Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 11
02-22-2012, 09:56 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mirror-Master
*snip*
Well. . . that's great and all, but I still dislike you twisting my words like that. And while I may work on STO related things in my off time, what and where I choose to put that effort is my business. I appreciate your concern over the Promenade, and share many of the same views as you (as I have pointed out numerous times already). But I think it's unfair to put the burden of such a task upon me (or anyone in particular), and worse to characterize me as not caring enough about the game if I don't comply. The fact is, even if I had been raring to go on such a project, in my spare time, players telling me that I should do it or I else I obviously don't care about the product just serves to make me not want to comply.

Player insistence that something be addressed is great. Players calling out a dev (any dev), or trying to browbeat one into doing their bidding is really counterproductive (and unfortunate if I might add).

I have a schedule of work to be done, during my normal working hours. I do that work. I then have my own time. What I choose to do with my own time, is my own business. If it happens to benefit STO, well huzzah. If it does not, then so be it.

So far, an entire revamp of DS9's Promenade (as I have expressed my desire to do) , has not appeared on my schedule for work time.

This does not mean it never will, it does not mean the devs don't care about the game.
All it means that a redo of the Promenade, to bring it into line with the show, and make it what it truly should be (and perhaps should have been from the start, an argument for another thread), is too big of an undertaking, requiring too many people, too much time, or too much money (which could be argued are all the same thing), to be in the cards right now.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 12
02-22-2012, 10:20 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tuskin
they're probably putting that money to better use. Also remember the smaller Staff size, they may not have enough people to work on that, probably focusing and more areas, like KDF improvement.
Or putting some of the new staffers to work on... Neverwinter?

With a small team, it's important to focus on CURRENT projects. No need to spread yourselves too thin.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 13
02-22-2012, 10:33 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tumerboy View Post
Well. . . that's great and all, but I still dislike you twisting my words like that. And while I may work on STO related things in my off time, what and where I choose to put that effort is my business. I appreciate your concern over the Promenade, and share many of the same views as you (as I have pointed out numerous times already). But I think it's unfair to put the burden of such a task upon me (or anyone in particular), and worse to characterize me as not caring enough about the game if I don't comply. The fact is, even if I had been raring to go on such a project, in my spare time, players telling me that I should do it or I else I obviously don't care about the product just serves to make me not want to comply.

Player insistence that something be addressed is great. Players calling out a dev (any dev), or trying to browbeat one into doing their bidding is really counterproductive (and unfortunate if I might add).

I have a schedule of work to be done, during my normal working hours. I do that work. I then have my own time. What I choose to do with my own time, is my own business. If it happens to benefit STO, well huzzah. If it does not, then so be it.

So far, an entire revamp of DS9's Promenade (as I have expressed my desire to do) , has not appeared on my schedule for work time.

This does not mean it never will, it does not mean the devs don't care about the game.
All it means that a redo of the Promenade, to bring it into line with the show, and make it what it truly should be (and perhaps should have been from the start, an argument for another thread), is too big of an undertaking, requiring too many people, too much time, or too much money (which could be argued are all the same thing), to be in the cards right now.
I can respect this position. The real problem here is that too many people see the devs as gamers on the other side of the coin. As in we are the ones who play the game how we see fit, and you devs are the ones who make it how you see fit, and that somehow, what we want can influnence what you guys want and that's all that needs to happen. They do not seem to really get it that you guys answer to bosses that thell you what you will and will not do, and that a dev who bucks the system could find himself looking for another job.

What I wish is for the decision makers, and those whose power it is to loosen the purse strings, to care enough to put things like this on the to-do list. And what is truly sad is that there is nothing we can say to sway them. The only input from us they recognize is the money we pay for C-Store fluff and keys to open the lottery boxes, but they only seem to be motivated to direct the development of more fluff and cash grabs.

Let me interject that I have been buying the lockboxes from the exchange and systematically destroying them. My contribution of that service today cause the lock box price on the exchange to hit 100ec for a while. I plan on doing it again tomorrow, where I plan to shoot for 200ec. And just think. Each one I destroy is one less box that needs a key.

I have made a pledge and I mean to keep it. I will spend no money on STO, not for keys, not for fluff items, not for ANYTHING on the C-Store until STO becomes the game that Jack Emmert described when it was first revealed.

The featutred Episodes are great, but missions are not all the game needs. If you guys add a thousand new messages tomorrow, it still won't be enough. In short order, people will plow through it and demand more.

And redesigning interiors, while cool and all that, will not make up for what STO truly lacks: a solid endgame mechanic that provides meaningful gameplay to everyone who participates. I am putting together a detailed concept which I will post on my own website when I am done, and will share the link when it is up.

You developers are at the mercy of executives who care very little about anything but dollar signs. Some of them may be Star Trek fans, but they are business people. And just like any members of any workforce, you deserve the right to do on your own time whatever you wish. I commend those of you who do choose to do work for STO even when you don't have to. It says that you guys know what should be done even though your bosses lack the foresight to prioritize it, and you know that unless you do what you can to see it done, then it will never happen. My hat is off to any of you who do that.

But for any of us to assume for one minute that you or any of the other devs should feel obligated in the slightest to spend your own personal time working on STO is just wrong. Anyone who would do that needs to make it a point to go into their place of work on their off day and vollunteer their time. I doubt they will be so quick to do that.

You guys keep doing whatever you can within the bounds you are required to observe. It is appreciated.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 14
02-22-2012, 10:43 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Darkthunder View Post
Or putting some of the new staffers to work on... Neverwinter?

With a small team, it's important to focus on CURRENT projects. No need to spread yourselves too thin.
What makes you think Tumerboy has in any way, shape or form..., a say in decisions of this nature???

Not only are you preachin' to the choir... but yer barking up the wrong tree.





TB, despite the nonsense that you may have to put up with around here more often than not...,

Please know that there are many more of Us that deeply appreciate everything you do to make this game enjoyable.

And also, ... all the time that you spend here on the forums...,

...putting up with our crap.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 15
02-22-2012, 11:31 PM
Quote:
I have made a pledge and I mean to keep it. I will spend no money on STO, not for keys, not for fluff items, not for ANYTHING on the C-Store until STO becomes the game that Jack Emmert described when it was first revealed.

This post has been edited to remove content which violates the Perfect World Entertainment Community Rules and Policies . ~ Suricata
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 16
02-22-2012, 11:35 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Darkthunder View Post
Curiously, Cryptic supposedly is getting lots of money support from PWE, as well as the lockbox/grab-bag money scams... Still not enough in the budget for a canon DS9 interior?
With finite personnel and resources, choose one:
  • Content
  • Re-re-redesign of DS9
    • little tweaks occurred during the past year: Sisko's office, Quarks lighting, promenade texture improvements, etc.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 17 Let's not get negative.
02-22-2012, 11:49 PM
C'mon peeps. We don't have to take this down a dark alley. I was just watchin some DS9 and thought it would be nice to see Odo's Office. I was hoping to post here, get a Dev to notice, and maybe find out if it is even possible. If its something thats been asked before, then I apologize for opening old wounds. I just thought it would be cool thats all.

Let try to stay positive, that way, maybe a Dev would happilly take this thread to thier boss and say:

Hey, some players had a nice idea about DS9 that I would like to do. Look at how many positive responses this thread has gotten. You think I can take some time and show you a rough idea I got on it?

Instead of showing one of his friends at work and saying:

Look at how the players are flaming me about an idea I already took to boss man a while back and he shot it down cause he felt players were more interested in other things right now, see if I ever try to get THIS idea going again sheesh!

So, positive responses, and maybe we can get someone to take notice in a positive way
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 18
02-23-2012, 12:06 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by DaveyNY View Post
What makes you think Tumerboy has in any way, shape or form..., a say in decisions of this nature???

Not only are you preachin' to the choir... but yer barking up the wrong tree.
Let me turn this around...

In the post of mine that you quoted, What makes you think that I was referring specifically to Tumerboy ? I make general postings, based on an assumption that multiple people in the development team may or may not read it. Don't presume to believe that everything I say is directed towards a single person.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Darren_Kitlor
With finite personnel and resources, choose one:
  • Content
  • Re-re-redesign of DS9
    • little tweaks occurred during the past year: Sisko's office, Quarks lighting, promenade texture improvements, etc.
The "Cryptic Defense Force" seem to think that "Re-re-redesigning DS9" is in it's own right, a form of Content. So I fail to see how doing one thing, precludes the other.

Finite personnel and resources: Where are the facts on this? From everything Cryptic has been saying since the acquisition by PWE, it seems Cryptic is getting alot of financial support from PWE. Enough so, to start hiring people. "Limited personnel" should be a thing of the past, by that definition.

TL;DR: Cryptic "Had" limited personnel during the Year of Hell (2011). Now that the acquisition by PWE is completed, they are fully free to re-hire new personnel.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 19
02-23-2012, 12:10 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Commander_Prescott
C'mon peeps. We don't have to take this down a dark alley. I was just watchin some DS9 and thought it would be nice to see Odo's Office. I was hoping to post here, get a Dev to notice, and maybe find out if it is even possible. If its something thats been asked before, then I apologize for opening old wounds. I just thought it would be cool thats all.

Let try to stay positive, that way, maybe a Dev would happilly take this thread to thier boss and say:

Hey, some players had a nice idea about DS9 that I would like to do. Look at how many positive responses this thread has gotten. You think I can take some time and show you a rough idea I got on it?

Instead of showing one of his friends at work and saying:

Look at how the players are flaming me about an idea I already took to boss man a while back and he shot it down cause he felt players were more interested in other things right now, see if I ever try to get THIS idea going again sheesh!

So, positive responses, and maybe we can get someone to take notice in a positive way
Sry man, this is the STO forum. Where the devs don't know what "real" trek is and we make sure to tell them that every time they post. Nope it doesn't matter that we'll have a new mission to play in less then four days. We gotta keep bashing them about lock boxes and some T3 ships that a huge chunk of the player base cares nothing about.

I kinda wish the F2P players could post because the same old stuff on the front page gets old fast.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 20
02-23-2012, 12:11 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Darkthunder View Post
The "Cryptic Defense Force" seem to think that "Re-re-redesigning DS9" is in it's own right, a form of Content. So I fail to see how doing one thing, precludes the other.

Finite personnel and resources: Where are the facts on this? From everything Cryptic has been saying since the acquisition by PWE, it seems Cryptic is getting alot of financial support from PWE. Enough so, to start hiring people. "Limited personnel" should be a thing of the past, by that definition.

TL;DR: Cryptic "Had" limited personnel during the Year of Hell (2011). Now that the acquisition by PWE is completed, they are fully free to re-hire new personnel.
TL;DR -- there will always be finite resources and personnel. I wasn't referring to the hiring freeze, rather that shifting resources from one thing will naturally delay others.
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