Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 11
01-24-2012, 08:23 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Streakfury View Post
Why did they remove the ability to craft the Delta Flyer?
That's been a question we've been asking for a long time. =/
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 12
01-24-2012, 08:50 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Streakfury View Post
Why did they remove the ability to craft the Delta Flyer?
Quote:
Originally Posted by V-Mink
That's been a question we've been asking for a long time. =/
Because now, they can make money on it, the other way, they could not. Its about separating you, from your money, and if not you in particular, someone else who will buy those C points.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 13
01-24-2012, 09:06 AM
There's a very long thread about this, that started right after Tribble went to F2P Beta...

And we got ignored there too.



They could bring it back...

All They would have to do is add Uncommon/Common Unreplicateable Materials to the Crafting formula.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 14
01-24-2012, 10:39 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zypher2011
Sounds cool but I still disagree. The conditions of play was to get those mats and once you have them you can easily craft the Delta Flyer.

What your suggesting is that it is ok for them to move the goal posts while the ball is still flying towards them! If the ball hits the post, you get a runner up prize.

Tell me what other business or service gets away with this? Developers and their bosses are ********, I should know I am them!

On topic: It's called bait and switch and it is illegal in th UK.

Off topic, I wouldn't pay much attention to CptBANG's posts. I think he's a Cryptic employee RPing a regular player on the forums. Just my opinion.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 15
01-24-2012, 10:45 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheTrekkingAngel
On topic: It's called bait and switch and it is illegal in th UK.
Bait and switch only applies if they were advertising that you could craft it when you could in fact not. Just because they said you could before, but later changed it doesn't mean it's bait and switch. That would be like taking an old flyer to a store and complaining that they don't have the sale prices they adveritsed last year.

You have the right to be mad about it, but what happened isn't illegal anywhere.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 16
01-24-2012, 10:55 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by ainu
Bait and switch only applies if they were advertising that you could craft it when you could in fact not. Just because they said you could before, but later changed it doesn't mean it's bait and switch. That would be like taking an old flyer to a store and complaining that they don't have the sale prices they adveritsed last year.

You have the right to be mad about it, but what happened isn't illegal anywhere.

No it doesnt

The bait is a deal they advertise, but don't really want to give you. If you insist on having that deal they will change the deal, make excuses why you can't have that deal, or flat out refuse to give you that deal.
The switch is when they give you the deal they really had in mind instead, which normally will cost you more money.

Advertising you can craft something when you can't is false advertising, which is still illegal

Coupons/vouchers will have an expire date printed on them, if it doesn't you are well within your rights to go to the shop and demand the item at that price...If they give you the excuse that item is out of stock, but you can have a more expensive version at a higher price, that's bait and switch too, and it's illegal. If they offer you the atlernative item (which needs to be of the same quality or better) at the orginal price, then it's legal.

I don't know much about this Delta Flyer, or how people got the schematics, but from reading the post I got the impression some people had paid a subscription to get certain mats that would allow them to make the ship... Now they can't make it. So in essence they didn't get the deal advertised and paid for. Now the Delta flyer is available in the C-Store, so they can still get the ship they just have to pay more money for it. Or use the dilithum exchange. (using dilithum in essence makes the item free, I think Cryptic have introduced this exchange to be legal)

P.S. I'm not mad, I couldn't care less about it.
I paid for a lifetime for 1 reason only, because I didn't want to ever spend more money on this MMO, I knew I would always be playing it, even if I had a break from month to month. The dilithum exchange gives me a way to get everything in the C-Store for free, which I thank Cryptic for
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 17
01-24-2012, 11:05 AM
Yes, it does. And the circumstances aren't the same, they weren't selling people Delta Flyer Schematics after they stopped being able to be turned in.

In fact, I can't recall any official advertising for being able to Craft the Delta Flyer other than when it was first implemented a long time ago. The advertise the game itself, which is what people bought and paid for, and now with F2P, many people don't even do that.

And nobody had to pay a subscription just to get Delta Flyer mats. I myself had 3 Delta Flyer schematics right before F2P. I sold one on the exchange, made a Flyer for an alt, and gave away my 3rd one to a friend so he could make one. I knew well in advance from listening to the Devs that the change was coming.

If you're so sure it's illegal, then sue them, which is legal since they serve the UK.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 18
01-24-2012, 11:18 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by ainu
Yes, it does. And the circumstances aren't the same, they weren't selling people Delta Flyer Schematics after they stopped being able to be turned in.

In fact, I can't recall any official advertising for being able to Craft the Delta Flyer other than when it was first implemented a long time ago. The advertise the game itself, which is what people bought and paid for, and now with F2P, many people don't even do that.

And nobody had to pay a subscription just to get Delta Flyer mats. I myself had 3 Delta Flyer schematics right before F2P. I sold one on the exchange, made a Flyer for an alt, and gave away my 3rd one to a friend so he could make one. I knew well in advance from listening to the Devs that the change was coming.

If you're so sure it's illegal, then sue them, which is legal since they serve the UK.
If I brought a car and the dealer said... If you pay today, we'll stick 21" rims on it. Then 6 months later when the car was delivered it didn't have 21" rims. I would ring the dealer. If he said sorry, we stopped offering people that deal 2 months ago... Do you think I would say 'ok mate, no problem I like my crappy little 17" standard rims'

If I paid for an educational course that's advertised 'buy this 12 months Maths course and when you complete it, we'll give you an English course for free'. Do you think after I spent my 12 months doing the Maths course I would be able to ring them up and say 'hey I finished the Maths course can I start my free English now' They would have the right to say 'Oops Sorry Angel, we stopped offering that deal last week'

Why would I sue them, I didn't get the Mats, the Delta flyer, or even the deal. What a ridiculous suggestion.

False Advertising: Source: Wikipedia

Quote:
False advertising or deceptive advertising is the use of false or misleading statements in advertising. As advertising has the potential to persuade people into commercial transactions that they might otherwise avoid, many governments around the world use regulations to control false, deceptive or misleading advertising.

False advertising, in the most blatant of contexts, is illegal in most countries. However, advertisers still find ways to deceive consumers in ways that are legal, or technically illegal but unenforceable.
Did I pay for a lifetime subscription... I did
Was I under the impression the game would cost me a monthly subscription for it's lifetime If I didn't get this lifetime subscription... I was
Do I find this misleading now... I do
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 19
01-24-2012, 11:38 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheTrekkingAngel
If I brought a car and the dealer said... If you pay today, we'll stick 21" rims on it. Then 6 months later when the car was delivered it didn't have 21" rims. I would ring the dealer. If he said sorry, we stopped offering people that deal 2 months ago... Do you think I would say 'ok mate, no problem I like my crappy little 17" standard rims'

If I paid for an educational course that's advertised 'buy this 12 months Maths course and when you complete it, we'll give you an English course for free'. Do you think after I spent my 12 months doing the Maths course I would be able to ring them up and say 'hey I finished the Maths course can I start my free English now' They would have the right to say 'Oops Sorry Angel, we stopped offering that deal last week'

Why would I sue them, I didn't get the Mats, the Delta flyer, or even the deal. What a ridiculous suggestion.

False Advertising: Source: Wikipedia



Did I pay for a lifetime subscription... I did
Was I under the impression the game would cost me a monthly subscription for it's lifetime If I didn't get this lifetime subscription... I was
Do I find this misleading now... I do
No, it doesn't work like that for an MMO. Using the same logic, everyone who bought World of ******** before Cataclysm could be suing Blizzard because almost everything is different from when they first got it. Or to use a STO example, you could say that since they removed the Antiproton Weapons skill, you can no longer do as much damage as you could before and therefore aren't getting what was advertised.

The fact of the matter is that things change, and as long as things which are no longer available aren't being advertised to entice people to purchase the product, it's not bait and switch.

And people were informed plenty of time ahead of the change. It takes a whole 10 days to get the Delta Flyer schematics doing the dailies, and the mats themselves only required 20 of each tier 1 data samples, which could be easily obtained from Delta Volanis in about half an hour, and we were told it was being removed about 2 months before it actually was, with additional notes about the removal in the Tribble patch notes, forum threads, and dev blogs.

If you were under the impression the game would always have a subscription, that's your error, not Cryptic's. I remember when beta was ending and lifetime was being offered, there were already people talking in the forums about how lifetime was a gamble because the game could go under before a year was even up, or go free to play. Lifetime was advertised as never having to pay a monthly subscription fee again for STO, and that remains true.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 20
01-24-2012, 11:51 AM
Quote:
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