9 are in need of a make over so that the look the part and have a similar uniform.

So I would make a suggestion to the Devs to change all the crew uniforms on DS9 (or at least those in Ops) to what I like to call the DS9-2409 Uniform http://i.imgur.com/vfhya.jpg it would complete the look and feel of DS9 I think

Oh and one tiny little thing the Vulcan Tailor in a Bajoran Uniform http://i.imgur.com/YXEzp.jpg
That too, the random uniforms that are poorly colored ruins the Starfleet feel to me. And I still really think they should add the security room where Odo was always stationed....including the prison cells. By the way, if Klingon players get access to the DS9 Featured Episodes. Then do Klingons also get full access to the station as a social zone?
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