Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 11
02-17-2012, 06:39 AM
At first I thought this wasn't a bad idea, then I thought; what's my main complaint of this game? It's the fact that all the ship types are already flexible enough that any ship can perform any role adequately, which is bad. I'd like to see changes made so that tanks and healers are required for anything challenging (ie preserve the trinity), rather than the DPS/respawn fest we see at the moment.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 12
02-17-2012, 06:46 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by aashenfox
At first I thought this wasn't a bad idea, then I thought; what's my main complaint of this game? It's the fact that all the ship types are already flexible enough that any ship can perform any role adequately...
How do you come to that conclusion?

Live long and prosper.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 13
02-17-2012, 07:17 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Yreodred

How do you come to that conclusion?

Live long and prosper.
Tanking as an escort and dpsing as a cruiser, and seeing that elite STFs can be completed by adequately skilled Captains of any career type, in any vessel, in a party of any composition, including optionals, even a party of only science vessels or only cruisers, once again, provided the people spec for the role and play well. Actually, I haven;t ever seen 5 sci vessels, but you get what I mean.

If you ask me (and I know many do not agree), the Trinity is the standout mechanic of an MMO. As soon as tanks and healers are not needed over DPS, something has gone wrong.

Making all Ensign slots universal would only compound this problem in my eyes.

I would love to see required group makeups of at least 1 tank, at least 1 healer and the remainder dps, I would love to see the cruiser orll in, mark a target, get aggro and then the DPS follow up and blow seven shades of crap out of the primary target while the cruiser cap calls out another target, all the while, the healer spamming the tank to keep them alive. I would also love to see the dps/respawn cycle removed. When you die in an encounter, you should stay dead until ressurrected or the encounter concludes. That would require people to play their roles properly. you wouldn't see many escorts 'tanking' then! lol.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 14
02-17-2012, 07:33 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by aashenfox
Tanking as an escort and dpsing as a cruiser, and seeing that elite STFs can be completed by adequately skilled Captains of any career type, in any vessel, in a party of any composition, including optionals, even a party of only science vessels or only cruisers, once again, provided the people spec for the role and play well. Actually, I haven;t ever seen 5 sci vessels, but you get what I mean.
No thats just not true, a Cruiser regardless how well played can never outdamage a Escort in a short period of time (not talking about overall DPS).
A escort never can do the same stuff a Science vessel can do, either it has the survivability of a cruiser.


Quote:
Originally Posted by aashenfox
If you ask me (and I know many do not agree), the Trinity is the standout mechanic of an MMO. As soon as tanks and healers are not needed over DPS, something has gone wrong.

Making all Ensign slots universal would only compound this problem in my eyes.
Personally i hate "your" trinity. I think it is just a lame excuse for a real balance. Especially in a Star Trek game, ships should be more or less allrounders. Star trek ships are ok if they are more focussed into a special function (dps survivability or sci stuff) but not that extreme as in STO.


Live long and prosper.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 15
02-17-2012, 01:47 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by aashenfox
If you ask me (and I know many do not agree), the Trinity is the standout mechanic of an MMO. As soon as tanks and healers are not needed over DPS, something has gone wrong.
Personally I'm glad STO doesn't follow the trinity rigidly. If I wanted to be rigidly locked into a certain role I'd play a game that does so (and there's a reason I don't), the freedom to mix up the roles between classes and ships is one of the things I like most about STO.
IMO it'd be a shame if they made rigid role requirements more prevalent through the game, there's already a good reason to have the different classes around, the STFs just don't do a good job of bringing that to the fore.

Quote:
Making all Ensign slots universal would only compound this problem in my eyes.
I wouldn't have an issue with all universal Ensigns, I'd have only one condition; the Bird of Prey gets something back, whether it be a BOff slot, more hull, more shields, just something because it pays a heavy price for those uni slots, much higher than it should IMO.
For other ships though it's hardly a huge issue; the Ensign slot is just flavour, it inclines a ship toward a certain role but it doesn't have to be in that role. Just look at the difference between a Star Cruiser and a Galaxy R, the turn rate makes a bigger difference to its role than that Ensign slot does.

Quote:
I would love to see required group makeups of at least 1 tank, at least 1 healer and the remainder dps, I would love to see the cruiser orll in, mark a target, get aggro and then the DPS follow up and blow seven shades of crap out of the primary target while the cruiser cap calls out another target, all the while, the healer spamming the tank to keep them alive. I would also love to see the dps/respawn cycle removed. When you die in an encounter, you should stay dead until ressurrected or the encounter concludes. That would require people to play their roles properly. you wouldn't see many escorts 'tanking' then! lol.
Honestly, this would be the worst thing that could happen to this game but that's just my opinion. I just don't see how taking away freedom to run what you want in whatever role can ever be an improvement. For something that's pre organised (such as a pre planned PvP match etc) then I can see the reason behind it but for PvE I don't really see a reason why options should be removed, just seems like a step backwards for no gain.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 16
02-18-2012, 01:06 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Yreodred

No thats just not true, a Cruiser regardless how well played can never outdamage a Escort in a short period of time (not talking about overall DPS).
A escort never can do the same stuff a Science vessel can do, either it has the survivability of a cruiser.



Personally i hate "your" trinity. I think it is just a lame excuse for a real balance. Especially in a Star Trek game, ships should be more or less allrounders. Star trek ships are ok if they are more focussed into a special function (dps survivability or sci stuff) but not that extreme as in STO.


Live long and prosper.
OK

PS. I didn't say 'rigidly', and I didn't say a cruiser could outdps an escort.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 17
02-18-2012, 05:17 AM
This game is already VERY flexible and it's too damn easy anyway. Having a few restrictions keeps things viable. Right now my engy id flying an escort, it's pretty cool, but deep down i still prefer my tac in a defiant.If engies want to fly escorts, then fly the escort thats engy heavy, if you like sci skills, then pick another escort, it's really quite flexible already.

That said, replacing an ensign slot with a universal one wouldn't kill consistancy.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 18
02-18-2012, 06:55 AM
If the intention is to wreck low level builds and end-game specialization, they yea... go for it..

If you want keep the last few shreads of integrity of the game intact: NO.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 19 Not a bad idea..
02-24-2012, 06:45 AM
Despite others claims on here, this wouldn't be a bad idea if they had a universal slot, even at Lt. Commander.. To the one person that says that any ship can fill any role already.. nonsense.. I find cruisers extremly limiting already.. sure they can take alot of damage.. but there is no place in this game for the strictly pure tank. In elite STF's in space its all about DPS to get those optionals.. with a character that can survive, heal, and crowd control. That sounds like 4 escorts and a Science vessel. Sure the Cruiser can survive, but it cannot throw out heals as well as a Science Officer can, nor can it also have the crowd control capabilities required to keep the mobs at bay. If anything the Odyssey made Cruisers somewhat relevant again because with Lt. Commander slot they can throw in a Science officer and use some CC and some healing.. still not as good as a Sci ship.. but it can get the job done effectively now.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 20
02-24-2012, 06:55 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by japfi
Despite others claims on here, this wouldn't be a bad idea if they had a universal slot, even at Lt. Commander.. To the one person that says that any ship can fill any role already.. nonsense.. I find cruisers extremly limiting already.. sure they can take alot of damage.. but there is no place in this game for the strictly pure tank. In elite STF's in space its all about DPS to get those optionals.. with a character that can survive, heal, and crowd control. That sounds like 4 escorts and a Science vessel. Sure the Cruiser can survive, but it cannot throw out heals as well as a Science Officer can, nor can it also have the crowd control capabilities required to keep the mobs at bay. If anything the Odyssey made Cruisers somewhat relevant again because with Lt. Commander slot they can throw in a Science officer and use some CC and some healing.. still not as good as a Sci ship.. but it can get the job done effectively now.
I disagree,there is still such a thing as gameplay balance,even though PW doesn't care about that as much as Cryptic once did.(C-store ships/universal consoles anyone?) STO doesn't have seperate PvE and PvP gear/ships.....whatever changes are made to PvE directly effects PvP.They should fix PvP balance,not destroy it even more...and you of all people should know what I'm talking about.
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is Off
HTML code is Off


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 10:46 AM.