Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 111
03-10-2012, 06:59 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Yreodred
I am just totally ANNOYED fighting those overwhelming force of Jem Hadar on the Promenade and then fighting them now in space. Normally i newer had a problem, but this Battle is just unfair. Every single Torpedo salvo just rips my shields apart, while mine dont even scratch their shields, is that suppoded to be fair or balanced?


Live long and prosper.
Thats how I felt for most of the final episode. I loved the space walk part, but once the promenade part began it was nothing but trouble. Even with armor on and a 108 DPS weapon with shock grenades I still died atleast 7 times making my way. Even using traps, maybe I would have survived more having hypos. But I dont keep hypos considering I am typically with an away team and my science officer can build health generators. When it came to the space battle, I would say the odds were slightly stacked against us. I didnt die once in the space battle, I guess its all my time I spend in the warzone helped to train me. It might have also been cause my ship the Bismarck, an Odyssey class star cruiser had some shields with a good capacity with a nice 220 regeneration per 6 seconds.

I also liked seeing the Enterprise come in to "save the day", but I ended up having to save the Enterprise's ***. About half ways through the fight Enterprise had almost no shields and was taking some hull damage, nothing alittle extending shields didnt resolve.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 112
03-10-2012, 07:02 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by dmn99se View Post
just my opinion but the Captain of the Enterprise should have been a human
Well Data became Captain of the Enterprise E as per the load screen text, and Data isnt exactly human even though he wants to be.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
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# 113
03-10-2012, 07:14 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by dmn99se View Post
just my opinion but the Captain of the Enterprise should have been a human
I'm kindof in the same boat.

I could maybe see the first non-human (excluding Spock and Data) being a Klingon and think it would have a certain degree of relevance, culturally, in that the U.S. elected a President with the middle name "Hussein" during its "War on Terror." It's that "Only Nixon can go to China" thing.

Or maybe a Vulcan or Romulan who studied under Spock, underscoring that loss.

I don't think the mass audience has seen an Andorian, much less developed any emotional resonance with them. They're obscure. For me, it kinda highlights Kestrel's tendency to scribble in the obscure margins and footnotes of Trek... which is a good ability to have but she overdoes it. It's not ICONIC and it doesn't say anything on a deeper level, which I feel like Cryptic is sometimes borderline antagonistic towards doing.

And I don't get that. Because ******** is loaded with political and philosophical messages and morally charged plotlines. The message I get from Cryptic is, "We're a game. It's not our place to do that."

And I'm like, "******** is a game. Bioshock is a game. Dragon Age is a game. They deal with deep themes."

I feel like Shron, in some ways, represents another attempt to retreat from meaning or saying anything culturally relevant and instead propping up Star Trek minutiae, as if using more facets of the Star Trek IP can make this game more Star Trek as opposed to dealing with Star Trek morality, philosophy, and issues.

And I can anticipate that the response to that is something like, "Star Trek has a lot of action. It's not all wordy speeches."

Story and philosophical themes don't need wordy speeches. Heck, those get in the way. Speeches are not story and generally cause story to screech to a halt. Story can be shooting somebody in the face. But it's got to mean or say something. It's got to feel like a discrete experience where things change as a result of shooting somebody in the face. Otherwise, it's just a danger room scenario.

Story doesn't have to be romancing bridge officers and twenty minute cutscenes. But it's got to guide what you do and reflect what you do.

And all Shron becoming Captain of the F says is that Andorians are cool. Okay, sure, whatever. But the only chance taken there is that most people will probably say, "What the heck is an Andorian again? When did we see these guys in an episode?"
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 114
03-10-2012, 07:14 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by the_illustrious_q
I'll break this down into two parts. What I liked about this mission, and what I didn't like.


* Plot hole number 0. Jem'Hadar have it bread into them at the genetic level to obey the founders and through their command the Vorta. This is an absolute. This is the same problem that showed up during Facility 4028. It is unrealistic to beleive that the Jem'Hadar would ever break their loyalty to the founders. They even obeyed Odo for crying out loud. It doesn't make any sense.
This was it for me. Worst thing about it in my mind.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 115
03-10-2012, 07:21 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by dmn99se View Post
just my opinion but the Captain of the Enterprise should have been a human
Why? I think 6 human captains is more than enough. I'm thrilled that it wasn't yet another human, the federation is comprised of MANY races.
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# 116
03-10-2012, 07:22 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by RandomDan View Post
This was it for me. Worst thing about it in my mind.
It was never an absolute on the shows, though. There are cases on DS9 of Jem'Hadar disobeying Founders. The Ketracel addiction was added because loyalty WASN'T absolute.

In this case, the guy was Obedient until the Founder basically said, "Kill yourself."

All said, though, I think it would have worked better if a second Founder had shown up and contradicted the female Founder. Overall, building off a story like that would have been more epic and allowed for a much cooler overall arc,particularly if you trim down what we got and had a story regarding where this other Founder came from.

It could be one like Odo and Laas, sent out as a probe. That could have made the whole thing very Paradise Lost-inspired. A Founder cast out, bitter, growing up in isolation, turns up at the right time to take command of the 2800 and a third of them follow the other Founder.

Cryptic seems to like big grunty villains who you can just shoot once you get face to face with them. I'd rather see more schemers. Maybe when Children of Khan hits.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 117
03-10-2012, 07:24 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wilv View Post
Why? I think 6 human captains is more than enough. I'm thrilled that it wasn't yet another human, the federation is comprised of MANY races.
I just think Andorians are obscure, as I said before. And it doesn't make any kind of particular STATEMENT by making it an Andorian.

*sigh* At least we have a few memorable recurring characters now.

Maybe we'll find out why Shron speaks in lots of folksy human figures of speech someday. I mean, if you blindfolded me, I'd swear he's from Texas or something.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 118
03-10-2012, 07:28 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Leviathan99
I just think Andorians are obscure, as I said before. And it doesn't make any kind of particular STATEMENT by making it an Andorian.

*sigh* At least we have a few memorable recurring characters now.

Maybe we'll find out why Shron speaks in lots of folksy human figures of speech someday. I mean, if you blindfolded me, I'd swear he's from Texas or something.
I think Shran is fairly iconic within Trek. He was probably the best character in Enterprise. It's more then fair to have an Andorian in the big chair - especially considering how many times Shran saved the NX.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 119
03-10-2012, 07:31 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cosmic_One View Post
I think Shran is fairly iconic within Trek. He was probably the best character in Enterprise. It's more then fair to have an Andorian in the big chair - especially considering how many times Shran saved the NX.
I'd probably try to operate under the assumption that most players have never seen Enterprise.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 120
03-10-2012, 07:31 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by RandomDan View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by the_illustrious_q

* Plot hole number 0. Jem'Hadar have it bread into them at the genetic level to obey the founders and through their command the Vorta. This is an absolute. This is the same problem that showed up during Facility 4028. It is unrealistic to beleive that the Jem'Hadar would ever break their loyalty to the founders. They even obeyed Odo for crying out loud. It doesn't make any sense.
This was it for me. Worst thing about it in my mind.
Like the Vorta, the Jem'Hadar are genetically engineered to revere the Founders as gods and to be unquestioningly loyal to them. However, this engineering was not flawless, which is why it was necessary to make them dependent on the white. When a Jem'Hadar company assigned to a Dominion science team on Vandros IV rebelled, Dominion experts nervously predicted that they could gather support from other Jem'Hadar units in the Gamma Quadrant, and effect a complete takeover of the Dominion in less than a year. (DS9: "To the Death")

Although the glory of the Founders means everything for the Jem'Hadar, they also show a strong sense of honor for themselves. Ikat'ika, First of Dominion Internment Camp 371 showed this, when he refused to kill Worf, even after he was ordered to by his superior Vorta. He chose rather to yield the fight than to kill Worf, saying "I cannot defeat this Klingon. All I can do is kill him, and that no longer holds my interest." He was ordered to be shot for this insubordination. This indicates that a Jem'Hadar might prefer insubordination and therefore death to doing something he considers to be dishonorable (DS9: "By Inferno's Light").

http://en.memory-alpha.org/wiki/Jem%27Hadar
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