Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 461
01-08-2012, 07:57 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fewzz View Post
Ok so ive been playing SWTOR for a bit now, my view?

It is fun, so much more to do than STO and hard to think SWTOR is a new release.

But it doesnt come without faults, personal things i dont like.

1 PvP - Utter rubbish, unbanded level PvP, totally stupid. They even call them warzones! total failure on this part. Trooper or Smuggler etc are the way to go here, shoot and kill before a Sabre wielder can even get a blow in, 1v1 combat between weilders is really stupid as it comes to running and smashing buttons, you cant keep a focus on them and use abilities quick enough, once locked in combat they should go head to head etc.

I agree 100% (Commando here); last night I even voiced my opion in a realistically calm way saying that PvP is just flawed in general chat...and I got flamed and /ignored for it..

2 Running around - You are sent back and forth way way too much and you end up getting bored and fed up with it, they should give out basic mounts at around 15 to 18ish.

MEh, I'm ok with the running, it's not that bad. I have the CE STAP anyway, so +90 movent speed. Plus quicktravel and taxis everywhere help too.

3 Map Design, some of it looks really nice, but walls etc are badly placed, noone wants to keep walking aroud a huge map to get to something thats more or less next to them, for example umm i forgot the planets name lol, Tranis or something, terrible terrible design.

Taris is the planet...that is the only bad map in my opinion. I love all the others so far....but my God Tairs has so many days of quests and so many places to go haha.

4 Grinding, this isnt so much a problem, but on the above mentioned Planet it never seems to end, back n forth new quest after quest in same area, they should rip out half of these as there all the same and get the Player moving on.

Well I though the never ending quests on Taris showed more pros than cons; showed that Bioware wanted to give us a ton of content unlike Crytpic.

5 Confusing, so many areas, so many commendations etc, it is really confusing and not very well thought out, it gets easier as you level but it is still a pain.

I disagree. It's pretty simple if you sit back and give some time ot look at it. The Republic fleet has an entire area for planet commendations, and warzone commendations. And there are vendors in all WZ's anyway too. TOR has a very simple com system.

6 Ship Combat, a complete joke, may as well say it hasnt any, how on Earth did they release it like that, completely and totally rubbish, STO is God here im afraid.

I agree, I don't want to play Starfox 64...X-wing vs Tie Fighter or anything close to SWG's Jump to Lightspeed would have been more realistic for a game like TOR.

7 Lag, this may just be me, but Lag isnt there, not at the start, after playing for a few hours it starts to get slower and slower till i have to come out of the game or i crash.

I rarely get lag. I only had it when I went down to North Carolina to visit family, otherwise I get next to no lag.

8 Bugs, i mean big bugs, i spent days doing a chain quest for it to bug out at the end and can no longer carry on with it, spent hours doing a Flashpoint to only keep falling through the floor etc.

Been some patches lately to fix that and....it's the FIRST MONTH still. Compare TOR's bugs with STO"s.

9 Servers, way too many, theres simply loads of them , close some push more players into same servers.

Well TOR has over 1 million subs...and most servers are full all the time. The server number is needed.

Yes all the shouting about it is WoW with a SW skin is completely true, carbon copy really, a real total rip off, nothing unique or new or anovative, but its a proven formula for some, for me its ok but new breed of MMOs are starting to change things, for me GW2 looks the real deal.

Sounds like i dont like SWTOR, i do , it is fun when said and done and unlike STO it actually has things to do in it, so yes ill carry on playing for the moment and see if Space combat and PvP improves. If it doesnt? i can see me leaving allready after a short spell as the above complaints will be too much after awhile.

GW2 is more hype than it's worth really, but yes TOR does have WoW-like aspects becasue it wanted to take the WoW-refugees..which is working for good or bad...

Just Saying.
Opionion in red.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 462
01-08-2012, 03:08 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by krtr
Yes, but you payed 60$ for the game's story, since that's the only thing the "defenders" of the game bring up in an argument. Once that story is over, what makes you continue paying 15$/month?

Let's not forget that if it was a single player game, you could pay once, hop in and finish the story missions all over again. In TOR's case, if you return after 4 months and decide you want to replay a character, you need to give another 15$.

So pretty much you're paying for a game which should have been single player, but the masterminds at EA though that if they add a chat function they can squeeze more money.

I would have had no problems what so ever with TOR, if it was released just as KOTOR 3, but the monthly fee is not justifiable at all, because the multiplayer part is not innovative in any way, shape or form.
Hmm, you talk like STO wasn't a sub game and everything you say can be said about STO and even more so. I notice TOR doesn't offer lifetime subs. Wanna know why? Because only companies that don't have confidence in their product want you to pay way in advance so they got your money regardless. And yes, I know TOR offers a 6 month package, but that's not the same as saying pay 100s in front.

The problem is people didn't come back after the first months or STO and now we are at the doors of F2P. Not many games have gone F2P because they were making money before (LoTR springs to mind as a game that was doing well but knew it could do better F2P) and I think we can safely say the STO had to go F2P to survive (no cups and from the looks of it no content was being made).

One thing that's been labled about STO is that it too is a single player game even more so than TOR (tons of heroic quests that you need to group up for in TOR plus Warzones etc).

What's going to keep people coming back for more in TOR? Content... The main thing missing from STO.

Also the altaholics out there, myself included have plenty of other toons to try out. How many on STO?

Look, it's horses for courses. There are things in STO I like but not as much as TOR. I am only going to play STO because it's free.

I can no longer hate on STO as I mentioned, I am not paying for it but some of the garbage people are saying about TOR either means they haven't played it or it didn't come up to their own expectations. A bit like another game I could mention.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 463
01-08-2012, 03:26 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Solomace View Post
Hmm, you talk like STO wasn't a sub game and everything you say can be said about STO and even more so. I notice TOR doesn't offer lifetime subs. Wanna know why? Because only companies that don't have confidence in their product want you to pay way in advance so they got your money regardless. And yes, I know TOR offers a 6 month package, but that's not the same as saying pay 100s in front.

The problem is people didn't come back after the first months or STO and now we are at the doors of F2P. Not many games have gone F2P because they were making money before (LoTR springs to mind as a game that was doing well but knew it could do better F2P) and I think we can safely say the STO had to go F2P to survive (no cups and from the looks of it no content was being made).

One thing that's been labled about STO is that it too is a single player game even more so than TOR (tons of heroic quests that you need to group up for in TOR plus Warzones etc).

What's going to keep people coming back for more in TOR? Content... The main thing missing from STO.

Also the altaholics out there, myself included have plenty of other toons to try out. How many on STO?

Look, it's horses for courses. There are things in STO I like but not as much as TOR. I am only going to play STO because it's free.

I can no longer hate on STO as I mentioned, I am not paying for it but some of the garbage people are saying about TOR either means they haven't played it or it didn't come up to their own expectations. A bit like another game I could mention.
No one had a gun at people's heads to make them buy a life sub. That's one aspect. Another aspect is that, if you think about it, it's been 2 years since release.
A 15$ per month means that after 1 year and 5 months, all life subs got their money worth (in subscription time).

Now that we got that out of the way... :

How much content do you think you will get to be worth the 15$ a month in TOR? I'll tell you, not much.
Because every month you'll be paying 1/4 of the initial game price, while receiving content like 2-3 missions (voice acting will make things longer to complete - and more money).

I will give you some "inside" news. Take them with a grain a salt if you wish.
I have a buddy who is currently working as a tester for EA. He and his team were some of the first to play TOR, so he started to like it.
Last week, we had a conversation about TOR, STO and EVE and among other things he told me that they've received a very very early alpha build for a TOR expansion, which will not be free. Apparently they will use Blizzard's method of releasing expansions.
That is the content you will receive, at best, not worth the 15$ per month, but as a separate 30-40$ purchase. Their testing deadline is a little unclear, but he told me that it will end sometime this Autumn.

PS - off-topic: When I asked him how the hell does a developer start working on an expansion right after a game's release (which means less resources and time allocated for the live content), he told me that it is something normal these days for most big-name devs (he worked for Ubi and Activision before as a testing manager/coordinator).

To my knowledge, Cryptic did add the featured episodes and everything else for free. Sure, it took them a while, but we got them eventually.
If you put both games side by side, you will see two things:

1.STO/Cryptic had way less money than EAware. It means less money for the development, less money for buying the so-called "reviewers" who gave TOR a 9/10 even if it was out for like 4 days, and less money for advertising, meaning less players and less motivation to go on. Regardless of all those problems, STO is alive and kicking, possibly looking at a rebirth once f2p hits.

2.TOR had all the time in the world to take a look at the competition and try to really come out with something unique and interesting.
I see the excuse "the game is released recently, so be patient, because they will eventually add more content."
My reaction to that is "what the hell did they wait for in the 5 years the game was in dev?" Couldn't they just take a look at the competition and come up with a new game, rather than using the same old tired themepark recipe?

I'm sorry but I can't help to notice that this was Bioware's (excellent) idea for KOTOR3, until EA came and told them "you're gonna make a mmo out of it".
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 464
01-08-2012, 03:38 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by krtr
No one had a gun at people's heads to make them buy a life sub. That's one aspect. Another aspect is that, if you think about it, it's been 2 years since release.
A 15$ per month means that after 1 year and 5 months, all life subs got their money worth (in subscription time).

Now that we got that out of the way... :

How much content do you think you will get to be worth the 15$ a month in TOR? I'll tell you, not much.
Because every month you'll be paying 1/4 of the initial game price, while receiving content like 2-3 missions (voice acting will make things longer to complete - and more money).

I will give you some "inside" news. Take them with a grain a salt if you wish.
I have a buddy who is currently working as a tester for EA. He and his team were some of the first to play TOR, so he started to like it.
Last week, we had a conversation about TOR, STO and EVE and among other things he told me that they've received a very very early alpha build for a TOR expansion, which will not be free.
That is the content you will receive, at best, not worth the 15$ per month, but as a separate 30-40$ purchase. Their testing deadline is a little unclear, but he told me that it will end sometime this Autumn.

To my knowledge, Cryptic did add the featured episodes and everything else for free. Sure, it took them a while, but we got them eventually.
If you put both games side by side, you will see two things:

1.STO/Cryptic had way less money than EAware. It means less money for the development, less money for buying the so-called "reviewers" who gave TOR a 9/10 even if it was out for like 4 days, and less money for advertising, meaning less players and less motivation to go on. Regardless of all those problems, STO is alive and kicking, possibly looking at a rebirth once f2p hits.

2.TOR had all the time in the world to take a look at the competition and try to really come out with something unique and interesting.
I see the excuse "the game is released recently, so be patient, because they will eventually add more content."
My reaction to that is "what the hell did they wait for in the 5 years the game was in dev?" Couldn't they just take a look at the competition and come up with a new game, rather than using the same old tired themepark recipe?
All lifetime subs got their monies worth "IF" they were playing the game for a year and a half. I am sure if you asked, a lot of those lifetime subbers would have loved to have not played when they were not playing like those who subbed monthly and left and came back as and when they wanted too. So no, I don't buy into the thought that if you got a lifetime sub you got your monies worth. But hey, I don't know and neither do you.

And as to the rest of your post, I gave up reading. Want to know why. You don't like TOR. I get it. But right now, millions are and are having fun. If I get bored in a month, I will play something else, but so far I don't see that happening. STO left me feeling hollow after I reached max level in 3 weeks of casual play. TOR so far I haven't even scratched the surface so as far as I am concerned, it has already passed my expectations. I loved U/O, I loved E/Q and I loved WoW. To me TOR is just the next MMo that is going to suck up my time. To bad STO couldn't and never will.

STO is the game I will play as a single player 30 mins pew pew. That's it. TOR is my main.

Enjoy your STO, I will for the basic game it is.

Cheers.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 465
01-08-2012, 03:43 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Solomace View Post
All lifetime subs got their monies worth "IF" they were playing the game for a year and a half. I am sure if you asked, a lot of those lifetime subbers would have loved to have not played when they were not playing like those who subbed monthly and left and came back as and when they wanted too. So no, I don't buy into the thought that if you got a lifetime sub you got your monies worth. But hey, I don't know and neither do you.

And as to the rest of your post, I gave up reading. Want to know why. You don't like TOR. I get it. But right now, millions are and are having fun. If I get bored in a month, I will play something else, but so far I don't see that happening. STO left me feeling hollow after I reached max level in 3 weeks of casual play. TOR so far I haven't even scratched the surface so as far as I am concerned, it has already passed my expectations. I loved U/O, I loved E/Q and I loved WoW. To me TOR is just the next MMo that is going to suck up my time. To bad STO couldn't and never will.

STO is the game I will play as a single player 30 mins pew pew. That's it. TOR is my main.

Enjoy your STO, I will for the basic game it is.

Cheers.
You don't care what I just wrote, but you bother replying. That's...interesting.

Millions of people are addicted to drugs and are having "fun" too. Let's all get on the bandwagon!

I am also one of the (2) millions who bought the game so far, and I've quit it after going through the (well done) single player storyline experience. So did/will others. So stating that there are still millions of people playing TOR is an overstatement.

Was it worth the 60$? Yes, it was, but I can't say the same about paying a quarter of that monthly just to experience the "heroic" dungeon content, which I can find in any free Asian mmo out there.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 466
01-08-2012, 04:11 PM
^ How about this, 3rd party stepping in and asking to take this arguement outside the thread.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I got a Collector's Edition of TOR, to me, was it worth it. Hell yes. The bonus of a security key was a good aspect as well.

Story. I actually listen to all the quests and don't skip at all. Why? I want to honor all the work Bioware put into TOR and to get my money's worth. I'm nearly level 39, but in general, the stories for my one class alone will be enough entertainment for months, let alone alts I'll make in te near future.

Whne I see negative posts on TOR, it's mainly about PvP, space, or the opinion that it is WoW with lasers. My response is alway that if one willing to try to truey look into something instead of forming a fast bias and sticking with a negative view...why play? I mean that form a customer stance. Why would you use X product if it truely brought you nothing but anger?

It's only the first half month of TOR, and with the first real update coming this month nad more realistic promises of new content for TOR, I can see fixes alongside the new content that'll improve the overall opinion.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 467
01-09-2012, 12:40 AM
If TOR really is just WoW in space, I wonder if I should give WoW another try. But the time I tested it out, the starter missions were weak and boring. Maybe I am colored by my Sith Inquistor's starter quest. But basically the first relevant NPC I meet has a personality - and I hate him. I was immediately emotionally engaged.

So I think, yes, the voice acting and the story writing makes a big impact on whether this is "WoW in Space" or its own thing that uniquely appeals to me.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 468
01-09-2012, 04:31 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by MustrumRidcully View Post
If TOR really is just WoW in space, I wonder if I should give WoW another try. But the time I tested it out, the starter missions were weak and boring. Maybe I am colored by my Sith Inquistor's starter quest. But basically the first relevant NPC I meet has a personality - and I hate him. I was immediately emotionally engaged.

So I think, yes, the voice acting and the story writing makes a big impact on whether this is "WoW in Space" or its own thing that uniquely appeals to me.
I played WoW from the start and only left it after I completed Cata as I got bored. But 5 years plus of playing was well worth it. This is and isn't WoW in space and the only reason people say this is because WoW took alot of elements from other MMo's and made the game fun, easier and casual friendly and that's what TOR is aiming for. EQ and U/O and **** were never casual and were not easy but they certainly were fun (hard core MMoer here).

Having said that, since BC I have never read any quest text (unless I got stuck on the quest and had to read it). With TOR, every quest I do I listen to the VO and like you, I too get emotionally engaged. Even the standard kill 5 rats doesn't seem as boring because I know why I have to kill 5 rats and it generally has a reason on the chain quest or overall class quest.

I think after playing TOR though, it would be hard to go back to WoW or even try it new, as V/O and story is a pretty big thing now. Well for me it is.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 469
01-10-2012, 02:27 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Solomace View Post
... I think after playing TOR though, it would be hard to go back to WoW or even try it new, as V/O and story is a pretty big thing now. Well for me it is.
In essence, games like Mass Effect and now TOR has paved the way for BIG Budget MMO"s - They have taken a milestone for the genre, in regards to game interaction & participation, while at the same time remaining true to the MMO spirit.

Expect other games to follow suit - I won't be surprise if Blizzard develops a large voice interactive MMO like TOR., but with a smaller budget. All Blizzard needs to do is hire good talented actors that aren't necessarily well known, which wasn't the case with TOR.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 470
01-10-2012, 03:20 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by BlackV7
In essence, games like Mass Effect and now TOR has paved the way for BIG Budget MMO"s - They have taken a milestone for the genre, in regards to game interaction & participation, while at the same time remaining true to the MMO spirit.

Expect other games to follow suit - I won't be surprise if Blizzard develops a large voice interactive MMO like TOR., but with a smaller budget. All Blizzard needs to do is hire good talented actors that aren't necessarily well known, which wasn't the case with TOR.
Wouldn't surprise me in the least if "Titan" Blizz secret MMo, is once again taking the best bit's from other MMos and doing their thing with it. Fully V/O with Story.

They are one of the only other companies that can afford to do it.
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