Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 11
03-04-2012, 03:08 AM
SWG was a totally different engine and handled ships differently. Ships were actually mounts, totally separate entities from the player model, which is why you were able to walk around inside your ship while people could still shoot at you/have others walking around your ship while you flew. STO doesn't work that way. It literally CAN'T work that way. First off, in SWG, the largest thing you flew was a frieghter, and a fairly simple looking one at that. All that game had to render was you, your ship, and possibly any teammates and/or droids you had. STO ships are bigger than that. They would need to render the exterior of the ship, your bridge, your character, your bridge crew, every level you can access in your ship, and the NPC crew that fills the ship. You think load times can get bad now? Imagine the server having to deal with all of that times 50 or 70 or however many people can fill a zone of sector space at the same time. On top of all that, SWG models were fairly simple compared to what we have now in STO.

There's also another reason why we will probably never travel between sectors from our bridge. It totally negates sector space, which is where we spend most of our time in game. Sector space is the game's most populated social zone. Would this be a nice feature to have someday? Sure, but right now there are many things higher on the priority list that NEEDS to be done before they start messing with a system that's fundamental to the game.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 12
03-04-2012, 03:19 AM
In my opinion, control of the ship from the bridge should only work under Warp, so the sector space.

Just as "workaround":

If you are on the bridge, you will disappear from the "normal" sector space to other players and the others disappear on the screen for me. That will be special "warp-from-bridge-instance".
that would be a minus, I would be willing to accept...

Or do it only with a special mission, like tour the universe.


In fact we need much much more to do with our interieur. Thats such an important part of star trek, many of the tv series set in the ship
eg.:
Crafting
take care about injuries
Bank/Exch/Mail
DO assignments
Store something into the cargobay
breed something into the aboretum
shuttlebay
holodeck
library
use accolade medals for a trophyboard in captains room
wardrobe in captains quarter
replicators
pets for the captains quarter
...
and finally housing
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 13
03-04-2012, 04:47 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zeta_Otaku View Post

There's also another reason why we will probably never travel between sectors from our bridge. It totally negates sector space, which is where we spend most of our time in game. Sector space is the game's most populated social zone. Would this be a nice feature to have someday? Sure, but right now there are many things higher on the priority list that NEEDS to be done before they start messing with a system that's fundamental to the game.
The sector space as a social zone excuse doesnt hold any water. We can transwarp to any missions and we have queues. The social zones are ESD, DS9, First City, ect. I dont need to see tons of other players in sector space, and would prefer not to, as that fits canon.

I have never thought of sector space as a social zone in the 2 years this game has been out. Its more akin to a wilderness zone in the standard fantasy MMO.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 14
03-04-2012, 04:53 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zeta_Otaku View Post
They would need to render the exterior of the ship, your bridge, your character, your bridge crew, every level you can access in your ship, and the NPC crew that fills the ship. You think load times can get bad now? Imagine the server having to deal with all of that times 50 or 70 or however many people can fill a zone of sector space at the same time. On top of all that, SWG models were fairly simple compared to what we have now in STO.
.
They would not NEED to render all of that. Yes, the bridge, the crew/players that are on the bridge and the exterior, the rest of the ship can be left instanced. You may also remember in SWG they would have had to render up to 200? items on board your ship if you chose to use it as a dumping ground or a home away from home.... STO does not let you fill your ship with stuff.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 15
03-04-2012, 05:05 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tumerboy View Post
To be clear, this is less of an engine limitation, and more of a genre limitation. Any MMO will have severe difficulty in simultaneously showing you in two places at once. It is far easier in a single player game (i.e. Bridge Commander) to make this transition. The moment other people have to be able to see you one way, while you see yourself another way, it becomes a problem.

There are hacky things that could be done to make it SEEM like you're on your bridge. i.e. UI Overlay border of the edges of a view screen.
We might even be able to do something like this if you all used one or two bridges, with no cusomization. But when you have your own, custom bridge, in a separate map, there's no way to put you over there, and still have you represented in sector/system space at the same time, currently.
My question is: why is it essential to display us in two places at once?

We can skip between any two points via mission transwarps now.

We are also in instanced sector space. Meaning that if I'm in Sirius Sector #9, there's 600 people -- potentially -- in Sirius Sector who CAN'T see me and just 74 who can.

I think as long as the final destination is sector space, the main point is served. And to the extent socialization is an issue, provide social things to do aboard my ship while in transit.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 16
03-04-2012, 06:02 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sobekeus View Post
Then make the ship a separate character. I mean... SWG pulled it off years ago.
This to the thousandth degree.

However, As much as I originally supported the concept of playing from the Bridge, it would actually take away from some of the awesomeness that is space combat in this game. The fact that we are not fixed to a behind-the-ship view allows us to strategize on the fly. If we were to be fighting while on the bridge, We'd have to be staring at the viewscreen at all times with a limited field of view.

Now here is what I would like to see. We know they are working on making space travel into one huge map. When they do that, then conceivable, we can lay in a course to any point of interest and have the ship travel on essentially a straight line rather than having to go out of our way to get to a planet that is right inside the next sector block over, but the transition point is up at the top right portion and I have to go way up there only to transition and then travel way down again. It's very clunky and stupid design work.

If we can lay in a course and just go, then based on how fast our ship is, we can get a travel timer with percentage of distance covered. We can go into our interior and have a little travel indicator on our GUI. When the timer reaches zero, distance traveled would be 100%. Meaning that when we return to tactical (exterior) we would be in our destination space zone.

We don't even really need to have a dummy ship in sector space. I admit that if sector space was all one instance, we might. But there are multiple instances of sector space, which means that we cannot ever see everybody at any given time. So really who cares if someone cannot see our ship in a sector space instance period. And now with the transwarp to destination option on many missions, it further negates the need for forced visibility tricks in sector space.

If we choose to retutn to tactical while still en route, it should load us into the seamless sector space map and place us at the logical point on a straight line from our origin to our destination based on the percentage of the journey. Again it shouldn't matter. I see ships appearing and disappearing from sector space all the time.

The bottom line issue with ship interiors is that there is nothing really to do in them. I say that we should be able to talk to bridge officers who are designated as DOFF department heads and have them filter on-board DOFF assignments that they would be talking to you about and give the rewards of those assignments a 10% bonus. Put those bridge officers in logical places throughout the interior. First Officer, Chief Science Officer, Chief of Security and Chief of Tactical on the Bridge, Chief Engineer in main engineering, Chief Medical Officer behind the desk in Sick Bay. chief Operations Officer in the Engineering lab.

If I can get bonus rewards as an incentive for doing DOFF assignments while in the ship interior, and it's going to take me a few minutes to get to my destination whether I'm autotraveling in sector space or riding a timer while walking around inside my ship, I might as well pop into my interior and take advantage of at least the on-board DOFF assignments...

Other fixes to interiors that are needed is making it so that crew member uniforms are definable, crew members just appear in interior areas instead of beaming in, if I visit the interior from a space instance, I appear standing next to the Captain's chair or next to the chair in my ready room, instead of beaming onto the bridge. If I visit the interior from a ground instance, I beam into my transporter room.

And please, for the love of God, let my bridge officers sit down in the chairs instead of standing on them...
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 17
03-04-2012, 06:09 AM
In the end, isnt the usefullness you get from being able to travel on your bridge a bit on the low side for all the effort that would have to be put in? Just throwing it out there for discussion's sake.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 18
03-04-2012, 06:13 AM
Sometimes i wish we could turn other players off in sector space =p

I love flying around with astrometrics turned off just "Exploring"

One big map, and the ability to do more with my bridge would make me very happy, and as stated before, actually bring the game more towards canon.

I'm watching the Voyager series through, and the majority of episodes are all based, in and around the ship.

Seeing your DOFF walking around the ship with a set ship uniform would also be a massive boon in my opinion, after all your DOFF are your crew in essence.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 19
03-04-2012, 06:17 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by CedricO
In the end, isnt the usefullness you get from being able to travel on your bridge a bit on the low side for all the effect that would have to be put in? Just throwing it out there for discussion's sake.
Traveling while in our interiors should be added. PILOTING the ship from the interior need not be.

In all honesty, requests for brisge interiors to actuallt server some sort of gameplay mechanic function has been requested from the beginning. That makes it worth putting in. Adding DOFF assignment bonus rewards make for a reason to visit them that is not forced. And if our ship can be en route to a destination while we do our Interior DOFF assignments for on-board tasks, then we actually get something constructive to do in game while our ship moves from point A to point B. Right now, we autonavigate and while en route, we go to the bathroom or go grab a snack.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 20
03-04-2012, 06:22 AM
Travelling in your interior map would only be worth while if while doing it, other people who are there as well could come along too, imo.
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