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# 11
12-25-2011, 11:05 PM
I would like all the Races that make up the ingame KDF to have vessels that cover the types, escort, cruiser, science, etc as fits with thier unique culture and societies.
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# 12
12-26-2011, 03:39 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cuatela
No, I'm not joking. Mister Dee is correct that I'm referring to the Orion Interceptor seen in Ent "Borderland"

I'm guessing you're used to seeing the interceptor in-game, which is portrayed as a simple single-seat fighter. In canon, the Interceptor had a crew of around 15-30, with enough space for a couple boarding parties and prisoners at least.

The canon Interceptor was closer to escort sized, and two of them completely disabled Enterprise without much trouble. Considering the D'kyr, B'rel, and Excelsior have all been upgraded to T5, I don't see much of a stretch in making one of the few canon Orion ships upgraded too.


reference: http://en.memory-alpha.org/wiki/Orion_interceptor

I had a similar discussion on these forums a year ago.
Back then I learned how unconvincing pics are conveying the size of the Interceptors (you basically see something that might be tiny in the foreground and the Enterprise in the background.

So I'd like to add these two vids to your list since they should show (not to you, you already know that) might better those are not just warp-capable fighters:

(right at that beginning)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JdzxK...eature=related

(at about 8 minutes, 30 seconds into the episode)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NF2o2...eature=related

the size of the beams of both the Orion ships and Enterprise should give a good sense of scale, same goes for the scene with the Klingon ship.
Were the Orion ships just fighters, the Disruptor pulses would probably be the size of the entire Orion ship itself.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Cuatela
I have to agree with you here. It strikes me as odd that a race known for being black market, mafia-style, would have "flight deck carriers". The two or three Orion ships we've seen on-screen were mostly fast, quick, maneuverable, etc. why are we not seeing anything like that?
Yes and no.

It depends on what exactly you're doing out there.
Are you on a long-range raiding mission? Use something bigger with enough suplies and of course enough cargo space.

Are you defending one of your holdings? Again use something bigger.

Are you trying to catch a lone combat ship (even if it wasn't one, Enterprise probably looked like one to the Orions)? Send a pair of fast escorts.

Are you sending out a ship to scout the shiplanes without running the risk of being detected?
Send a stealthy ship with good sensors.

The ships we have right now are probably for cases 1 and 2: to defend their own holdings in space (much like they need to do in the Federation campaign) and for long-range operations.

There is again some confusion with the term "raider" that I've observed numerous times on the forums.
Just like many people think "interceptor" basically means "one-man fighter" people seem to think "raider" means "BoP-sized" at best.
However both are not terms that define size, they define a task.
And historically speaking, convoy raiders are not really always small ships.

In fact two of the most infamous ships designed to be convoy raiders (of course meaning, "blow up convoys", not "get the contents of the cargo ships") "were the Bismarck and the Tirpitz.
And even though they were certainly outdone by both the Iowa and Yamato classes they were not small.

One of the most effective convoy raiders of the second world war was the Admiral Graf Spee.
Meaning she actually blew stuff up unlike the Bismarck that was never used in her intended mission.
I won't go into the intricacies of the Panzerschiff concept and the historical context in which these ships were developed but they were, to put it simple, the size of a heavy cruiser with an alternate armament (two turrets with 11 inch guns instead of 3 or 4 turrets with 8 inch).
Two of their great advantages were their speed (relatively speeking since the design was from the early 30's) and their range.
Both factors made it ideal to send thise ships out for this task.
So in principle the Marauder does make sense as a raider.
Big enough to fend off small patrol craft, certainly big enough to be operational for months, capable of repairing itself (hardly possible for small craft) and of course with enough cargo space to bring back "the good stuff" they captured.

The Interceptor (or something based on it) is certainly still sorely missing.
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# 13
12-26-2011, 07:15 AM
To add to mister_dee's point, the Marauder to me is more like an old pirate galleon than anything, so it makes sense for it to be this big, tough vessel firing from its broadside, its crew "swinging over" onto the enemy's deck as it were via the marauding force shuttles to cause havoc, disable their target, and claim the booty in the hold as their own.
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# 14
12-26-2011, 10:03 AM
I think you misunderstood my meaning. I wasn't saying the Orions shouldn't have big ships. Simply saying they should have some smaller ones too.
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# 15
12-26-2011, 11:07 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cuatela
I think you misunderstood my meaning. I wasn't saying the Orions shouldn't have big ships. Simply saying they should have some smaller ones too.
I didn't say you said that.
So don't say I said you said so.

But you did say that it "strikes me as odd".

Maybe to the point of your question:
the reason why we don't see such ships now is the same reason we don't see cruisers for the Gorn.
It's the nature of Cryptic's stepwise expansion of the various KDF allies.
My point was just that those ships still make sense for the Orions.
We're not at the end of the road yet.
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# 16
12-26-2011, 08:59 PM
Yeah, I meant more that it strikes me as odd that we only see these big ships. And I hope it simply is a matter of Cryptic doing things step by step, because I would love to see Orion escorts in the game.
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# 17
01-02-2012, 03:02 PM
CapnLogan approves of this thread.
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Join Date: Dec 2007
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# 18
01-02-2012, 03:20 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by CapnLogan
CapnLogan approves of this thread.
Now that IS good news
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