Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
http://massively.joystiq.com/2011/06...f-the-endgame/


*good article* read this !

This 100% applies to STO.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 2
12-04-2011, 09:41 AM
I'm pretty staunchly opposed to sandbox games and someone who LOVES novel grinds and theme park games.

Sandbox games are to MMO snobs what French art films are to film snobs or amazingly pungent foods are to foodies.

There's always this concession in there that sandbox games are less popular with Joe Blow and this assumption that if people ONLY KNEW and UNDERSTOOD what the sandbox enthusiast knows, they would jump ship on their theme park games.

It's just not true.

I think a lot of people are aware of the theme park's hamster wheel/skinner box with light, CRAFTED narrative. If they play it at all at endgame, they are aware of it. And they LIKE it, they just want that endgame to be balanced RIGHT to their tastes and aesthetics and are looking for the game that does that.

But they aren't going to be satisfied with a sandbox.

That's like taking a bus load of costumed Juggalos to a baby shower.

The theme park is always free to borrow ideas from the sandbox but the sandbox game is absolutely NOT more desirable to most people.

There's an inherent fallacy. The number one choice of high culture connoisseur's is almost always wrong for the masses. If you are a high culture/high art connoisseur, your tastes are skewed and you need to be able to put them aside.

A large sized combo from McDonald's with an Apple Pie will cost you as much as a 3 course lunch at a 3.5-4 star restaurant, minus tip. But people buy it? Because they're in a hurry? Some of them are. Many of them like it just as much or better.

Don't try to Eliza Doolittle the general public.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 3
12-04-2011, 11:20 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Z3R0B4NG View Post
http://massively.joystiq.com/2011/06...f-the-endgame/


*good article* read this !

This 100% applies to STO.
Agreed. It's especially applicable after S5 added boatloads of grind to STO's "endgame". Running a mission 30 times to get a piece of gear? Ha! Good one. Keep dreaming, Cryptic.


Z
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 4
12-04-2011, 11:24 AM
It doesnt matter what you want to call it, every MMO needs new things to do on a regular basis once you reach max level or people will lose interest.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 5
12-04-2011, 12:07 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Leviathan99
The theme park is always free to borrow ideas from the sandbox but the sandbox game is absolutely NOT more desirable to most people.
Thats very much your opinion and in no way fact.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 6
12-04-2011, 12:09 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Leviathan99
/snip/

Sandbox games are to MMO snobs what French art films are to film snobs or amazingly pungent foods are to foodies.

/snip/
It's either bad meat or good cheese...

On the topic at hand, I fell both have something to gain from the other. I'm not saying take the two and mash them together, but elements of each could exist in the same game. Player/community driven content will only satisfy for so long but the same is true of grind. When you can do something until you exhaust it or tire of it then move on to something different in the same game, you're much less likely to quit for a new experiance elsewhere. If the are enough facets of the game that you can move from one to the other you'll end up going in cycles through that content, returning to something that may have bored you before because you've had a break from it. Or you can do it all in tandem with each other and have it last much longer.

However, raising the level cap, adding new grinds for new shinies and harder content to use those shinies in only lasts for so long and avid MMOers will burn through it faster than it can be made. Give them something else to do while you make the new content and they'll stick around while they wait.

Themed sandbox's, thats the ideal for me...
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 7
12-04-2011, 12:52 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Leviathan99
I'm pretty staunchly opposed to sandbox games and someone who LOVES novel grinds and theme park games.
But most people who started their gaming "career" with Pen & Paper RPGs probably feel different. Baldur's Gate 2 had an awesome story but I'd rather replay Elder Scrolls III: Morrowind than it.
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