Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 1 BaseEight Traits
08-16-2011, 07:19 PM
It has been glaringly obvious for a considerable amount of time now that the current trait system has very pronounced flaws that directly impact large amounts of the game play in vast quantities, quite often in a negative capacity.

The current system:

Each race is allotted four traits with 1 to 3 already locked in based on the race chosen. Aliens of course get to choose 4 since you basically design your own species. With few exceptions, these locked in traits are all ground oriented.

My proposal:

Expand the trait system into two distinct categories: Personal (Ground) and Ship (Space)

Allow each character to select 4 traits from each pool. This would allow your Gorn to be the True Gorn while giving Al Gorn something he can use to help out his Space SUV.

Will players gravitate toward a specific few traits? Maybe, but they already do.

Don't punish a player for wanting a single character that is competitive in both realms.

Sign the BaseEight Traits Movement now.

NOTE: This is not a move to make every trait available to every race. The available pools should not change, just two distinct trait pools to work with.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 2
08-16-2011, 07:44 PM
I say they should give us a retrait option first then they can start messin with the trait pool.

But people have been asking for a retrait and separate ground & Space skill tree for a good year now and that how far that has come
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 3
08-16-2011, 11:16 PM
It goes without saying that existing characters would need to be able to retrait.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 4
08-17-2011, 12:08 PM
I'm not a big fan of giving out that many traits, or splitting them into "Person" and "Ship"

But, I do think we need to be able to access more traits -- 4 isn't quite enough -- and I could live with it.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 5
08-17-2011, 02:09 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sobekeus View Post
It has been glaringly obvious for a considerable amount of time now that the current trait system has very pronounced flaws that directly impact large amounts of the game play in vast quantities, quite often in a negative capacity.

The current system:

Each race is allotted four traits with 1 to 3 already locked in based on the race chosen. Aliens of course get to choose 4 since you basically design your own species. With few exceptions, these locked in traits are all ground oriented.

My proposal:

Expand the trait system into two distinct categories: Personal (Ground) and Ship (Space)

Allow each character to select 4 traits from each pool. This would allow your Gorn to be the True Gorn while giving Al Gorn something he can use to help out his Space SUV.

Will players gravitate toward a specific few traits? Maybe, but they already do.

Don't punish a player for wanting a single character that is competitive in both realms.

Sign the BaseEight Traits Movement now.

NOTE: This is not a move to make every trait available to every race. The available pools should not change, just two distinct trait pools to work with.
Not a bad idea. It would fit in with the eventual space and ground skill tree point split also. I think it has been brought up before, but hasn't caught Cryptic's eye or is very low on their priority list. There have also been threads about being able to upgrade traits I believe.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 6
08-17-2011, 02:14 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by bluegeek View Post
I'm not a big fan of giving out that many traits, or splitting them into "Person" and "Ship"
Any particular reason why?

Quote:
But, I do think we need to be able to access more traits -- 4 isn't quite enough -- and I could live with it.
So you want players with more than 4 space traits?
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 7
08-17-2011, 02:25 PM
I say bump it to five or six, and you can only take at most four from either ground or space.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 8
08-17-2011, 02:32 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Steel-Hyena
I say bump it to five or six, and you can only take at most four from either ground or space.
Gorn would still be lacking in space.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 9
08-17-2011, 02:35 PM
Just to expand a bit on my opinion: four in each area is, simply put, too much, especially considering how many races don't even HAVE currently four available space traits to choose from (and there aren't many more space traits than that in general). My beloved Saurians, for example, only have two space trait choices at the moment. If you then doubled the space traits they could choose from, then literally every Saurian would have the same space traits... might as well not bother and make them all "assigned". If you just up the number of traits by too much, then people start becoming more and more less individualistic as the "hard choices" in traits now become far less difficult to make.


Honestly, I can survive with only four traits, it's not a gamebreaker (and re-balancing for people having four each in both space and ground might be!). Being able to re-trait, however, is something I feel is sorely needed in STO. Like many, my first character was made with next to no idea how a lot of these traits worked. Now I'm stuck with zero space traits (and I wouldn't mind trading out Peak Health for, say, Elusive).

Also a bit annoyed Saurian BOFFs keep getting traits Saurian players can't. Reptilian Strength AND Efficiency: your Saurian BOFFs can have em, but Saurian players cannot. Just strikes me as odd. Either stop giving the BOFFs the traits I can't have, or allow me to select em too (would love to have Effecient Captain!).



Still, I think I'd prefer if we even bumped it up to even just five. If nothing else, Gorn should be able to choose Bite without sacrificing having a single space trait. Cause let's be honest: Bite is absolutely awesome.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 10
08-17-2011, 02:53 PM
And just to throw it out there: there are currently NO RACES (except Aliens) capable of having four space traits at once. None. If you make it so suddenly EVERYONE has four in space, then you've got yourself a "fun" balance issue to work out. Not to mention, there's currently only eight space traits (two of which are unique to Humans and Joined Trill, respectively) as opposed to fourty-five ground traits. Unless they find a way to add a mess of options, there simply aren't enough space traits to go around to really make being able to choose four no matter your race particualy interesting.

The result will be space combat made even easier and needing to be rebalanced, while every non-Human and Joined Trill player gets to choose four of six different choices, assuming they make ALL space traits chooseable by all races regardless if it makes sense for them or not.

Sorry, but I see a massive increase in the number of traits we can actively have as a problem both with balance and homogenization waiting to happen. Yeah, maybe Gorn will never have as many space traits as an Alien a guy made purely to abuse the fact they can have four space traits: they're still the most beastly captains on the ground. The only problem now is that it's too restrictive. I don't think the answer is just fully opening the door and removing almost all decision making, which is what your idea would do. If you open it to five traits, then Gorn get to have possibly two space traits... brings the balance between them and the four-space trait aliens much closer together, to where I'd dare say saying "I only lost cause the Alien has more space traits than me" would be false.

Again, my apologies: but I think letting everyone have double the traits they have now is just asking for trouble.
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