Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 31
11-02-2011, 10:32 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Esquire View Post
That's part of the gamble, in my book.

LA did watch SOE's NGE and went directly to Bioware 1 month later (after the NGE) to start talks for SW:TOR. CBS is already licencing other ST games now and not putting their eggs all in 1 basket so I see no real reason they would even hesitate if they believe ST:O will not be as profitable and/or is not doing the IP credit as they're being told it will be.

As with LA, I doubt CBS will have any qualms about taking down the entire game when they believe it is time, also.
With the NGE - myou forget ONE important fact:

Lucas Arts DEMANDED SOE do the NGE - and Lucas Arts then spect a FORTUNE in TV advertising and other promotions for 3 months starting in November of 2005. They gave SWG another six months to improve; and when that didn't happen - Lucas Arts went to BioWare and said, "Okay, SWKotoR is popular amd we hear players saying 'this should have been the Star Wars MMO' - so, heres a buttload of money, go make an MMO.'

So, it's a VERY different situation from what occured with the NGE in SWG. Also, as long as CBS see a steady revenue stream, and Cryptic pays the licensing fee; CBS won't bat an eye. They were consulted and most likely don't care what the revenue generation model is - as long as their income from the game doesn't suffer. Cryptic still has to run things by CBS for approval - and per a recent interview by Kestrel on the Priority One podcast.

Make no mistake, I'm not happy with a majority of the F2P changes at present, and I honestly don't see a lot of change to the current implementattion coming down the pipe (I could be wrong, but given past Cryptic performance on these kind of issues, I doubt it). But again, the SWG NGE situation was a TOTALLY different one; and started and then fully promoted by Lucas Arts itself in an attempt ro somehow get WoW level subscription numbers for SWG. In the end, all CBS cares about is that contracts are honored and all the fees paid, etc.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 32
11-02-2011, 10:57 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stormnnorm
They continue to take the Cryptic engine and develop more F2P MMOs.
Why the heck didn't I think of that. Most/all PW games (I mean made by them) have a really horrible game engine.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Englebert
I really don't understand why people will play games like these. They are complete rip off, I don't waste time or money on them.
That's the game that made Perfect World rich.

My personal favourite is selling clothing in RANDOM colors and then you have to pay huge amounts to try to make them actually worth wearing.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 33
11-02-2011, 11:06 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by KitsuneRommel
That's the game that made Perfect World rich.

My personal favourite is selling clothing in RANDOM colors and then you have to pay huge amounts to try to make them actually worth wearing.
Why would anyone buy that? I still don't understand why people actually paid $25.00 for ships in this game either.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 34
11-02-2011, 01:36 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Englebert
Why would anyone buy that? I still don't understand why people actually paid $25.00 for ships in this game either.
More money than sense. People play them because they are "free" and then spend more money than they ever would on a subscription game.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 35
11-02-2011, 02:07 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Armsman View Post
With the NGE - myou forget ONE important fact:

Lucas Arts DEMANDED SOE do the NGE - and Lucas Arts then spect a FORTUNE in TV advertising and other promotions for 3 months starting in November of 2005. They gave SWG another six months to improve; and when that didn't happen - Lucas Arts went to BioWare and said, "Okay, SWKotoR is popular amd we hear players saying 'this should have been the Star Wars MMO' - so, heres a buttload of money, go make an MMO.'

So, it's a VERY different situation from what occured with the NGE in SWG. Also, as long as CBS see a steady revenue stream, and Cryptic pays the licensing fee; CBS won't bat an eye. They were consulted and most likely don't care what the revenue generation model is - as long as their income from the game doesn't suffer. Cryptic still has to run things by CBS for approval - and per a recent interview by Kestrel on the Priority One podcast.

Make no mistake, I'm not happy with a majority of the F2P changes at present, and I honestly don't see a lot of change to the current implementattion coming down the pipe (I could be wrong, but given past Cryptic performance on these kind of issues, I doubt it). But again, the SWG NGE situation was a TOTALLY different one; and started and then fully promoted by Lucas Arts itself in an attempt ro somehow get WoW level subscription numbers for SWG. In the end, all CBS cares about is that contracts are honored and all the fees paid, etc.
You got it a bit wrong with what happened in the original NGE. Rubenfield said "they were asked to reinvent the game". However, he did not say who did that, if it was LA, SOE, San Diego (the bosses), or both. If we assume that it was probably both, due to WoW's sucess then that still left SOE Austin as the one who was "plagued" with what the CHANGES would be. Freeman made comment as well on these items. Rubenfield does elaborate on exactly that. It was SOE Austin that came up with exactly what would be done. It is still not clear on exactly who wanted the game "reinvented" but we still do not have the facts on that one and probably never will. But the CHANGES themselves, came directly from SOE Austin.

LA was part of the marketing plan as well as SOE with the commercials and their producer making the statements that he did. Rubenfield said "The marketing failed" which we all know now and why. LA did go to Bioware in Dec of 2005 for reasons unstated. I have personal information to that effect as I was involved in the TooW refunds and gained that info from that. Again, I was involved at C6CD and this info came up as well there. At C6CD and Lorin Jameson's tenure as producer (Deadmeat) that was the period that SOE had to bring the game up to par or face the consquenses. He came in with his own set of ideals and CHANGED the game yet again, just this time he did it over a year period in smaller increments. (the SOE idea of NGE wasn't that bad, it was just the way they did it all at once) These CHANGES again cost about 2/3rds of the existing playerbase, just not quite the gross amounts of NGE as they only had about 1/3 of the size of the pre-CU playerbase to begin with on these set of CHANGES.

I know alot of people have different ideas on what was the exact cause of the original NGE but that actual answer is yet to be determined with any clarity from whom or who wanted this to happen. We pretty much all assume we know why and SOE or LA has not said anything to dispell that notion altho Rubenfield did make specific mention of WoW and it's sucess as a factor.

CBS does not seem to have any of these hangups with their IP. They are not putting all their eggs in one basket, so to speak, already. I would imagine that they are watching all of this transpire with great interest. LA did believe that SWG and TOR could live together, at least at one time as they announced this exact conclusion at the TOR announcement. And why not? 2 IP payments are better than one. But SOE had their own problems, expecialy this year it would seem, and possibley even needed what has happened in their restructure.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 36
11-02-2011, 04:49 PM
Thankfully none of these "previews of what's to come" is actually in any of the patches yet. Hopefully never will be. I'm not too bummed out about not getting a free VA ship token, though I do wish Gold members received one as a perk. I don't think it's too bad of a thing in the end because all of the non-VA ships are very capable and just as strong as any of the VA ships. None of the consoles are so powerful that they're "Pay to Win". Even with the skill changes coming down the line, which I look forward to, I doubt our power will be diminished much. If it is, no biggy, since 95% of PvE is a total cakewalk anyway.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 37
11-02-2011, 05:48 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stormnnorm
Another likely scenario:

Game launches in Dec. Largely unchanged from how it is on tribble now: unfinished and broken. Game rushed out the door to compete with SWTOR

Mediocre press reviews of the "new" F2P STO and bad word of mouth by existing customers who feel slighted, cause slow adoption of the game

Shortly after release, it is revealed that new player counts are short of expectations. As a result of shortfall in revenue, new mission content promised after so long will now be C-store unlock only. Developers cannot justify putting the required resources into mission content without being directly reimbursed via RMTs. This drives away more players.

Approx. 6 months after release of F2P, the announcement is made that the STO servers will be killed off. PWI considers it a success that they got some revenue out of the game to offset the purchase cost of Cryptic, while putting very little effort/resources in. They continue to take the Cryptic engine and develop more F2P MMOs.

By the end of 2012, STO goes offline.
...I sincerely hope not... Then again... When a patient is suffering from horrible pain, hemorrhaging, and is barely recognizable as who they were before... Sometimes it is best to let them rest in peace... Still... I would rather have a full recovery.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 38
11-02-2011, 05:57 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by gx4th View Post
Honestly, pve can use a bump in harder base difficulty

If a game's standards is such that in order to actually require players to use their powers and BO abilities, they have to play on elite, then it's too easy.

Right now, the PvE'ers who step into PvP get slaughtered by veteran PvP'ers who are used to fighting other players.

I'll say it again, PvE can use a bump in difficulty. STO is the only game where you can afk / circle around enemies from levels 1-51 without using any bridge officer or captain powers. If that is the definition of "base normal difficulty" then something has to be done.
You are correct that it is too easy but you do not understand the disparity which I am talking about. You know how much we Pwn NPC's on Normal right now? Well this is going to swing that into reverse. Now they will be like we were vs. them.

In PWI normal monsters were moderately difficult and always had about a hundred times your hit points. In their dungeons though every monster had thousands of times your hit points and hit for far more damage. Every single piddly monster took several minutes to kill. The BOSSES could have HP in the millions compared to your < 20K HP at max with a Tank and could One Shot entire groups with AoE and single targets with their normal attacks... Generally, even with a good group it took around 10 to 15 minutes to kill one of these bosses and it was NOT a fun or exciting effort. All you did was stand still and spam the same things constantly the ENTIRE time... There was no big strategy. It was "Get rid of the minions and then hit the boss with as big of a stick as possible while healers spam heal for 15 minutes until he dies.".

To put it into simpler terms for a STO player... Inside their Instances every monster was a Tactical Cube and every boss was like the V'ger probe from the Orrelius RA's but less exciting and more likely to wipe out entire parties in one hit.

In the meantime you were lucky to survive with out Cash Shop help of all sorts... So yeah... That is what I am talking about. It is coming... Just wait for it...
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 39
11-02-2011, 06:07 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Englebert
Why would anyone buy that? I still don't understand why people actually paid $25.00 for ships in this game either.
Because in PWI there is absolutely NOTHING worth doing... All you can do is grind and grind and grind for level. There are not mini-games, crafting is a joke, and the only thing resembling a home was a Guild Hall that could be stolen by other Guilds and all your efforts taken without any consent. So in the end all you can do is Grind, Try to Look Pretty while doing it, and PvP in their pretty awful PvP system...

However, the system worked. Those random clothes, random boxes that give you random things for $1.00 and tons of EXP boosters and things to basically Ungimp your character so they can break even... In the end most everyone who played that game spent around $50.00 a Month and got practically nothing for their money. If they all stopped playing that game and played WoW they would get a far better game and have a lot of money left over to use for whatever they wanted.

With STO as it is RIGHT NOW it is a far better deal than most any FtP game out there for this same reason but when it also goes FtP under PW's wonderful model then I fear it will just be... Pardon the horrible cliche' but... Perfect World IN SPAAAAAAAACE!
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 40
11-02-2011, 06:16 PM
Here's my prediction of the future...

Yes ok, I do sit on street corners with a sign saying "Repent sinners, the end is near"
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