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Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 31
12-10-2011, 10:58 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sakarak
The problem is, guessing that the odds of winning are "slim" is completely qualitative and of very limited useful value in terms of the consumer making an informed decision.

Also, every day dozens of lawsuits are filed against companies in the United States with the ultimate result being that the company settles the lawsuit or the judge finds for the plaintiff. Many of them involve policies that were cleared by the company's legal department.
To the settling out of court issue, in the U.S. court system, the court suggests settlement out of court, settlign doesnt create a situtation of guilt, and most are settled because the time and costs of court litigation in comparison to a possible settlement with the plaintiff, even if there is no chance of the plaintiff winning, is cheaper than the cost of going to court and still winning. If tort law was made that the losing party pays the costs of the winners, the amount of lawsuits would be even less.

As far as judicial decision for the plaintiff, it usually stand for itself, although in smaller percentages of cases that reach the appeals courts, the original courts findings are overturned.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 32
12-10-2011, 10:59 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sakarak
Simply having a disclaimer in your sales signage that reads caveat emptor does not automatically absolve you of liability, at least not in California or the United States.
Nor does it create a situation of liability in Californie or the United States.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 33
12-10-2011, 11:04 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sakarak
The bottom line: by denying customers information regarding the odds of winning the ship they are denying customers the opportunity to make a properly informed decision regarding whether to purchase the ship. I have to question whether that is an ethical business decision, or even a legal one.

Simply having a disclaimer in your sales signage that reads caveat emptor does not automatically absolve you of liability, at least not in California or the United States.
If you feel that, than I suggest that use go through legal channels to take it on. I have a feeling you will not be on the winning side.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 34
12-10-2011, 11:05 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Superluminous
I talked to a fleet member last night who spent $120 on cp and didn't get a ship.

I spent plenty of my CP and didnt see a ship either.

I like the rare ships, I think that they need to NOT sell them later in the cstore


This game is a cookie cutter made from a stack of cookie cutters. RARE is special, and should remain so.

Still, $120 and NOT get the ship?

LAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA AAAAAAAAAAAAAME
People spend hundreds of dollars on state lottories each weekend and don't win a penny.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 35
12-10-2011, 11:07 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by McCooey View Post
I see what your saying

I was more approaching this from a "their random generator is broken" surely it would cost more to give me more 8 hr xp boosts which i honesty i would have bought leveling up other toons then give me one ship when you concider my 8 8hr boosts to my 0 ship
Is it broken? I have seen several "dung beetles" hanging around outside of ESD.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 36
12-10-2011, 11:09 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by whamhammer View Post
If you feel that, than I suggest that use go through legal channels to take it on. I have a feeling you will not be on the winning side.
In a few weeks when I have some extra time, I am going to make some inquiries to some friends who specialize in these sorts of cases. They have the knowledge, experience, and access to do case-law research that I do not.

The problem with cases like this, especially involving new media and services such as MMO's is that there are probably very few if any decisions relating to a situation like this that ever reached the 9th circuit court or the California Supreme Court. These things tend to be settled out of court with neither side admitting fault.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 37
12-10-2011, 11:13 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by whamhammer View Post
People spend hundreds of dollars on state lottories each weekend and don't win a penny.
State lotteries disclose the exact odds of winning. Certainly they prey on the ignorant and the poor, but at least the consumer has the opportunity to make an informed choice.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 38
12-10-2011, 12:32 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by whamhammer View Post
Is it broken? I have seen several "dung beetles" hanging around outside of ESD.
Dunno thats why it would be good to have the odds of winning. it may not be broken at all but there is a point were a deminishing return comes into play because unlike a lottery you don't loose you just don't get what you want. I do have a heap of exocomps and horta that i can give away for nothing on the exchange, I have duty officers which mean i won't be buying off the c-store etc etc

there has to be a balance where i don't get what i want too easily but i don't start winning enough of the other high end rare consumable items that i stop having the need to buy them off the c-store i.e. xp boost
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 39
12-10-2011, 12:44 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by LeanneArac
I think people have made some very sound arguments about the ethicality of this practice and the capacity to make an informed purchase when no odds are published.

I sincerely hope some of our Californian residents are able to pursue this matter further to ascertain the legality of the situation.

It's certainly not something I'll be a party to.
You do not have to be a California resident.

If you feel that failing to disclose the odds is a deceptive business practice or constitutes a lottery (which is a criminal act in California) you can file a complaint quickly and easily here:

http://ag.ca.gov/contact/complaint_form.php?cmplt=CL

If enough people file a complaint, there will probably at least be an investigation into whether these grab bags violate State laws against lotteries or constitute an unfair or misleading business practice.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 40
12-10-2011, 01:09 PM
Pretty sure the gov't won't care because no money is up for grabs (i.e. no cash prizes)....the only thing you can win are pixels. Also, you can get a chance to win the ship by running laps at Q's Wonderland.....for free!
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