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Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 11
03-03-2012, 08:44 AM
I only use one torpedo myself, as I use the escort build in one of the long threads here, but I noticed the difference right away, as I was in the process of creating a torpedo boat, heh, doh
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 12
03-03-2012, 09:10 AM
Good. Shoulda been like that from the beginning.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 13
03-03-2012, 11:42 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by landshark666
I've noticed a drop as well and so have done some testing. Using a single Phaser Dual Heavy Cannon Mk XII as an example with no other weapons or consoles mounted on my Dreadnought and sitting in system space, readings taken from the ship status window:

396 (base)
441 (1 - Phaser Relay Mk XI @ 26% Phaser Damage)
487 (2 - Phaser Relay Mk XI @ 26% Phaser Damage)
533 (3 - Phaser Relay Mk XI @ 26% Phaser Damage)

These readings are taken from the weapon toolbar at the same time:

1236 (base)
1336 (1 - Phaser Relay Mk XI @ 26% Phaser Damage)
1435 (2 - Phaser Relay Mk XI @ 26% Phaser Damage)
1605 (3 - Phaser Relay Mk XI @ 26% Phaser Damage)

As I understand it, tactical consoles stack with no reduction, and if I understand correctly I *should* have the following numbers reading from the ship status window in system space:

396 (base) * 0.26 (26%) = 102.96 to give me:

498 (1 - Phaser Relay Mk XI @ 26% Phaser Damage)
600 (2 - Phaser Relay Mk XI @ 26% Phaser Damage)
702 (1 - Phaser Relay Mk XI @ 26% Phaser Damage)

And from the weapon toolbar at the same time:

1236 (base) * 0.26 (26%) = 321.36 to give me:

1557 (1 - Phaser Relay Mk XI @ 26% Phaser Damage)
1878 (2 - Phaser Relay Mk XI @ 26% Phaser Damage)
2199 (1 - Phaser Relay Mk XI @ 26% Phaser Damage)

So definitely some serious discrepancy between what I *think* I should be getting and what I actually am getting; definitely would like to get to the bottom of it if possible whether it's an issue with my math or understanding how these consoles work, or whether the base damage of the weapon in question isn't correct due to other factors.
There really isnt a discrepancy. It only seems like there is one. Your phaser relays are still adding 26% to your damage... however each relay is only giving you +26% of your BASE damage and not your modified damage. Now the real test would be for you to test and post numbers with the combination of phaser relays and prefire chambers to see if the prefire chamber will base its percentage off of your base damage or modified damage. If the chambers base themselves off of the modified damage... maybe it would be cheaper to use those versus the phaser relays.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 14
03-03-2012, 01:06 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Krayus_Korianis
Good. Shoulda been like that from the beginning.
No it shouldn't have. Perhaps you'd like to tell us why you think so.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 15
03-03-2012, 02:45 PM
No it's not, follow the math I've done exactly what you're suggesting here and it's not even close to 26% either on the first console added nor subsequent ones. In fact, we're talking only about 11-12% increase above base damage on the very first console added in.


Quote:
Originally Posted by colonelsanderz
There really isnt a discrepancy. It only seems like there is one. Your phaser relays are still adding 26% to your damage... however each relay is only giving you +26% of your BASE damage and not your modified damage. Now the real test would be for you to test and post numbers with the combination of phaser relays and prefire chambers to see if the prefire chamber will base its percentage off of your base damage or modified damage. If the chambers base themselves off of the modified damage... maybe it would be cheaper to use those versus the phaser relays.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 16
03-03-2012, 03:42 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by landshark666
No it's not, follow the math I've done exactly what you're suggesting here and it's not even close to 26% either on the first console added nor subsequent ones. In fact, we're talking only about 11-12% increase above base damage on the very first console added in.

My bad. Was looking at your projected numbers and not the actual numbers. Sorry... After seeing my mistake, yes... I would have to agree that the numbers appear low. Perhaps you should also remove any influence on the numbers that your captain/Boff's/Doff's may be adding to see if we get any math closer to this mythical "base" amount we are looking for. I would take your readings with no Boff's or Doff's assigned and a freshly respeced captain with no skill points assigned if possible.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 17
03-05-2012, 01:03 AM
Doesn't anyone else think this is how it SHOULD be anyway?

In my opinion, consoles which give a large boost (26%) to a particular TYPE of projectile shouldn't stack (for what it's worth I feel the same way about energy weapon specific consoles), but that both the GENERIC damage consoles (18% or whatever they are) should still stack.

This would make tactical console selection interesting and worth spending time thinking about, rather than stacking as many of one specific console as you can.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 18
03-05-2012, 01:04 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Forgotten-Nemesis View Post
No it shouldn't have. Perhaps you'd like to tell us why you think so.
I posted a similar thought as the person you quoted, and explained why (above), before I'd seen these two posts. I think it would make tac console selection more interesting.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 19
03-05-2012, 02:51 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by aashenfox
Doesn't anyone else think this is how it SHOULD be anyway?

In my opinion, consoles which give a large boost (26%) to a particular TYPE of projectile shouldn't stack (for what it's worth I feel the same way about energy weapon specific consoles), but that both the GENERIC damage consoles (18% or whatever they are) should still stack.

This would make tactical console selection interesting and worth spending time thinking about, rather than stacking as many of one specific console as you can.
your talking about cutting all damage in game in half or worse, without doing similar to defense. that's frankly insane.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 20
03-05-2012, 04:02 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by dontdrunkimshoot View Post
your talking about cutting all damage in game in half or worse, without doing similar to defense. that's frankly insane.
Math please. Or give me the DR formula for phaser relays and I'll do it myself.

Do you think its right that tac consoles are a no-brainer? Everyone simply stacks the damage console of their energy type?

Quick math, even assuming no DR, and not taking into account multipliers (besides, who knows when the multipliers are applied? in any case, % is %.

Phaser beam does 1000 nominal damage. Each 26% phaser relay (lets say 3 as an average user), assuming no diminishing returns, adds 260. 260x3=780+1000=1780.

Phaser beam does 1000 nominal damage. ONE phaser relay adds 260. Now you can stack as many 18% ones as you like, lets say 2. Each one adds 180 (assuming no DR again) 260+360+1000=1620. 160 damage difference. 11% less.

Since phaser relays DO have diminishing returns, that difference would be even less. Hardly state-of-play changing.

Of course, this would ideally be complimented with the addition of some other more interesting tac consoles.

Besides, damage does need toning down a bit, encounters are already too short when everyone does what they're supposed to.
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