Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 21
04-19-2012, 03:47 AM
Hmmm . . . . If i’m honest, i kinda like the torpedo arc setting as it is already, i must admit they can be a bit of a pain to line up sometimes, especially with my cruiser . . but i just combine a few torpedo shots with my ‘evasive maneuvers’ Boff power to increase my speed and turn rate . . and i gotta say . . . i like the satisfaction of finally lining the winning shot up and letting her rip . . . watching that lone torpedo plow into the hull of the enemy and boom !!!! . . . awesome :-).
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 22
04-19-2012, 05:17 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by stevieboysw View Post
Assault cruiser is the one of the fastest turning cruiser though. On the other ones it can be a struggle to turn to get your torpedoes in the fire arc.
Stop fighting against the design of the ship.

Equip 3 phasers and 1 torpedo both fore and aft.

When something is in your front arc, you can fire torps.

When something swoops in behind you, you can fire torps.

The rest of the time? It is exposed to your superior broadside assault.

Be a cruiser. And stop trying to be an Escort.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 23
04-19-2012, 05:35 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by jkstocbr
I agree that Torpedoes are under utilised, mainly because of the firing arc & turn rate of cruisers. I normally fire one off as I approach my target and bank right to get my phaser banks lined up. Then complete my arc and might get one out of my rear launcher before the target is destroyed.

I think the firing arc is OK and makes sense, but I would like to see the shared cooldown removed, and the cooldown time reduced overall. To avoid torpedo spamming introduce Torpedo Ammo (Purchase from Vendors 5 EC each, Replicate 10 EC, or Craft them on your ship). The larger the ship, the more Torpedoes you can carry.
Excuse me, but why should I be fored to spend 2500 EC for every STF I run just because you want their to be a charge on resupply of Kinetic Weapons?
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 24
04-19-2012, 05:36 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by superchum View Post
Stop fighting against the design of the ship.

Equip 3 phasers and 1 torpedo both fore and aft.

When something is in your front arc, you can fire torps.

When something swoops in behind you, you can fire torps.

The rest of the time? It is exposed to your superior broadside assault.

Be a cruiser. And stop trying to be an Escort.
Another QFT from Superchum!
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 25
04-19-2012, 06:15 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by superchum View Post
Stop fighting against the design of the ship.

Equip 3 phasers and 1 torpedo both fore and aft.

When something is in your front arc, you can fire torps.

When something swoops in behind you, you can fire torps.

The rest of the time? It is exposed to your superior broadside assault.

Be a cruiser. And stop trying to be an Escort.


This. Its really not that hard to fire a torpedo into someone. Wisely timing evasive or using Deuterium Surplus along with counter steering a circling enemy goes a long way.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 26
04-19-2012, 06:17 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by ryeknow
This. Its really not that hard to fire a torpedo into someone. Wisely timing evasive or using Deuterium Surplus along with counter steering a circling enemy goes a long way.
Still using SFC comparison... ships actually turn -extremely- fast compared to SFC and its real easy to spin around spamming torpedoes. SFC battleships took ages to turn (although with shield reinforcements managed right, were much more durable than STO's). In STO we can do 'high energy turns' easily. In SFC it wasn't safe to do that more than once or even 'don't even try' as it's not worth the structural risk.

If cruisers are too slow... get a science ship and convert that into a tactical strike cruiser. Pretty effective in the right hands!
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 27
04-19-2012, 08:24 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by superchum View Post
Stop fighting against the design of the ship.

Equip 3 phasers and 1 torpedo both fore and aft.
[...]
Depends on what he wants to do with the ship. The Assault Cruiser, upon first delivery from a shipyard, has 2 torps fore and 2 torps aft, and for many tasks, that makes a lot of sense, especially when destroying some unshielded structures is involved.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 28
04-19-2012, 09:15 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by stevieboysw View Post
I think torpedoes should be have their firing arc increased to 120 degrees. One of the big complaints with cruises is that they turn so slow torpedoes becomes almost useless.

The higher fire arc doesn't really change much for an escort because they need to fire in a 45 degree arc anyway for cannons. It would help science ships but still not change things because they can turn fairy quick already.

I think this would be a good addition mainly for cruisers. They would be able to use abilities like Torpedo Spread more easily, increasing their aggro and making them a bit more tank like.

This was a quick 5 min thought that i wanted to post before I forgot.

What are other people ideas to make torpedoes more useful on a cruiser?
Put a torpedo launcher on one of your rear weapons slots? Seriously , most ships tend to attack from the back on a cruiser, due to their higher turn rate and generally people not putting mine launchers and / or a torpedo launcher there.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 29
04-19-2012, 09:55 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by carmenara
I just imagine that the '10km' in this wierd battle management console is really 100,000km or so which I think is the scale used in SFC2.

In SFC2 you could fire at things at 'range 20' (20,000km?) and slowly wear them out with full-power single shot phaser hits, but most newer players closed to point blank and duked it out STO style autofiring everything.

It's in PvP that pilots learn to fly very fast, keeping the range open to evade torpedoes and conduct precision strikes to take down enemy shields while keeping their own shield reinforcements to max - since beam weapons will only deal maximum damage if the 'phaser capacitor' is full (i.e., the first shot), it rewarded careful strategic play greatly.

Unlike STO, SFC plasma torpedoes could not be destroyed with phasers and the only real defence against them was speed and more speed and never get in range to be intercepted by a plastorp in the first place (it felt like near full impulse in STO terms and don't close below range 10)
SFC was modeled after SFB, and in SFB each 'hex' is 10k from one side to the other.. so, for me, STO combat has always felt like extreme knife fighting. I'm not necessarily saying ships here should be able to engage each other at 750,000 km (the maximum range for Phaser-1s in SFB), but even something like 250,000-350,000 km as in the newer (and more fun in my opinion) Federation Commander would be much better.

Of course, there are weapons here that have no analogue to weapons in SFB/FedCom (like cannons), so, eh, its not like they could easily port it.

The battles in SFC were a lot more tactical IMO, but a lot more complex as there were multiple systems to watch over and so forth.

I've always hated the range (and no, imagining the range as 10x greater than it is doesn't help as the models are muuuuuch to big then) in STO and wanted them extended, but I know its not going to happen. I like the starship combat in STO, but I'd like it a lot more if it were more like SFC2 (which was the best version, IMO). And, yeah, I know there are 'but you can't see ships at that range!' people, but they could easily add some kind of 'target' box that shows a 'close up' of the ship you're fighting in the UI. And, even with the ranges it used, SFC didn't really have any issue with displaying ships.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 30
04-19-2012, 10:09 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Destinii
I've always hated the range (and no, imagining the range as 10x greater than it is doesn't help as the models are muuuuuch to big then) in STO and wanted them extended, but I know its not going to happen. I like the starship combat in STO, but I'd like it a lot more if it were more like SFC2 (which was the best version, IMO). And, yeah, I know there are 'but you can't see ships at that range!' people, but they could easily add some kind of 'target' box that shows a 'close up' of the ship you're fighting in the UI. And, even with the ranges it used, SFC didn't really have any issue with displaying ships.
To develop my cruiser piloting skills I am moving away from short range cannon assaults back to the conventional beam and torpedo loadouts. I set myself a 'never close to 5km' rule to avoid tractor beams in adaptation to the new STF death penalties.

While I am fine adapting SFC2 fast cruiser tactics to STO, it does admittedly feel annoying at times that I can't launch torpedoes beyond that 10km range.

The sensor ranges in STO are pathetically short too and it would be a simple matter to extend the range to 20-30km and beyond. I don't think there would be much of a UI issue as the current STO targeting boxes are perfectly usable even up to 100+km range (when tracking teammates on the far side of Gorn Minefield.)
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