Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 1031
02-09-2012, 07:12 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by MustrumRidcully View Post
No, it is not stupid to bring up budget. The budget affects what is feasible to achieve. Again - a large car manufacturer can afford many different models. These models in the MMO world would be something like content - e.g. missions, game mods, maps, voice overs. A smaller car manufacturer cannot afford to develop so many models, a smaller MMO creator cannot create as much content.

The only part where the analogy breaks apart is that when you pay your subscription for a subscription MMO, you get access to all the content, while that doesn't happen with a car manufacturer. (Maybe a car rental would be a better example? If car rentals had flat rates).
Really not sure what your trying to say here. Cryptic is deciding to make games on a small budget. They are also deciding the type of games they are making on this budget which is quick MMo's that are content light with a double dip subsciption. Unfortunately both of there last 2 games have not been successful and have had to go F2P.

It is Cryptics fault they have the budget they have, as they don't have a great history of games (COX) however Bio-ware does have a great history (DA2 withstanding).

Maybe Cryptic wants to think about producing single player games instead of MMo's as their reputation in the MMo market is quite poor tbh.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 1032
02-09-2012, 07:49 AM
Another thing that really rankles me about Cryptic and those who defend the game because of the budget.

Do you really think when Cryptic made this game they thought they had a hit?

Seriously, when they had the finish product at release, do you think they sat down and went, good job or thanks god we made our bonus?

Don't worry about a second faction, don't worry about little content, lets have the same missions constantly repeated by scanning 5 things. Whoops were not making money, so lets just put lots of iconic stuff in the C-Store so if you want it, you have to buy it, forget about your life-time subs or those paying monthly (and yes it is a cop out to say your only subbing to get onto their servers. I think we know what you should be getting with a sub).

Are all these things down to the budget? I don't think so.

Maybe, just maybe, it's down to a developer making a poor game? It does happen.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 1033
02-09-2012, 02:05 PM
At least TOR doesn't put gambling real cash into their game and annoying server-wide announcements
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 1034
02-10-2012, 01:39 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Storm-Strike
If we both have a business in the same product/service, is it my fault I have a bigger budget than you? No, it's your fault you have a smaller budget.
Why do you always get the idea I blame Bioware for having more money. I just state: Bioware has more money, so they can make a better game. That's hardly their fault, it's their boon.
On the other hand, I don't blame Cryptic that they don't have more money either. It's hard to fault a company for its size and budget, IMO, at least absent of any other considerations. (I don't think Cryptic has been in the business as long as Bioware).
But it will affect what they can create, and even with the best intention and the best talent, less budget means less is possible.

Maybe one can fault cryptic for deciding to go in the MMO business with the money they have. But I don't think that is warranted either. Bioware didn't start with the TOR budget, they started with smaller titles as well, and grew with them. Cryptic hoped to achieve something similar, but they haven't yet. But you gotta start somewhere. And I believe they may have carved out a niche with their engine and all.

I also believe that I'd rather would have wanted an AAA franchise like Startrek to go to a company that already is big and has a large budget for it.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 1035
02-10-2012, 03:37 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by MustrumRidcully View Post
But it will affect what they can create, and even with the best intention and the best talent, less budget means less is possible.
I agree, but that doesn't mean you make something that is poor. I can go with not as much content, but to make the content you do have repetative and poorly designed (as in scan scan scan), then you do have to question what there ethos is..

Quote:
Originally Posted by MustrumRidcully View Post
Cryptic hoped to achieve something similar, but they haven't yet. But you gotta start somewhere. And I believe they may have carved out a niche with their engine and all.
Carved out a niche? TBH, most people won't touch any of their stuff anymore and the only reason Champs and now STO has the people it has on it, is because it's F2P or because you bought a Lifetime sub.

We both know Cryptics reputation is in the gutter. I have yet to read a really possitive post on Cryptic that has not been created by a neutral, as it tends to be Massively journos that give it props and look what happens when they do. Most of the comments that follow any feature, tend to be people saying how poor Cryptic is.

Quote:
Originally Posted by MustrumRidcully View Post
I also believe that I'd rather would have wanted an AAA franchise like Startrek to go to a company that already is big and has a large budget for it.
Agree. I would even have given it to SOE
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 1036
02-10-2012, 04:22 AM
Dodge Viper: Built by a tiny team with no budget. The first gen was noted for it's door sills catching fire, an uncomfortable driving position and having handing so twitchy that it would kill you for a giggle. And there was a lot more about it that made it hard to live with let alone stable.

Grew up to be the Dodge Viper ACR, (American Club Racer), and even out of production, (for the time being), is still rated as the fourth fastest production vehicle on the Nurburgring.

I'm not trying to say that Cryptic has not dropped the ball. I'm not saying that STO is an A-list game. I'm just saying that if the Devs pull the right moves well the Cryptic engine does have potential.

From the Viper to the SRT-10 to the ACR there was a lot of growth. STO admittedly has a lot of growth to achieve as well. The potential is there. Some of the stuff they are doing makes me worry but the potential is there.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 1037
02-10-2012, 06:07 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by MustrumRidcully View Post
Why do you always get the idea I blame Bioware for having more money. I just state: Bioware has more money, so they can make a better game. That's hardly their fault, it's their boon.
On the other hand, I don't blame Cryptic that they don't have more money either. It's hard to fault a company for its size and budget, IMO, at least absent of any other considerations. (I don't think Cryptic has been in the business as long as Bioware).
But it will affect what they can create, and even with the best intention and the best talent, less budget means less is possible.

Maybe one can fault cryptic for deciding to go in the MMO business with the money they have. But I don't think that is warranted either. Bioware didn't start with the TOR budget, they started with smaller titles as well, and grew with them. Cryptic hoped to achieve something similar, but they haven't yet. But you gotta start somewhere. And I believe they may have carved out a niche with their engine and all.

I also believe that I'd rather would have wanted an AAA franchise like Startrek to go to a company that already is big and has a large budget for it.
Bringing up budget as an "excuse for poor work" is saying it's okay to do poor work. Cryptic agreed to do it for that budget so that's no excuse. Time for them to get new people to negotiate their deals then.

Why Cryptic hasn't yet is because the quality of their work was spread by word of mouth. BW put out top single player games back to back to back to back while Cryptic has put out substandard products after the first one they no longer have anything to do with. So if the budget wasn't good enough, then you can blame them if you want to use budget as an excuse.

But since you don't want to blame them for it, then budget doesn't matter at all.

NEXT TOPIC
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 1038
02-10-2012, 06:09 AM
star trek > star wars... simple
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 1039
02-10-2012, 06:13 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Iam_Pulsar View Post
star trek > star wars... simple
Too bad the games sub numbers don't say the games are that way. And since this thread is about the game, we can actually have a measurement by numbers.

Plus that's your opinion. For every opinion that agrees with you there will be same that disagree. It's a matter of tastes which IP is better. But that's for another thread.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 1040
02-10-2012, 06:22 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Iam_Pulsar View Post
star trek > star wars... simple
The way the numbrers are looking right now it's more like ...

Lightsabers > Kung-Fu Pandas > Phasers set to stun

I just read an article at IGN that stated WoW's sub numbers are continuing to gradually slip. I think people just aren't that thrilled with the idea of kung-fu pandas, lightsabers are new shinies, and this game just hasn't put it's best foot forward in ages but was always behind the 8-ball in terms of growth.
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