Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 11
03-18-2012, 11:13 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vampir888 View Post
This has never made any sense. Especially because the buff from ET/ST is negligible. But what happened to the plan to create a new shield distribution power?
ive never understood why the clear from the 3 team abilities isn't just an instant clear, the over 5 to 10 second thing is stupid, especially on TT. it can makes attack patterns unless for much of their duration. i don't even think ET and ST really has a skill buff anymore, a lot of good it would do you for 5 seconds anyway.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vampir888 View Post
HE clearing EWP only once is an old bug which returned. Don't ask how they always manage to bring back old bugs... no surprise Voldi survives all the time in some way. Last time it took them several months to fix it.
HE still clears EWP every time it ticks in my experience, its theta radiation that only clears once and is completely lolbroken

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vampir888 View Post
I thought this already has been changed?
From the Release Notes March 8:
Klingon Honor Guard Shield:
  • Proc frequency reduced to max once per 10 seconds.
    This is up from max once per 5 seconds.
  • Proc % chance reduced from 25% to 20%.
im not sure why everyone is fine with a faction exclusive cap4 reg 1 cov shield, that seems excessive. i supposes its because that damn targeting debuff is so much more annoying. im proboly in the minority but i still think high cap wins. the maco, wile very good, still isn't doesn't have the theoretical capacity a good cap3 or this KHG shield has, and that high cap is still more important on a shield tanking cruiser that regularly has to absorb full alphas, in my experience.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Vampir888 View Post
Not only batteries but also commodities and anything else you can buy in stacks. I can't imagine what lead to the decision to change this.... except maybe to annoy us. :p
i heard you can hold down ctrl and click and it fils the stack, or something, it was a dev post last week
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 12
03-18-2012, 11:33 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by dontdrunkimshoot View Post
ive never understood why the clear from the 3 team abilities isn't just an instant clear, the over 5 to 10 second thing is stupid, especially on TT. it can makes attack patterns unless for much of their duration. i don't even think ET and ST really has a skill buff anymore, a lot of good it would do you for 5 seconds anyway.
You are right. ET/ST is only heal and debuff remover. No skill buff. TT on the other hand has twice the duration, shield distribution, debuff/boarding party remover and buff to projectile/energy weapon damage. So if the skill description is right, somewhere something has gone really wrong with the Team powers.


Quote:
HE still clears EWP every time it ticks in my experience, its theta radiation that only clears once and is completely lolbroken
Are you sure? Whenever I get hit with EWP and use HE I'm still stuck in it. But I'm not sure if only the hold stays active or also the DoT. I think it is both.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 13
03-19-2012, 12:29 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vampir888 View Post
Are you sure? Whenever I get hit with EWP and use HE I'm still stuck in it. But I'm not sure if only the hold stays active or also the DoT. I think it is both.
well, if your buried in the middle of the cloud your basically out of luck. HE can cure it 3 or 4 times in my experience, but that's only enough to get you out of the edge of a cloud. particle generators apparently buff how long you have the plasma debuff, i was slowed and green for more then 30 seconds yesterday, it was kind of ridiculous.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 14
03-19-2012, 12:41 AM
Sounds like a good list. Regarding the KHG effect - I am really not convinced that these "proc on hit" powers make much sense in the first place. We are just hit way too often in PvP for this to be notable different from a 100 % proc chance. If the proc is not just per cycle, but per shot per cycle, it's even less useful. The averge player ship comes with 7 weapons and the average PVP match is 5 vs 5 players...
I think the "once per x seconds" part is the important one.

It may be different in PvE - PvE enemies seem to use less weapons at the same time
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 15
03-19-2012, 08:18 AM
Nice post well thought out
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 16
03-19-2012, 08:44 AM
We have had similar threads in the past. And my take on this is more or less the same as then. Only that I'm much less happy with the current state of the game than I was back then.

I'll quote what I wrote in Sivar's PVP ability thread last August:

Quote:
Originally Posted by mancom View Post
Here is my take on the situation:

Don't! Don't change skills, don't add new items with PVP implications, just don't. Instead: Learn to play! And then make the necessary changes.

Let me explain this further:

The game in its current incarnation is fairly balanced when it comes to the grand scheme of things. I think there was a time when balance was even better, but we all know that Cryptic won't roll the system back to a previous state. There are useless abilities and items and there are some which are mandatory for nearly every player. There are overpowered aspects of the gameplay which are countered by other equally overpowered things, so you cannot change just one aspect without severely unbalancing the game. [...]

Dozens of posts indicate that not everyone is happy with the current state. There are things I am not happy with too. But I won't name any abilities or items in this post. [...]

Why am I not saying "nerf this, buff that"? Because you need to learn to play. You need to see the issues for yourself. You cannot see this in random challenge matches with half the OPVP channel in it. You need to play the game to understand what the problems are. And maybe you could tag along in high-level premade vs premade to see this side of the gameplay where skills that are merely beneficial in other matches become a necessity to score any kills at all.

But there have been too many ability changes and new items and also new ships that the pvp community has not been happy with. And most of them seem to stem from the fact that nobody at cryptic seems to have any experience with "serious" pvp. There is a huge gap between what works in pve and what works in pvp - and you need to learn to pvp to be able to judge what balance implications certain changes and additions are going to have. And only by playing you can actually tell whether some additions are still fun when they are used en masse in pvp. Remember: balance does not imply fun, but fun requires balance.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 17
03-19-2012, 09:57 AM
I say we just have 1 power for each lvl no more stacking anything, just make that power stronger. It would make the powerbar smaller

Maybe thats the just the former FPS in me?
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
Quote:
Originally Posted by BobTheYak

- Tactical Team is a great power but it lasts too long. I see no reason why TT should last ten seconds while ET and ST only last five. Currently, TT is too easy to chain, and reminds me of the old RSP stacking days.

-
Agreed on virtually all your points. I would however say that Tac team deserves a bit of a reexamination. I know months ago the devs were talking about either creating a new power or tweaking it and there were a variety of opinions on the matter.

I know a lot of new stuff has popped up and while it isn't urgent it would be nice to see it reexamined. Don't get me wrong, I like the fast shield redistribution of the power but it seems reasonable to scale the duration of that perk based on the level of the tac team.

Right now tac team is arguably the best of the 'team' powers with Sci following somewhat close behind it and Eng team a distant third in my opinion.

Barring rebalancing tac team it would seem nice to buff Engineering team or Sci team so they might provide a hull or shield damage resistance respectively. I believe this may have been the case way back when before I started playing.

I'm not trying to derail the conversation mind you. Yak's points are sound, I thought I mind just expand on one of my personal gripes.

/ gets off soap box
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 19
03-19-2012, 10:34 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by BobTheYak
- Tactical Team is a great power but it lasts too long. I see no reason why TT should last ten seconds while ET and ST only last five. Currently, TT is too easy to chain, and reminds me of the old RSP stacking days.

- The Brace for Impact doff needs some attention. Escorts have been out-healing cruisers lately just by stacking this doff. The simplest fix in my mind would be to limit players to only one of these doffs at a time so they can't stack three of them and get a reliable free shield heal.
1) Why not boost the duration of ET and ST rather than decrease TT's duration? 10 seconds for all 3 abilities?
2) Brace for Impact has a 60 second cooldown. Since VA escorts tend to have 1 Lieutenant and 1 Ensign Science/Engineering bridge officers (except for the Tactical Escort Retrofit), they have weaker and less potential healing skills than Science and Engineering officers. Not to mention that they all have half or 25% less cool down than Brace for Impact with the shield distribution officer stack.

If anything, I think a more valid argument would be for Cruisers and Science ships that have shield distribution officers stacked.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 20
03-19-2012, 10:54 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by BobTheYak
- Tactical Team is a great power but it lasts too long. I see no reason why TT should last ten seconds while ET and ST only last five. Currently, TT is too easy to chain, and reminds me of the old RSP stacking days.
Five seconds should be fine. Even adding a second or two for the higher tier versions would at least provide higher opportunity costs as well as differentiation in the tiers. Of course, I'd be interested in seeing a slight reduction in the efficiency of the redistribution.

I think boosting the other team skills is a bad idea because you run into the same problems that Tactical Team has created for Tactical Debuffs. They have a very small window of opportunity if they are being chained. Granted, Engineering and Science Teams don't have shield distribution but they already do what they are supposed to do very well and healing is already very strong.

Quote:
- Eject Warp Plasma is another great power but the slow lingers too long after breaking away from the plasma cloud itself. I'm not completely sure how the coding and mechanics work for this, but it seems to me like Hazard Emitters only clears the first proc and is then useless afterward. I don't necessarily think hazard should clear subsequent procs, but said procs shouldn't last as long as they currently do after they've stopped stacking.
As with Theta Radiation, the effect of HE on the removal needs to be looked at.

[quote]- The KHG shield proc I'm surprised Fednoobs haven't QQ'd this one to death yet. The shield itself isn't really a problem, but 25% proc rate is far too frequent. Ten percent would be acceptable, but five percent would be better. 25% proc rate for any item is just ridiculous.[quote]

I feel like it still sounds a bit high but they did make a minor adjustment and I haven't played enough lately to get a feel for it. On a related note, I like that they only made a minor adjustment rather than nerfing them into the ground. I hope that becomes a trend.

Quote:
- The Brace for Impact doff needs some attention. Escorts have been out-healing cruisers lately just by stacking this doff. The simplest fix in my mind would be to limit players to only one of these doffs at a time so they can't stack three of them and get a reliable free shield heal.
Doffs in general do, but especially this one. Personally, I'd rather see a system where you could use up to 4 whites, 3 greens, 2 blues, or 1 purple (basically) but that would require a fair amount of work and some significant changes so the way they stack. I love the doff system but there are a few, like this one, which complicate things a lot.

Quote:
- I'm not sure if this is just an icon issue, but the Tachyon doff is only supposed to debuff a target's turn rate for a few seconds, yet the debuff icon stays for about two minutes.
I have similar concerns about Chroniton procs but it's untested. Sometimes I'm not sure that Hazard Emitters is removing the effect either.

Quote:
- Tachyon drones will always be somewhat annoying but they still need a bit of a tweak in that their shield drain is too strong. As far as I know, power insulators doesn't work against them (or apparently the Tet Glider either). Maybe instead of changing the drones themselves, it would be prudent to make power insulators more effective against them and other drain powers. On a side note, if power insulators were slightly buffed, then Energy Siphon could receive a buff as well without upsetting balance too much.
Honestly the 75% resistance should have been too high but the actual effects aren't matching up with expectations. I'm not convinced resists are working with everything like it should.
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