Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 1 Bortasqu' tactical cruiser
04-04-2012, 10:50 AM
5 tactical consoles
4 engineering consoles
+15 powers to weapon
hull 43.500
1 lieutennent commander universal (who can easly be a tactical one)

and the war cruiser isn't less powefull...

isn't a bit too much?

Time to park my federation characters?
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 2
04-04-2012, 10:52 AM
The Science Odyssey gets up-to a 33.3% Damage bonus. That trumps the extra Tac Consoles, IMO.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 3
04-04-2012, 11:39 AM
Quote:
BortasQu' Tactical variant
5 tactical consoles
1 science console
4 engineering consoles
+15 powers to weapon
hull 43.500
1 lieutennent commander universal (who can easly be a tactical one)
a very DPS/DPV minded ship with decent tankinging to mitigate damage through good hull resist capability but poor shield resist capability.

versus the;
Quote:
Odyssey Operations variant
Weapons: 4 Fore, 4 Aft
Device Slots: 4
Console Upgrades: 2 Tactical, 5 Engineering, 3 Science

Bridge Officer Stations: 1 Lieutenant Tactical, 1 Commander Engineering, 1 Lieutenant Science, 1 Ensign Universal, 1 Lieutenant Commander Universal

Hull Strength: 42,000
Maximum Warp: 9.996
Turn Rate: 6
Impulse Modifier: 0.15
Shield Modifier: 1.15

+5 Power to All Subsystems
A very Tanky Cruiser both shield and Hull with the 5 engineering slots and 3 Science slots, plus a 1.15 shield modifier.

You troll OP and if you are dying easy in this vessel I would say look to your skills and build set-up.

or do you fly the;
Quote:
Odyssey Science variant
Weapons: 4 Fore, 4 Aft
Device Slots: 4
Console Upgrades: 2 Tactical, 4 Engineering, 4 Science

Bridge Officer Stations: 1 Lieutenant Tactical, 1 Commander Engineering, 1 Lieutenant Science, 1 Ensign Universal, 1 Lieutenant Commander Universal

Hull Strength: 42,000
Maximum Warp: 9.996
Turn Rate: 6
Impulse Modifier: 0.15
Shield Modifier: 1.15

+10 Power to Shields, +10 Power to Auxiliary
Sensor Analysis
Even tankier as a Cruiser with the added bonus of having both bonus shield and Aux power buffs, plus 4 Engineer slots for Hull resist buffing and 4 Science slots for Shield buffing and Sensor Analysis for just a touch more damage output and that excellent 1.15 shield modifier.

Still and excellent vessel and very capable under the proper hands.

of course you may fly this;

Quote:
Odyssey Tactical variant
Weapons: 4 Fore, 4 Aft
Device Slots: 4
Console Upgrades: 3 Tactical, 4 Engineering, 3 Science

Bridge Officer Stations: 1 Lieutenant Tactical, 1 Commander Engineering, 1 Lieutenant Science, 1 Ensign Universal, 1 Lieutenant Commander Universal

Hull Strength: 42,000
Maximum Warp: 9.996
Turn Rate: 6
Impulse Modifier: 0.15
Shield Modifier: 1.15

+10 Power to Weapons, +5 Power to Shields, +5 Power to Auxiliary
Excellent tanking capability with the 4 engineer consoles and 3 Science consoles and good DPS with the 3 tactical consoles, plus that 1.15 shield modifier. Not to mention buffs to shields, weapons and Aux power levels. A basis for a good DPS and light heal support cruiser.

I think you may need to revisit your builds if you easily die while in any of these vessels.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 4
04-04-2012, 12:48 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Roach View Post

I think you may need to revisit your builds if you easily die while in any of these vessels.
I think to have a good dps and good resistance in my MVE, simply I posted because I notice that there are ships quite indestructible or (I think) with too much dps... Ships like those make obsolete too many other ships (why using a long range science vessel if you can use a odissy science vessel?).

IMHO
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Posts: 120
# 5
04-04-2012, 06:58 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Eurialo
I think to have a good dps and good resistance in my MVE, simply I posted because I notice that there are ships quite indestructible or (I think) with too much dps... Ships like those make obsolete too many other ships (why using a long range science vessel if you can use a odissy science vessel?).

IMHO
[Murderous Rage]The Odyssey is a bloody cruiser and not a Science Vessel that's why where as the Long Range Science Vessel is in fact a Science Vessel.[/Murderous Rage]

Why can't the feds get it? It's a Cruiser I say, a Cruiser.

Now a good Captain needs to work around his ships design issues. But on paper the Odyssey is more tempting to me than the Bortasqu is. Why? Well for starters I'm a Tac in an Escort on KDF and a Engineer in a Cruiser fed side.

But given the choice between both ships for said Engineer I think I want the Eng Odyssey with the Workerbess or Aquarius rather than any other combination.

The Odyssey with the Omega Engines can acheive a Slipsteam with a 50/50 uptime.
The Bortasque with the Omega Engines can acheive a Slipstream with 33/66 uptime.

The Odyssey with the Normal Engines can acheive a Slipsteam with a 33/66 uptime.
The Bortasque with the Normal Engines can acheive a Slipstream with 25/75 uptime.

Does the Bortasque get a bonus to Driver coil so it's faster in Sector space? Nope. So the Odyssey gets 15% shield for no reason, faster space travel for no reason, every Odyssey gets equal or more Sci consoles than the Sci Bortasque and that translates to even more shields.

I guess than means the Klingon players are simply better than the Federation players if you think a ship with so many unjustified advantages is not good enough for you. I don't want carbon copies of ships by any means but what do we get for not having those innate skills? A cloak that's not as effective as it would be on any other ship. And no Sci consoles to help.

Look at it another way, in STFs I see few Klingons in a Bortasqu. And every Fed Cruiser is an Odyssey. Obviously the Bortasqu is so overpowered the Klingons aren't using them to level the playing field.

Nothing like a whiny Fed to angry up the blood.
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Posts: 120
# 6
04-04-2012, 11:45 PM
As said befor, as tactical on a MV advanced escort, I am very satisfied about my performance in pve and pvp. What simply I'd like to talk about is ships indestructible "by nature" and not just because of player ability. Ok, a cruiser is a ship with high shield/eng section performance, but bortasqu has also a high performance weapons section (think about five 30% specific weapon damage and [dmg]x3 weapons): a big tank with high weapons damage output. The only advantage of an escort is just the turn rate, but remeber that a escort do not have the hull/shield resistance of a cruiser and a cruiser with 4 science console slots can use 2 or more eng console slot to increase its turn rate and loose its hull resistance without any doubt.


about science vessels and science odyssey:

I have a science character (bud/debuffer) on a long range science vessel retrofit. At first (before field generator changes and release of odyssey) I was thinking it was a good choise.
But after the last changes and the release of the science odyssey, I think that science vessel was absolutely a vaste of cryptic point. For example now I need to use 2 field generator consoles to have the some shield point than before, so my science vessel has lost much of its power in science section.

The cruiser has lesser turn rate, but one more eng console slot (to increase turn rate or hull resistance) and much more hull points (15.000 more).

With the same number of sci console slot (and I suppose better performance of shields) I can use still 2 field generators and have at least the same shields performance of the science vessel. Much more... The science vessel has +15 aux power bonus, but the cruiser has +10 shields power and +10 aux power, and I can reroute the bonus at shields power to aux subsystem.

And if I loose a science commander officers, I get a engineering one and still have a leutenent commander science officer.

And finally do not forget about having 2 more weapons and a device slot.

really what I loose using the cruiser instead of the science vessel is only the subsystem targeting, but it's nothing at all compared to the advantage of the science cruiser. The C-store should take back that science vessel and give me the cryptic point.
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Posts: 120
# 7
04-05-2012, 03:34 AM
Funny you think their too tough because there is a long thread on the Fed side crying they are too weak.
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# 8
04-05-2012, 03:39 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by DKnight1000
Funny you think their too tough because there is a long thread on the Fed side crying they are too weak.
Isn't there one for every fed ship in the game? Pretty sure there's at least twelve about how the Miranda can't stand up to a Tactical Cube. :p
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 9
04-05-2012, 04:05 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by DKnight1000
Funny you think their too tough because there is a long thread on the Fed side crying they are too weak.
weak the odyssey?... may be the odyssey we had for free has a low dps, but I used it and it has good shield and hull resistance.

However I am not telling that the science odyssey is too strong, I am telling that specialized science vessels are obsolete (or not interesting) because of the science odyssey... and I am telling that if the purpose of cruiser is tanking and give reinforcement to other ships, they should not have so many tactical consoles and high dps.
The fun in specialized ships is their specialization, if a ship became a general purpose one, all specialized ships became useless (partially or at all).
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Posts: 120
# 10
04-05-2012, 10:19 AM
The KDF BortasQu is a battle cruiser by definition and while it does have 5 Tactical con slots it has only one Science con slot to mount any shield buffing consoles. (the Science variant has 2) So its is true to KDF design philosophy in that it hits hard and can only really Hull tank well, with low shield buffing.

Hardly indestructible in PvP and only as durable as the pilot and the build on it.

The Odyssey is better on the Hull and Shield buffing and only slightly less effective on the damage output.

As others have stated many feel its weak, many feel its too strong, everybody is wrong as its still only as good as the captain who commands it. I've seen some that have sucked and some that have not in PvP.

I also see plenty of Science vessels in play and they all seem to be as effective as they ever where.
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