Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 21
05-31-2012, 07:21 AM
I don't know, Mavairo, maybe it would have been better to stay silent. The OP post was kinda... trollish, I'd say.

The reason PvP fails has little to do with the players in this game. It has everything to do with the constant neglect PvP has suffered. I believe that every player has a potential to find PvP enjoyable and interesting. But this game fails at making it enjoyable and interesting for most players.

Sure, some "unsocial" behavior that occurs in PVP can be problematic and turn people off. But this has nothing to do with PvP on its own, but is a problem of unsocial players. And they are not limited to PvP. Just look at the STF discussion, you can get just as annoying people there.

But all that is totally irrelevant to success or failure of PvP. PIck any game with lots of PvP (including ego shooters), and you will find the irrating players there, and yet those PvP games are succesful, but STO's PVP game is not. So it's to figure out what's wrong with STO PvP, not what's wrong with STO players.

Which is something we both agree on... So we should probably both delving much on comments indicating otherwise.
Lt. Commander
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# 22
05-31-2012, 07:25 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by anazonda View Post
For me PvP is dead because of PvP'ers choosing words like theese...

I have no respect or tolerance for that, and I stay out of PvP because of it...
See my post above - that may be the reason PVP is dead to you, but it's not the reason PvP is dead. People that use terms like this exist in other PvP games and those PvP games are succesful.

And I am not even sure that it's a reason for you, either. It's very easy to ignore such stuff in a succesful game as well. You will just think "What a d*ck" and move on playing with all the really cool people in the game and doing all the fun things the game allows you to do. But STO PvP is so small and so weak that it's hard to ignore irrations like that, because even if there are those cool players - their aren't that many fun things to do and it gets boring fast.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 23
05-31-2012, 09:58 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by anazonda View Post
For me PvP is dead because of PvP'ers choosing words like theese...

I have no respect or tolerance for that, and I stay out of PvP because of it...
...and the Dutch?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QJ882QYzr-M
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 24
05-31-2012, 10:52 AM
Most of the ppl dont make pvp because there is no point of it ,yes except glory .Go buy stuff with glory, until they make some system with rerards like all mmogames ,its pointless to talk for pvp, to die for nothing, i know around 200ppl in this game and that all their opinion and theire friends too... so dont wonder why there is no pvp.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 25
05-31-2012, 11:23 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by LastFrakk
Most of the ppl dont make pvp because there is no point of it ,yes except glory .Go buy stuff with glory, until they make some system with rerards like all mmogames ,its pointless to talk for pvp, to die for nothing, i know around 200ppl in this game and that all their opinion and theire friends too... so dont wonder why there is no pvp.
Lol...I get...your trolling us with the same message. I highly doubt you know half of sto's playerbase...
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 26
05-31-2012, 12:47 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by sophlogimo
No, what the Op references is not why PvP is dying. The reason is much simpler: Too large teams in standard PvP. You will see many more people enjoying PvP when they add a 3v3 map.

The reason for this is simple: Once four or more captains decide to shoot at your ship with alpha strikes, no tanking ability in the whole game will let you survive that. That means as a player, you have no influence at all on why your ship explodes, which is just an annoying experience, and such fights are also boring as hell. That is what many people experience when trying to PvP for the first time and what will not let them come back.

In theory, your team mates could heal you to compensate the four or five alpha strikes, but thy need to react within a second (literally) to make that work, because your ship will be gone after two seconds.

Now, with smaller teams (3 being the highest good number, in my experience), this cannot happen. Three alpha strikes are survivable for a good tank if the captain reacts quickly enough, and the individual ship makes much more of a difference then. Fights last longer, and are a much more rewarding experience.
The suggestion here seems to be that one person should be able to effectively negate the coordinated attack of multiple opponents. That being the case, how would anyone be defeated in PvP? Furthermore, one person certainly can survive multiple alpha strikes. They may not be able to do it indefinitely but why should one person be able to do that?

Teamwork should counter teamwork.

I'm not saying that 3 v 3 is a bad idea, just that it doesn't really solve anything either.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 27
05-31-2012, 01:03 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by SteveHale View Post
The suggestion here seems to be that one person should be able to effectively negate the coordinated attack of multiple opponents. That being the case, how would anyone be defeated in PvP? Furthermore, one person certainly can survive multiple alpha strikes. They may not be able to do it indefinitely but why should one person be able to do that?

Teamwork should counter teamwork.

I'm not saying that 3 v 3 is a bad idea, just that it doesn't really solve anything either.
I'm telling you, damn those *******s for all shooting at the same target. How dare they!! Can't they find thier own?:p
Lt. Commander
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# 28
05-31-2012, 05:03 PM
It's not a difficult problem to make PvP more interesting.
We need new maps and content, normal awards. That's all!!
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 29
05-31-2012, 08:54 PM
rarely post on the forum, I usually limit myself to read, but I want to speak my mind, this time.

I like the harsh tones of Mav and I love the wisdom of Mustrum, you seemed fire and water. I have read references, if only conceptual, to the other pvp games.

I'm no expert but I have dabbled, even "professionally", some very famous fps and another couple of mmo.
The only constant that I seemed to see, is that where there is no open pvp, there is a split between pro and fun. I mean, if I want to do a couple of headshot, I am careful not to confuse "pro" with "fun" in the choice of server.

And I'm talking about, for example, counter strike, a game where, taken teamwork and premade out, it's just pure skill ..... imagine a game where, only to find a build extremely competitive, it may take weeks, and for the whole team, months In a context where it is not considered at all by the manufacturer.

Plus I personally believe that part of Mav's speech is correct, players grew by a pve with completely insignificant level of difficulty, keeping in mind the stigma of their heroes of the big and small screen (for all "picard" I have encountered in 2 years, our good jean luc should have inseminate half milky Way), have an huge ego. In my opinion, half sto players stop pvping the first Pro escort they met.

Divide those who want only the dilitium by those who want to play premade, it's a little thing that would solve much of the problem .... I think.

Peace ^^
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 30
06-01-2012, 02:45 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by SteveHale View Post
The suggestion here seems to be that one person should be able to effectively negate the coordinated attack of multiple opponents[...]
No. The suggestion is that there should be fewer opponents on the map.

That was quite clearly stated. Understanding anything else but that requires serious misreading.
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