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Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
I was wondering what people thought about this, now we have had some time to see the new versions of the task forces in action.

These task forces were split into 2 types. Normal and elite. My understanding is normal if for 5 random strangers, who may have never even done the mission can come together and complete it without too much trouble. They might fail the optional objective, or die a couple of times but once they know the rules it should be doable fairly easily on on repeat attempts.

The three space ones, KA ground and 99% of cure and infected ground all fall into this category which is fine. The bosses in Cure and Infected seem to do a 180 and become incredibly hard with players needed tactics and expert timekeeping. If you die there are lockouts, people are being one shotted and its all quite painful. Now im sure there are plenty of people who find it easy and will point out its pretty easy, or tell me that they should be run with teams which is all fine but are these bosses fulfilling the original aim of the normal missions? The other 4 seem to, so why not these 2?

I have never seen one person quit a space stf because the boss was too hard, or have to know any form of tactics to win, yet its a frequent occurrence on ground. With Infected you have to do the puzzle with the shields every time which is boring and time consuming.

Every time I do the ground ones, we breeze through to the bosses and then its a disaster. normally someone leaves after a death or two and the whole thing becomes impossible. Even when we do sneak a win its either by luck or some of the players happen to be very good as we scrape through. that does not sound like its designed for pugs.

Do these need to be adjusted. maybe have the lockouts go, or reduce the damage dealt by the boss or decrease their resistance. Im sure there are many who find the missions adequate but as something that pugs should be playing and enjoying i think Cure and Infected fail because of the boss encounter. They end up becoming a pain to do knowing that once you hot the boss chances are half the team will bail.

Do you enjoy Infected as it is now through the queue system or do you start to dread it knowing it will probably be a waste of time and thus do one of the others instead knowing you are guaranteed a win?
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 2
03-05-2012, 02:13 PM
I belive Gozer has on several occations made it pretty clear that he dosen't care about PUG's...

"The STF's are designed for teams that are used to work together... Not random people". I belive was the quote (so somthing very close).

I don't belive he at any point though one second about making normal ones specialized for PUGs... I am pretty sure he didn.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 3
03-05-2012, 03:11 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by anazonda View Post
I belive Gozer has on several occations made it pretty clear that he dosen't care about PUG's...

"The STF's are designed for teams that are used to work together... Not random people". I belive was the quote (so somthing very close).

I don't belive he at any point though one second about making normal ones specialized for PUGs... I am pretty sure he didn.
i think that is wrong. that may have been the old objective but im pretty sure they made the normal ones pugable and said that was the aim. perhaps someone will have a quote but im sure the fact they made them easier and attached them to a pve queue was to increase the people who played them and to make them appealing to random people.

99% of that has been achieved. the fact that 4 out of the 6 are very pugable seems to support that. even the vast majority of the cure and infected are quite easy and straightforward. its literally 2 bosses that out of all 6 missions that seem to now go against the grain.

i would hazard a guess that infected and cure are the least played and least completed out of all the task forces now. id happy play them every day if the bosses were more in line with KA, or the space bosses.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 4
03-06-2012, 03:49 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Captain_Revo
i think that is wrong. that may have been the old objective but im pretty sure they made the normal ones pugable and said that was the aim. perhaps someone will have a quote but im sure the fact they made them easier and attached them to a pve queue was to increase the people who played them and to make them appealing to random people.

99% of that has been achieved. the fact that 4 out of the 6 are very pugable seems to support that. even the vast majority of the cure and infected are quite easy and straightforward. its literally 2 bosses that out of all 6 missions that seem to now go against the grain.

i would hazard a guess that infected and cure are the least played and least completed out of all the task forces now. id happy play them every day if the bosses were more in line with KA, or the space bosses.
No... he was pretty clear about that being the case for the new ones too, as he has stated it several times.

lets look at his comment about this BEFORE Season 5 was released (it was about solo STF's but the comment stands):

http://forums.startrekonline.com/sho...4&postcount=42

Quote:
Originally Posted by gozer
...

The new "Normal" versions of the STF's will be much easier on PUG's, ...
Now easier for pugs... Yea... they ARE... But he also puts emphasis on the need for teams in that very comment.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 5
03-06-2012, 06:07 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by anazonda View Post
No... he was pretty clear about that being the case for the new ones too, as he has stated it several times.

lets look at his comment about this BEFORE Season 5 was released (it was about solo STF's but the comment stands):

http://forums.startrekonline.com/sho...4&postcount=42



Now easier for pugs... Yea... they ARE... But he also puts emphasis on the need for teams in that very comment.
teaming is not the issue. you need to team for all of them and i have no problem with 4 of the 6 missions. i dont even have a problem with the bulk of cure and infected as you cant solo them and thats fine but that brings up the question of what is 'easier on pugs'.

if easier on pugs means that the missions are still quite hard on pugs and most people will struggle to do them, then ok thats what it means. i have no objection to hard missions, i have no objection to teaming. some people want that and its fine, but if the objective was to allow pugs to complete it without too much trouble (like the other 4 missions) then im not sure they have succeeded.

im just finding we have 4 missions that are pretty easy and 2 that are pretty easy up until the final hurdle. is that hurdle hurting pug teams too much. are the bosses still too dependant on uber skill and tactics that the average pug wont have or know? has the 'easier on pugs' been achieved with these bosses? does it need to go further?
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 6
03-06-2012, 03:15 PM
I don't find the bosses difficult, and in fact find the Cured boss really easy now. I've never failed an elite run because of the bosses.

It's the optionals that are a pain.

KA optional is super easy and can be done with lots of time left on the clock, but Cure and Infected are a royal pain. I did manage to get the Cure optional done with a pug, but so far Infected is looking impossible. Cure's timer is barely enough and Infected almost has a problem with the speed of assimilation.

The bosses, meh. Once you figure out how they operate they're no big deal, unless you're unlucky enough to get a noob pug group.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 7
03-06-2012, 05:29 PM
My short answer to the topic question: no.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 8
03-06-2012, 06:36 PM
Is there some trick to the cure boss that I'm missing?

Using the medic kit, I have to kind of flip the finger to the rest of the team, stand next to the guy while firing off all my heals and hitting him in the face with a batleth; ignoring the cries of the dying and danged all around me.

That... works. But it's just... kind of stupid. And not very mediccy. Like, I instantly die to him if I don't have at least 3 of my support-the-team heals on myself at all times. Even then an orbital strike can still sometimes get through.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 9
03-08-2012, 01:50 AM
I have only played the STFs on normal but always in PUGs.

The space STFs are all ok and if you figure out what to do a joy to run.
The optionals are everytime only something like do a good job, so they are easy to get.

The ground STFs on the other hand are hit and miss.
KA is the easiest one of all three missions and has also the easiest optional, as well as an boss which is more like a standard encounter.

Infected is the mission I enjoy the most. Only problem is that it is next to impossible to complete the optional with a PUG. But I really like the boss fight, it ist the best of three in my option.

First off, only the cure optional is really related to the goal of the mission. And the optional is do the mission fast, which is not really that easy with a PUG. The problem is that it is hard to find a group which is able to shut down the forcefields and knows how to engage the turrets. I have often quited the cure because. Two guys left the team, and I am not that kind of awesome to finish the STF with two other random guys.

I manged to beat the mission once and the boss ripped us appart many many times, before we finally could beat him. He is defentily the hardest of the three bosses and hardly defeatable with a PUG.

And that is really my problem I run all the space STFs, do KA and Infected (always missing the optional in infected), and never run the cure (ground).

Why because the cure (ground) needs the most coordination in the team and has the hardest boss. So getting to the boss is a problem, and practicing how to beat him is the second one, because you have to be lucky and be in a PUG which can actually reach him.

So long story short, you can run everything with PUGs exept the cure (ground).

Strangly enough has the cure (space) the easiest of the three boss fights.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 10
03-08-2012, 08:49 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by ami257
Strangly enough has the cure (space) the easiest of the three boss fights.
Seriously. It just kind of... appears. And immediately gets stuck in a giant ball of CC and area effects.

Really, the kitomer accord boss is pretty anticlimactic too, at least on normal. Vaguely avoid the front facing and she's just no threat at all. The disparity between the difficulty of those two bosses and the cure ground jerk boss is... wonky, at best.

I agree with you on the Infected ground boss, she's challenging, and will kill you if you mess up or get unlucky. But she doesn't fire beam overload directly at your kidneys every 2 seconds like the cure jerk.

The lockout in infected are annoying, but I'd still say I've seen >75% succes in pugs. But god, the cure boss, I was just lucky enough to be running a spec that counters him. The two pugs I've done that in, if there'd been no medic, they would've just failed I think.
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