Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
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# 21
11-08-2011, 05:36 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by nynik
The more dilithium that is allowed flood in the less profit Cryptic can potentially make. As dilithium becomes more and more worthless as you can replay missions like Spin the Wheel the incentive for anyone to trade their CPoints for it diminishes along with the game's future.

If it will be changed, hopefully dilithium for first time completion only.
I dont follow your logic. If you can only refine 8k a day then what difference does it make how much ore you earn?
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# 22
11-08-2011, 06:10 PM
Perhaps with the soon to be refurbished Patrol Missions, We will be getting small bits of ore with each of those.
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# 23
11-08-2011, 06:50 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by The.Grand.Nagus View Post
I dont follow your logic. If you can only refine 8k a day then what difference does it make how much ore you earn?
I really didn't communicate it well at all, sorry. Its about How.

Apart from the run of the mill daily dilithium rewarding activities we also have the goal orientated activities such as Fleet actions, STFs, events and pvp (and potentially any new activities down the line like collectivised starbase construction, ship building etc).

The goal orientated activities drive a person to want to gear up quickly in order to feel and act better doing those activities. This is a driving force behind the itemized economy as people need to gather dilithium to gear or diversify ships and they need dilithium to trade for CPoints to diversify ships and for gear (consoles) as well.

These goal orientated activities take the most time away from the player yet can reward increasing amounts of Dilithium for that time. Engineering them as an attractive means to gather dilithium to reach your end goal, quicker.

Funnelling people into these goal orientated activities, is required, in order to keep them functional. In order to keep the game functional, and indirectly, although importantly, in order to create potential reasons for people to buy CPoints with cash.

Now if we have a silver player, A, who levels up and sets their sights on a dilithium goal, but instead of partaking in any of these highly time consuming, potentially tedious, cooperative, goal orientated activities and instead A focusses on replaying solo play missions to grind their dilithium, then it damages the game for others and potential profits for cryptic (as there is one less person to fill a vacancy or complete a perceived 'social' experience <which can keep people playing>, as well as one less person who *may* be tempted to avail of the shortcuts provided by buying CPoints for cash to trade for dilithium to achieve their dilithium goal quicker).

Since A is not paying any money to farm as they please, they will either continue to do so based on a timetable the wish, or just give up and leave the game.

Now imagine, if player A was actually, one hundred thousand like minded people. With none of them partaking in those time consuming goal orientated activities but only engaging in replaying missions to achieve their dilithium goal. Unlike games where people pay for every moment of time they are allowed access the game, these players are under no such perceived obligations and can very quickly decide not to continue with time consuming stuff when they have a perfectly viable option to achieve their goal with the least resistance (to their time in this sense).

Endgame as we know it: events, pvp, STFs, Fleet Actions would suffer because of this private dilithium fountain which exists outside of the whole game's direction, i.e. that of encouraging players to progress through content along a linear path, encouraging them to engage in the next step and with that next step ingraining in them the desire to itemize - and potentially pay cash to do so. Cryptic earns nothing if that collective of people achieve their goals playing this game without being exposed to those engineered goal orientated hooks:

- being tempted to itemize quickly
- quickly *could* translate easily to *shortcut*
- shortcut translates to revenue


Its not a matter of being against allowing people earning dilithium how they like. Its a case of supporting what seems to be the natural direction of the game, keeping it healthy for everyone, equally and providing for the most attractive conditions for someone to want to pay cash (to itemize quickly).

If people can bypass that direction (which is the only thing encouraging direct transactions) then this game's financial model fails.

Most of the people I have spoken with about dilithium from all activities base their point around wanting to spend their time earning dilithium doing activities that they enjoy. I fully agree with that. It is why I expect each of the 'next steps' in content to expand out range of dilithium earning activities. It is the only option available to Cryptic under the system they are introducing.

Its not healthy, in context of this game's direction and essential source of income for people to be able to earn (no matter how slowly) everything that will be released, by farming the pve experience.

I think 8 months, is it?, of content neglect has actually impacted upon all our perceptions slightly, that we feel we should cling on to what we have been doing all this time, repeating, repeating, repeating.

To surmise my proceeding comment in the context of this explanation (my opinion) (for further clarity - hopefully):

Quote:
1. The more dilithium that is allowed flood in the less profit Cryptic can potentially make. 2. As dilithium becomes more and more worthless as you can replay missions like Spin the Wheel the incentive for anyone to trade their CPoints for it diminishes along with the game's future.

If it will be changed, hopefully dilithium for first time completion only.

1. flood due to this option existing outside the game's directed progression
2. worthless due to no requirement to progress or buy because you have not been exposed to the potential hook of 'itemize, itemize, itemize -> heres why -> do it quickly -> exist in the this part of the game or take a shortcut using CPoints'

I hope that clarifies my poorly worded comment a little.

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Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 24
11-08-2011, 06:56 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by nynik
Now if we have a silver player, A, who levels up and sets their sights on a dilithium goal, but instead of partaking in any of these highly time consuming, potentially tedious, cooperative, goal orientated activities and instead A focusses on replaying solo play missions to grind their dilithium, then it damages the game for others and potential profits for cryptic (as there is one less person to fill a vacancy or complete a perceived 'social' experience <which can keep people playing>, as well as one less person who *may* be tempted to avail of the shortcuts provided by buying CPoints for cash to trade for dilithium to achieve their dilithium goal quicker).
So you think "forcing" people who dont actually want to do group content into doing it in order to get their daily 8k will result in a better group experience for the people who do want to be in a group? I would prefer to be grouped with people who actually want to be there then people who dont.
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Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 25
11-08-2011, 07:08 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by The.Grand.Nagus View Post
So you think "forcing" people who dont actually want to do group content into doing it in order to get their daily 8k will result in a better group experience for the people who do want to be in a group? I would prefer to be grouped with people who actually want to be there then people who dont.
No, Group content is only a part of the existing goal orientated activities. I mentioned that those run of the mill dailies are also a part of the goal orientated culture. (I focussed on elaborating about the grouped content more as it holds in its category the means to achieve the best items in the game and is most vulnerable to losing people who are progressing through a sealed pve dilithium fountain - additionally, this grouped endgame content will have the most immediate effect on STO's image beyond the game - is it healthy or lacking people and why...)

This also includes things which take place within a social medium, like dilithium gain via the academy event. None are necessarily exclusively group content. And all enable a person to reach the 8k daily cap - but only because they reward based on the time commitment. (I am reaching it right now on tribble without any group play or doff play, 500 dil to go).

We are at a stage in content where we just meet the requirement of the daily cap through non group play. Instead of looking back we should look forward and expand our sights on wanting to repeat the new content that will be developed to vasty broaded how one can earn dilithium ore to reach that cap through various playstyles - be it group play, solo play, or anciliary play like the DOff feature.

Yesterday the EP made clear that Cryptic are using the F2P launch as a means to hit the ground running on new content and features for 2012. How many more fun sources of dilithium will the next FE series open up to broaden that spectrum of dilithium missions.

Its more than just "lets look forward though", I mean as you saw, perhaps, in my opinion reply I feel there is a very real reason why pas pve content can not offer the means to allow people to be competitive with the goal orientated content.

*edit to add in further clarification on why I had focussed on the group play categories of the goal orientated activities

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# 26
11-15-2011, 02:42 PM
Still waiting Devs. Make this happen!
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# 27
11-15-2011, 02:49 PM
Agreed with this, give us Dilithium for every mission we do, not just the daily repeatable quests.
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# 28
11-15-2011, 05:00 PM
I've been thinking about this for several days now since my first post, and I know why they've gated Dilithium to daily repeatables.

It's a part of the emotional component of the effort to drive us to buy C-Points.

If we could get Dilithium by doing things we enjoy, then there would be no motivation for use to buy C-Points as a means to the end of getting Dilithium.

The method of attaining Dilithium has to be boring and repetitive, or else people would just grind Dilithium, rather than buying C-Points and trading for it.
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Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 29
11-15-2011, 05:07 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Katic View Post
I've been thinking about this for several days now since my first post, and I know why they've gated Dilithium to daily repeatables.

It's a part of the emotional component of the effort to drive us to buy C-Points.

If we could get Dilithium by doing things we enjoy, then there would be no motivation for use to buy C-Points as a means to the end of getting Dilithium.

The method of attaining Dilithium has to be boring and repetitive, or else people would just grind Dilithium, rather than buying C-Points and trading for it.
Giving us a wider variety of dailies goes against that logic, which they are doing with the new events. Also, there were formerly 2 dailies in the B'Tran cluster, but one of them has now been changed to work in any star cluster. So if they were really wanting to 'bore" us into buying C-points they wouldnt be adding more variety to the dailies.
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# 30
11-19-2011, 03:10 PM
Yes please.
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