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Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 21
12-09-2011, 01:55 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Varlo
Once again, from the item description in the C-Store:

"Buy a Winter Package to give to a friend, or open it yourself to get one of the following tradable items:

Unique Jem'Hadar Attack Ship
Faction-appropriate Duty Officer Pack
Holographic Science Bridge Officer
8-hour XP Boost
Gekli Space Pet
Targ Pup Pet (Klingon Empire characters only)
Exocomp Pet (Starfleet characters only
Eisilum Crystal Horta Ally
Polytrinic Acid Horta Ally
Holographic Tribble
1-hour XP Boost
Blue Winter Package with a space or ground weapon and holiday crafting materials"


Now if you don't feel you've enough information there to make an informed decision over buying this thing or not, I'd urge you not to buy it.

As I've stated previoulsy, you will always advertise your top prize in things like these. The odds of winning a prize are roughly about 400%, because (in all the boxes I've opened in winter Wonderland) four items have been "won". The odds of winning the top prize are always going to be significantly less.
Strange but that list does not include the Liberated Borg BO that has been showing up on the exchange for about 1.5 mil each, you can get one for each faction.

If there not coming from the gift boxes then where are they coming from?
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 22
12-09-2011, 01:58 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by 0Gambit0 View Post
Strange but that list does not include the Liberated Borg BO that has been showing up on the exchange for about 1.5 mil each, you can get one for each faction.

If there not coming from the gift boxes then where are they coming from?
The Liberated Borg engineer BOff? That is a CStore item. You can buy it over and over and over again. I believe some folks are just trying to turn real cash into quick ECs by putting them on the exchange.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 23
12-09-2011, 02:02 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by McCooey View Post
I'm willing to give crypic some benefit of the doubt and suggest that there may be something wrong and this goodie bag system is not working as intended

personally i've spent way more on CP trying to get this then i want to think about and got more then one of everything thats on the offer list including 8 8hr exp boosts thats 6240c points all while trying to get a ship that is at most a possible 2000cp assuming that it the same "worth" as a galaxy x. Thats not even taking into consideration all the other 1 hr xp boosts and duty offer pack I've gotten in pursuit of this ship. This was at a time where i've spen 5000cp (shame on me i know) but from a business stand point that already a loss 1240cp to cryptic in oppertunity cost on the 8hrs xp alone. Not to mension what a bad customer experience and lost of faith in the cryptic store (which wil be the main source of income for the game) On paper i've made more money then i spent and i'm no closer to what i want

Is it just me or does something sound wrong here? We really do need those odds for the ship to find out
The problem is this, have they violated the contract of purchase? Probably not. By buying the package, you're offered a chance to win one of may prizes, the vast majority of them higher value than the "face retail value" of the cost of the opportunity to win. You have a chance to win "one" of those (not a particular) prizes and you dont walk away with nothing of value. Even without knowing the odds of winning, a "reasonable person" would know that the odds of winning the "top-of-the-line" item is slim. Even if the odds were 1:10,000, people would be still complaining that they didn't win the "big" prize and saying it wasn't ethical. I am sure that Cryptic was smart enough to run it by thier legal deparment to make sure they were following the letter of regulating entities law.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 24
12-09-2011, 02:30 PM
Don't take me wrong, but nobody forced anybody to spend fortunes to buy anything. It was a choice some ppl made. Reading the advertisment, it does not guarantee any ship prize... On the other side, come on folks, this is a business, it is supposed to bring some fat revenues. Yea, everybody likes freebies, but those don't bring revenue. So, on this issue, I side w Cryptic.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 25
12-09-2011, 03:51 PM
I spent my 400 c point stipend on 1/2 of the Gorn ship with the aceton assimilater console, instead of a vague chance of winning the c-store lotto.
Did i do it wrong?
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 26
12-09-2011, 03:58 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Varlo
Once again, from the item description in the C-Store:

"Buy a Winter Package to give to a friend, or open it yourself to get one of the following tradable items:

Unique Jem'Hadar Attack Ship
Faction-appropriate Duty Officer Pack
Holographic Science Bridge Officer
8-hour XP Boost
Gekli Space Pet
Targ Pup Pet (Klingon Empire characters only)
Exocomp Pet (Starfleet characters only
Eisilum Crystal Horta Ally
Polytrinic Acid Horta Ally
Holographic Tribble
1-hour XP Boost
Blue Winter Package with a space or ground weapon and holiday crafting materials"


Now if you don't feel you've enough information there to make an informed decision over buying this thing or not, I'd urge you not to buy it.

As I've stated previoulsy, you will always advertise your top prize in things like these. The odds of winning a prize are roughly about 400%, because (in all the boxes I've opened in winter Wonderland) four items have been "won". The odds of winning the top prize are always going to be significantly less.
I talked to a fleet member last night who spent $120 on cp and didn't get a ship.

I spent plenty of my CP and didnt see a ship either.

I like the rare ships, I think that they need to NOT sell them later in the cstore


This game is a cookie cutter made from a stack of cookie cutters. RARE is special, and should remain so.

Still, $120 and NOT get the ship?

LAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA AAAAAAAAAAAAAME
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 27
12-09-2011, 04:03 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by whamhammer View Post
The problem is this, have they violated the contract of purchase? Probably not. By buying the package, you're offered a chance to win one of may prizes, the vast majority of them higher value than the "face retail value" of the cost of the opportunity to win. You have a chance to win "one" of those (not a particular) prizes and you dont walk away with nothing of value. Even without knowing the odds of winning, a "reasonable person" would know that the odds of winning the "top-of-the-line" item is slim. Even if the odds were 1:10,000, people would be still complaining that they didn't win the "big" prize and saying it wasn't ethical. I am sure that Cryptic was smart enough to run it by thier legal deparment to make sure they were following the letter of regulating entities law.
The problem is, guessing that the odds of winning are "slim" is completely qualitative and of very limited useful value in terms of the consumer making an informed decision.

Also, every day dozens of lawsuits are filed against companies in the United States with the ultimate result being that the company settles the lawsuit or the judge finds for the plaintiff. Many of them involve policies that were cleared by the company's legal department. Corporation's legal departments exist primarily to ensure that the financial benefit of a certain action or policy is greater than the financial risk of a lawsuit, not to guarantee that the action is legal. Just for example, in Silicon valley it is very common for employers to pay programmers less than the State's mandated salary because they figure that the average cost of a class action lawsuit regarding unpaid overtime is less than raising the employee's salary to the State minimum or paying them hourly wages.

The bottom line: by denying customers information regarding the odds of winning the ship they are denying customers the opportunity to make a properly informed decision regarding whether to purchase the ship. I have to question whether that is an ethical business decision, or even a legal one.

Simply having a disclaimer in your sales signage that reads caveat emptor does not automatically absolve you of liability, at least not in California or the United States.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 28
12-09-2011, 05:22 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by whamhammer View Post
The problem is this, have they violated the contract of purchase? Probably not. By buying the package, you're offered a chance to win one of may prizes, the vast majority of them higher value than the "face retail value" of the cost of the opportunity to win. You have a chance to win "one" of those (not a particular) prizes and you dont walk away with nothing of value. Even without knowing the odds of winning, a "reasonable person" would know that the odds of winning the "top-of-the-line" item is slim. Even if the odds were 1:10,000, people would be still complaining that they didn't win the "big" prize and saying it wasn't ethical. I am sure that Cryptic was smart enough to run it by thier legal deparment to make sure they were following the letter of regulating entities law.
I see what your saying

I was more approaching this from a "their random generator is broken" surely it would cost more to give me more 8 hr xp boosts which i honesty i would have bought leveling up other toons then give me one ship when you concider my 8 8hr boosts to my 0 ship
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 29
12-10-2011, 07:36 AM
I think people have made some very sound arguments about the ethicality of this practice and the capacity to make an informed purchase when no odds are published.

I sincerely hope some of our Californian residents are able to pursue this matter further to ascertain the legality of the situation.

It's certainly not something I'll be a party to.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 30
12-10-2011, 11:51 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by amidoinitright View Post
I spent my 400 c point stipend on 1/2 of the Gorn ship with the aceton assimilater console, instead of a vague chance of winning the c-store lotto.
Did i do it wrong?
It's called "opportunity cost" you chose to "spend" your stipend on a particular product, but later a different product came out that you could have "spent" it on. Both product offers were not wrong, neither was the "opportunity cost" options allowed to all memebrs of the game. So the answer is, for you ... no.
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