Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 21
05-20-2012, 06:50 AM
"Community" is a B.S. Internet marketing term. If we're not sharing the same property taxes, we're not in a community.

We are customers. Cryptic is a service provider.

The end.

The sooner you realize this, the happier you'll be.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 22
05-20-2012, 06:55 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by twg042370
"Community" is a B.S. Internet marketing term. If we're not sharing the same property taxes, we're not in a community.

We are customers. Cryptic is a service provider.

The end.

The sooner you realize this, the happier you'll be.
Quote:
The term community has two distinct meanings:
1) A group of interacting people, living in some proximity (i.e., in space, time, or relationship). Community usually refers to a social unit larger than a household that shares common values and has social cohesion. The term can also refer to the national community or international community, and,

2) in biology, a community is a group of interacting living organisms sharing a populated environment. A community is a group or society, helping each other.

In human communities, intent, belief, resources, preferences, needs, risks, and a number of other conditions may be present and common, affecting the identity of the participants and their degree of cohesiveness.

Since the advent of the Internet, the concept of community has less geographical limitation, as people can now gather virtually in an online community and share common interests regardless of physical location. Prior to the internet, virtual communities (like social or academic organizations) were far more limited by the constraints of available communication and transportation technologies.
You know... The word "community" existed long before marketing teams did
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 23
05-20-2012, 06:56 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by anazonda View Post
Apparently I have failed to make myself clear.

This thread isn't about content in the game... or C-Store items... Or lock-boxes.

I am not sure why people are headed straight for the Lock-boxes every time... That's for another thread... Really...

Or has this thread already become subject to Goodwins law?
Unfortunately, it's nearly impossible to discuss community without talking about what Cryptic's doing. As others have amply pointed out, we're reaching (or have reached) a critical point of frustration, such that many people feel it's no longer worth the effort to do more than throw in their two-penny opinions and call it done.

Take the "3rd faction" threads, for instance. I get that people want to play Rommies or Cardies or Ferengis and why, and once upon a time I would have sympathized and advocated for the same. But I just don't see it happening at all now with Cryptic's apparent focus on "bang for the buck." Unfortunately, people are so desperate now that they claim they'd be happy with an end-game faction - leaving me with the option of either staying silent or calling bull (as I "know" no one would be happy with end-game only Rommies for long).

So why do I still lurk around? One, there's still a faint glimmer of hope that someone somewhere in Cryptic or PWI will wake up and smell the coffee. Two, since I have absolutely no desire whatsoever to play the game in its current state, and no hope for a refund, I might as well get some entertainment value out of my LTS...
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 24
05-20-2012, 06:56 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by twg042370
"Community" is a B.S. Internet marketing term. If we're not sharing the same property taxes, we're not in a community.

We are customers. Cryptic is a service provider.

The end.

The sooner you realize this, the happier you'll be.
Then let Cryptic close these forums. Let game development be like it was before the advent of the Internet. Back then, Developers just made the games, we bought them and we either liked or hated them.

The end.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 25
05-20-2012, 07:01 AM
I spoke of Cryptin needing to plan their work and work their plan... well here is a plan I think is workable.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 26
05-20-2012, 07:05 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kolikos
Unfortunately, it's nearly impossible to discuss community without talking about what Cryptic's doing. As others have amply pointed out, we're reaching (or have reached) a critical point of frustration, such that many people feel it's no longer worth the effort to do more than throw in their two-penny opinions and call it done.

Take the "3rd faction" threads, for instance. I get that people want to play Rommies or Cardies or Ferengis and why, and once upon a time I would have sympathized and advocated for the same. But I just don't see it happening at all now with Cryptic's apparent focus on "bang for the buck." Unfortunately, people are so desperate now that they claim they'd be happy with an end-game faction - leaving me with the option of either staying silent or calling bull.

So why do I still lurk around? One, there's still a faint glimmer of hope that someone somewhere in Cryptic or PWI will wake up and smell the coffee. Two, since I have absolutely no desire whatsoever to play the game in its current state, and no hope for a refund, I might as well get some entertainment value out of my LTS...
I absolutely agree... You have to take Cryptics words and doing into consideration. I myself, as evident by my posts over the past few months, belong to the "frustrated" part of the community.
I just also know that by opening that can of worms, the thread will really fast go down a unintended rail, and as such I try to push it down the track I intended.
The decisions Cryptic makes should be the "why", and not the "how", if you know where I am going?

There are tons of people who want different things... I am fine with that. That's not the issue I am discussing, or point out. It's the way people do it.
People used to be very elaborate when they were advocates for the next faction. There were some really creative posts out there that were incredibly convincing... now it is down to "Rommies should be next cause they are really cool and sneaky".

I am around because I like my fleet... But I am also around, because I used to like coming to the forums. One of the reasons I made this post in the first place, is because I caught myself thinking... "Wow... STOked is right... I want to make a post about how much recent decisions suck".
I had it all finished and had it in preview, when I finally realized the OP... Then I re-wrote it to this.


Quote:
Originally Posted by CaptainQuirk View Post
I spoke of Cryptin needing to plan their work and work their plan... well here is a plan I think is workable.
I saw that idea... But did not want to post... Not sure why... Guess that is another issue... The good ideas don't get the community support to stay on top, and get a chance to get noticed.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 27
05-20-2012, 07:13 AM

I wanted to give a long, thoughtful, and insightful reply. I wanted to talk about the warring groups of the "Cryptic can do no wrong" and "Cryptic can do no right" camps, along with an observation that informed discussion still occurs here.

I wanted to, but I can't care enough about this game to do it. I was actually impressed by you thread though, and wanted to give you at least one reason (mine) that some may no longer care about "community".

I've been here since the beginning of beta. I was extremely excited and happy a Star Trek universe was being created. My household has three lifetime accounts and one monthly account. My household has spent over $1,500 on STO to date. I've given constructive feedback on many subjects. I've given my opinion on many choices made in a calm, respectul manner. I, and many others, have tested - and retested - many different things at the request of Cryptic and provided insightful feedback on them. Time and time again, we've been ignored. Good feedback, bug reports, requests for clarification all fall on deaf ears. Time and time again Cryptic ignores us, sometimes (Jem Hadar giveaway) Cryptic even berates us and calls us names.

So here I am. 2 years and 2 grand later. I can't even get my veteran rewards on time, and repeated requests for information are met with silence and censure. I can't bring myself to care about Cryptic anymore. I think there are others like me, but this is my "reason".
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 28
05-20-2012, 07:18 AM
I think sometimes we forget that though we may be at odds with a community member in one thread we can be their allies in another. Many of the people that have posted in this thread I have smacked skulls with in another thread. That is how I maintain my sense of community. I make a point to start with a whole new sheet when I go into a new thread. With the exception of two community members since I joined the forums this has held true.

I belong to an outside STO forum about STO and to be honest we seldom have the drama we see here on the main site. It seems to me that smaller communities seem to engender greater respect for one another as each member is that much more precious.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 29
05-20-2012, 07:26 AM
I think the problem is people are starting to realize that the companies who are running the show, are treating the game/license and it's customers like crap.

When that happens, slowly people start getting fed up and irate.

If this was a game based on a made up/unheard of fiction, it wouldn't be so bad, but they're messing with and bringing great dishonor (heh) to the star trek name.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 30
05-20-2012, 07:41 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by anazonda
We, the community are fractured... There are pro and con lock box factions, pro and con fed carrier, pro and con F2P, timegates... You get the picture.
I get the picture . Do you ?
Do you see that we debate these things because of the simple fact that this is all that we have left to debate ?!
Do you get the fact that ppl are more interested in hearing "pie in the sky" fairy tales in the form of "engineering reports" than they are interested in talking about the big fat nothing that we currently have to talk about ?!

Sure ppl turn on each other when they have nothing left .
It's human nature .

And you are correct about some of us being burned out .
Do you think that we are the only ones ?
You don't think some of the devs feel that way .
Could it not be possible that some of them feel that way too ?
What , you expect them to come and talk to you on the forums about that ?

We are nothing but a mix of F2P "fresh blood" and mostly disappointed "vet blood" .
Do you want to ask Cryptic why that is ?
Or perhaps some of the disappointed players that used to post intelligent points/counterpoints , but they had it and left (or were banned) ?

I often try to hold up a mental mirror and wonder how I sound (in RL) .
What would happen if Cryptic held up a mirror and ask themselves how they got such a fanbase / forum ?

Quote:
When these forums launched, I had fun going into a discussion.
And when the game launched , we had 13 months of near non-stop content .
And you wonder why we had things to talk about ?

And when you have this feeling that Season 6 is going to end up being a bunch of large empty rooms that Cryptic may sometime in the future put stuff in (but they will probably change their minds again and move on to something else) -- does that get you exited ?
Or how about a PVP revamp that is in the conceptual stages ?
Feel like anything coming there soon ?
Oh yeah , lot's to talk about .

Quote:
And while Cryptic sometimes really mess up, that's to be expected to a very high degree.
Really .
I mean REALLY ???
That is your expectation of them .
Do you by any chance also expect us -- the forum members to "be the better man" ?
Sure we get slapped or punched once or twice ... but hey ... , we should turn the other cheek right ?
What's a few missing teeth between friends ?!
Cryptic man ... they are our buddies !!

Quote:
I'd like to see us return to the way things were last year around this time
Oh you mean the time when the spin reached the point that it was used to keep us subbing despite no actual content being produced ? When a certain EP played a certain non existent FE ?
Yeah ... , I'd like to go back to those days too ... . Sure I would .
In fact I do ... , in my nightmares .

Quote:
We used to have some really good communications between Cryptic and the Community, and the community as a whole. I'd like to get back to that.
And you will get that back ... -- once Cryptic gets back to producing content (non-gated story content) at the rate they did in their first 13 months .
But for that to happen , a biblical sized miracle needs to happen .
(or at least a Princess Bride sized one)

At this point , we do not set the (forum) stage . We only provide the music .
If you don't like the music , maybe you should look at the steaming pile of ... that sits on the center stage .

Quote:
Originally Posted by baelturath
Cryptic is standing at the same edge CCP was standing with EVE Online some time ago. The players got up in riots all over the game, including media coverage also in non-gaming newspapers. Finally CCP got their act together and focused on making the game better instead of flooding the game with payment things everyone hated.
And this is something that I do not expect from Cryptic .
Like , ever .
I'm truly sorry if this upsets you .
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