Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
This should serve as a reference, and is a WIP. I also added some comments based on how I see the changes.

Key: First listed are Holodeck values. Tribble changes are listed beneath, indented


Charged Particle Burst
Skill dependency: Starship Operations Training, Sensors, Astrometrics
Rank 3 rarity: Captain trained, 9 ranks in Astrometrics

Skill dependency: Starship Particle Generators (damage), Starship Subspace Decompiler (cloak disable)
Rank 3 rarity: Captain trained, 9 ranks in Starship Subspace Decompiler
Comments: CPB got a boost overall in terms of damage, (which doesn't follow the patterns everything else has been following) however the skill required to train it is of no real use to CPB itself. No one will keep points in Subspace Decompilers after training CPB.



Energy Siphon
Skill dependency: Starship Operations Training, Deflectors, Deflector Dish
Rank 3 rarity: Very Rare bridge officer candidates

Skill dependency: Starship Flow Capacitors** (duration)
Comments: This DOES NOT work as advertised. The power drain does not improve with skill points, only the duration. Of course that is exactly how it works on Holodeck, so no big deal. The cheap skill now might make this more common to see, if it weren't so expensive in terms of BOFF slotting. Still with power drain builds all being fed from a single ultra cheap skill...


Feedback Pulse
Skill dependency: Starship Operations Training, Deflectors, Deflector Field
Rank 3 rarity: Captain trained, 9 ranks in Deflector Field

Skill dependency: Starship Particle Generators (damage)
Rank 3 rarity: Captain trained, 9 ranks in Starship Particle Generators
Comments: Big Bug. On Redshirt, I get about 83% reflected damage with FBP 3. On Tribble it is closer to 200% with the same skills/settings/etc. FBP damage was supposed to cap out around 100% with older adjustments to the power. The tooltip is also very wrong, implying a 64% return rate.


Gravity Well
Skill dependency: Starship Operations Training, Deflectors, Spatial Anomaly
Rank 3 rarity: Captain trained, 9 ranks in Spatial Anomaly

Skill dependency: Starship Particle Generators (damage), Starship Graviton Generators (repel)
Rank 3 rarity: Captain trained, 9 ranks in Starship Graviton Generators
Comments: Anecdotal reports that GW is massively more powerful than it is on holodeck, likely bug, but I don't see it in the tooltip myself, though the tooltip is very possibly wrong. Overall a buff, since it is far easier to improve this power now.


Hazard Emitters
Skill dependency: Starship Operations Training, Emitters, Hazard Systems
Rank 3 rarity: Captain trained, 9 ranks in Hazard Systems

Skill dependency: Starship Hull Repair (heal)
Rank 3 rarity: Captain trained, 9 ranks in Starship Hull Repair
Comments: I guess its nice that everyone can train heals to maximum easier, and makes no sacrifice to do so now. Or is it?


Jam Sensors
Skill dependency: Starship Operations Training, Sensors, Sensor Array
Rank 3 rarity: Captain trained, 9 ranks in Sensor Array

Skill dependency: Starship Countermeasure Systems (duration)
Rank 3 rarity: Captain trained, 9 ranks in Starship Sensors
Comments: Wow. Talk about removing a power from the game. This power has no business being as expensive to improve as it is on Tribble. It also should not require a completely different skill that has absolutely no effect on the power itself to learn the training for it. That said no one ever uses JS3 anyway because it is not worth the slot, and never has been.


Mask Energy Signature
Skill dependency: Starship engineering training, Auxiliary Maintenance, Auxiliary Performance
Rank 3 rarity: Very Rare Bridge officer candidate

Skill dependency: Starship Stealth
Comments: Not tested specifically, but cloaking seems to work the same as it always has. Skilling for it is still unnecessary, especially considering the massive nerf passive stealth detection took.


Photonic Officer
Skill dependency: Starship Operations Training, Emitters, Photonic Theory
Rank 3 rarity: Only available from referral reward holographic officer

Skill dependency: None
Comments: Slightly reduced effectiveness on Tribble, but mostly the same.


Photonic Shockwave
Skill dependency: Starship Operations Training, Emitters, Photonic Theory
Rank 3 rarity: Captain trained, 9 ranks in Photonic Theory

Skill dependency: Starship Particle Generators (damage), Starship Graviton Generators (Knockback), Starship Subspace Decompilers (Stun)
Rank 3 rarity: Captain trained, 9 ranks in Starship Particle Generators
Comments: For being the one power that requires 3 different skills for its effects, I don't think it means much. The damage has always been of little importance as has the repel. However if one does not train subspace decompilers, the stun is only going to be 2.1s. Overall a nerf, considering there is no way to buff Subspace Decompilers with consoles or deflectors anymore, whereas on Holodeck reaching the 4s cap to the stun was easy with equipment and skill points in the lower tier skills alone (yes perhaps too easy, but this is in the other extreme). I expect use of this power will decline significantly.


Polarize Hull
Skill dependency: Starship Operations Training, Emitters, Hazard Systems
Rank 3 rarity: Very Rare Bridge officer candidate

Skill dependency: None
Comments: Damage resist still varies with Aux despite not depending on skill. Tribble tooltip shows a 93 resist at 125 aux for PH 3. Redshirt shows 117 at 125 aux, and 82 at 73 aux. Overall a big nerf.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 2
11-12-2011, 11:14 AM
Science Team
Skill dependency: Science team leader, Deflectors, Deflector Field
Rank 3 rarity: Captain trained, 9 ranks in Scientist

Skill dependency: Starship Shield Emitters (heal)
Rank 3 rarity: Captain trained, 9 ranks in Scientist
Comments: The current cost of the skills makes training ground skills virtually impossible. That said, science team as a shield heal is not the main value of the power, and thus ST 3 is superfluous when a far better option is TSS 3, and one everyone can get with the Reman BOFF. Overall it is unlikely that anyone notices this change, since it was buffed by the same skills as TSS, aside from the Tier 1.


Scramble Sensors
Skill dependency: Starship Operations Training, Sensors, Sensor Probes
Rank 3 rarity: Captain trained, 9 ranks in Sensor Probes

Skill dependency: Starship Countermeasure Systems (duration)
Rank 3 rarity: Captain trained, 9 ranks in Starship Countermeasure Systems
Comments: A nerf, simply. Not only is the counter skill a lower tier than this, but this requires the exceedingly expensive tier 5 skill to train and buff. That doesn't mean it will disappear in PVP either, just that people may likely suffer a lower skill rating on it to get other more valuable skills after training SS 3 and putting the points more valuable places.


Sensor rating/Cloak detection
Skill dependency: Starship Operations Training, Sensors, Sensor Array

Skill dependency: Starship Sensors
Comments: Massive unexplained nerf here. My sensor rating on Tribble is a little more than half of what it was on Holodeck, despite training in Sensors.

Tachyon Beam
Skill dependency: Starship Operations Training, Deflectors, Deflector Dish
Rank 3 rarity: Captain trained, 9 ranks in Deflector Dish

Skill dependency: Starship Flow Capacitors
Rank 3 rarity: Captain trained, 9 ranks in Starship Flow Capacitors
Comments: Far cheaper to train now, this will be extremely common on science ships. Can you say cookie cutter?


Target Subsystems 1
Skill dependency: Starship Operations Training, Sensors, Sensor Array

Skill dependency: Starship Flow Capacitors (power drain), Starship Subspace Decompilers (disable)
Comments: Easier to train for escorts who now have even less reason to delve deep into the science tree.


Tractor Beam
Skill dependency: Starship Operations Training, Emitters, Tractor Beams
Rank 3 rarity: Captain trained, 9 ranks in Tractor Beams

Skill dependency: Starship Graviton Generators
Rank 3 rarity: Captain trained, 9 ranks in Starship Graviton Generators
Comments: None.


Tractor Beam Repulsors
Skill dependency: Starship Operations Training, Emitters, Tractor Beams
Rank 3 rarity: Uncommon Bridge officer candidates

Skill dependency: Starship Graviton Generators (repel)
Comments: Overall a significant nerf, the damage was a big component of this power, and it can no longer be improved, sitting at about half of its Holodeck value. Suggest to bring back damage buffing via Starship Particle Generators.


Transfer Shield Strength
Skill dependency: Starship Operations Training, Deflectors, Deflector Field
Rank 3 rarity: Very Rare Bridge officer candidates

Skill dependency: Starship Shield Emitters(heal)
Comments: See Hazard emitters for my thoughts on cheap healing. On actually comparing the tooltip values for healing between Tribble/Holodeck, this appears to have a major buff on Tribble, for over twice the healing values. Resist is the same.


Tyken's Rift
Skill dependency: Starship Operations Training, Deflectors, Spatial Anomaly
Rank 3 rarity: Very Rare Bridge officer candidate

Skill dependency: Starship Flow Capacitors(power drain), Starship Particle Generators(damage)
Comments: Extremely cheap to skill this power now. The damage isn't that important, the drain is. Power drain builds are going to be very very common if the skill tree stays the same. Cookie cutter FTL.


Viral Matrix
Skill dependency: Starship Operations Training, Sensors, Sensor Probes
Rank 3 rarity: Rare Bridge officer candidates

Skill dependency: Starship Subspace Decompilers
Comments: Overall a nerf to an underwhelming power. VM now relies on a very expensive T5 skill that does little else of value. Further there are no consoles that improve this skill, meaning VM 3 is stuck at a very unimpressive 10s maximum duration when fully trained, which is less than the Holodeck value.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 3
11-17-2011, 07:18 AM
[quote]
Quote:
Photonic Officer
Skill dependency: Starship Operations Training, Emitters, Photonic Theory
Rank 3 rarity: Only available from referral reward holographic officer

Skill dependency: None
Comments: Not tested, but with no skill dependency, it probably needs no testing.
Works exactly like Holodeck at Tier 1. Did not test Tier 2 or Tier 3 of this skill

Quote:
Photonic Shockwave
Skill dependency: Starship Operations Training, Emitters, Photonic Theory
Rank 3 rarity: Captain trained, 9 ranks in Photonic Theory

Skill dependency: Starship Particle Generators (damage), Starship Graviton Generators (Knockback), Starship Subspace Decompilers (Stun)
Rank 3 rarity: Captain trained, 9 ranks in Starship Particle Generators
Comments: For being the one power that requires 3 different skills for its effects, I don't think it means much. The damage has always been of little importance as has the repel. However if one does not train subspace decompilers, the stun is only going to be 2.1s. Overall a nerf, considering there is no way to buff Subspace Decompilers with consoles or deflectors anymore, whereas on Holodeck reaching the 4s cap to the stun was easy with equipment and skill points in the lower tier skills alone (yes perhaps too easy, but this is in the other extreme). I expect use of this power will decline significantly.
I was under teh impression that a HIgh Aux power would effect this ability, giving a better return on its casting.
If so, then Aux is not affecting this power in anyway on Tribble.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 4
11-17-2011, 09:02 AM
If you care to take a look at science captain powers you will see they have suffered too.

Sensor Scan now only has its cloak debuff effected by the Sensors skill and there is no skill that effects its magnitude. -47% is not good when I had -67% at least pre skill tree change.

The same goes for Dampening Field.

Subnucleonic Beam seems to be getting increased from somewhere but i'm not sure where.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 5 I am not so sure...
11-17-2011, 09:15 AM
...if you can make a fair comparison with Tribble and Holodeck with the current systems. The combat system for space on Tribble is completely different.

Before you had 3 Skill Sets contributing to one power. Now you only need on Skill set to contribute to one power. Also, the underlying skill modifier is on a 99 point scale. The previous scale was a 33 point scale.

Until the ground skill revamp is released, we are not going to know how these new scales will affect us all.

I have not noticed any major issues in my playing style since the new space skill revamp has been released to the game.

The only issues I am seeing are on the ground game in advance and elite difficulty. The game does not appear to be scaling up the difficulty correctly. However, this could be the result that the ground skills are going to change. We are just going to have to wait and see.

Also, the DOFF system ties into the powers now to. This add in feature does not exist on Holodeck.

Thank you.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 6
11-17-2011, 09:30 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Klytemnestra
Before you had 3 Skill Sets contributing to one power. Now you only need on Skill set to contribute to one power.
Actually it's more like one skill box for one effect that power has. If you're wanting to improve Gravity Well as much as you can, you have to invest into Graviton Generators (Improves tractor effect) and Particle Generators (improves damage). But if the damage effect isn't that important to you, you can stick just to skilling up the tractor aspect and use those skill points elsewhere.

I like it better than the old system because it gives players more choice and control over their abilities. Of course some builds will suffer with the changes, but I think once people get to know the new system they'll find builds that blow away some of the old ones.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 7
11-17-2011, 11:42 AM
Unless the older posts when the new skill tree was introduced are wrong, all Captain powers suffered a loss in effectivness.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 8
11-17-2011, 01:05 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Roach View Post
Unless the older posts when the new skill tree was introduced are wrong, all Captain powers suffered a loss in effectivness.
You tell me. Did Attack Pattern Alpha suffer a 35% effectiveness loss when you skilled into its only related skill?
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 9
11-17-2011, 02:01 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Korhil
You tell me. Did Attack Pattern Alpha suffer a 35% effectiveness loss when you skilled into its only related skill?
don't forget that sensor scan scales with aux. i get -51% on my sci escort on holodeck with my "normal" power settings. alpha on my tac escort lost more (compared to my sci escort) ..
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 10
11-18-2011, 07:29 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Korhil
You tell me. Did Attack Pattern Alpha suffer a 35% effectiveness loss when you skilled into its only related skill?
Unless the older posts when the new skill tree was introduced are wrong, all Captain powers suffered a loss in effectivness and as far as I know none of the Captains abilities get buffed by skills anymore.
Why? Are they picking on the feds again or is this just a science complaint?

Tactical Captain Abilities: a compariosn as taken from another thread.
http://forums.startrekonline.com/sho...d.php?t=240323

Tactical Fleet II:
(Tribble: + 22% All Damage / + 12 Starship Maneuvers / + 12 Starship Targeting Systems)
(Holodeck: + 31% All Damage / + 16 Starship Attack Vectors)

Go Down Fighting III:
(Tribble: + 20% All Damage (Lower Hull = Damage)
(Holodeck: + 52% All Damage (Lower Hull = Damage)

Attack Pattern Alpha III:
(Tribble: + 50% All Damage / + 5% Critical Chance / + 50% Critical Severity / + 120% Flight Turn Rate)
(Holodeck: + 63% All Damage / + 4.2% Critical Chance / + 42% Critical Severity / + 80% Flight Turn Rate)

Tactical Commander:

Attack Pattern Omega III:
(Tribble: + 25% All Damage / + 37% All Damage Resistance / + 171% Flight Turn Rate / + 45% Defensive Strength)
(Holodeck: + 52% All Damage / + 32% All Damage Resistance / + 143% Flight Turn Rate / + 30% Defensive Strength)

Attack Pattern Beta III:
(Tribble: - 50 All Damage Resistance / - 199 Stealth Strength)
(Holodeck: - 42 All Damage Resistance / - 158 Stealth Strength)

S0 Tacs have taken a hit too.

As did Engineers;
verse shield polarity 3:
unknown (tooltip does not show %) | 1.7% incoming damage converted to shields
reverse shield polarity 1:
unknown (tooltip deos not show %) | 1.1% incoming damage converted to shields
rotate shield frequency:
174 regen / 38% damage reduction | 216 regen / 38% damage reduction
emergency power to shields 3:
2288 regen / +38 shield power / 30% damage reduction | 2889 / +41 shield power / 30% damage reduction
emergency power to shields 1:
1372 regen / +23 shield power / 18% damage reduction | 1733 / +25 shield power / 18% damage reduction
tac team 1:
no change from holo to tribble
polarize hull 1:
+44 damage resistance | +38 damage resistance
enhanced plasma manifold:
no change from holo to tribble
eps power transfer:
+32 power settings / 189% transfer rate | +33 power settings / 198% transfer rate
nadion inversion:
72% reduced energy drain | 75% reduced energy drain
hazard emitters 2:
+12168 hp / +19 damage resistance | +10527 hp / +19 damage resistance
aux to SIF 2:
+4053 hp / +30 damage resistance | +3948 hp / +27 damage resistance
engineering team 2:
+ 8347 hp / +24 warp core/engineering training | +8485 hp (warp core/engineering training buff removed)
engineering team 1:
+6260 hp / +18 warp core/engineering training | +6364 hp (warp core/engineering training buff removed)
miracle worker:
+14362 hp / +4787 shield regen | +14141 hp / +5778 shield regen

as did Science;
Science Captain Abilities:

Starship Dampening Field III:
(Tribble: 99 to all Damage Resistance)
(Holodeck: 187 to all Damage Resistance)

Science Fleet II:
(Tribble: Reduces Damge to Shields by 27% / + 12 ___ / + 12 ___)
(Holodeck: Reduces Damge to Shields by 54% / + 16 Starship Operations Training)

Sensor Scan: maxes now at - 68 all damage resistance buffed buy 125aux.

Everybody is feeling the pinch somehow.
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