Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 11
05-30-2012, 08:18 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Commadore_Bob
Before you have a conniption, this is another thread based on getting you to think. This is not a criticism of a person or group of people; this is merely me pointing something out.

************************
Why are you still here? You, who so loathe this game and the devs behind it, why are you still posting to the forum?

I once bought a stove from Best Buy and was given a promised delivery date of a month later. That date came and went and I never got a call from them. I had to call them up to find out my stove had been back ordered and wouldn't come for another two weeks. I have yet to even flip through their newspaper flyer since.

When I am mad at a company, I refuse to do business with them. I won't even acknowledge their existence.

So why do you stick around when Cryptic has so upset you? What brings you back to this forum day after day even though you dismiss whatever a dev may say?

I genuinely want to know.
I personally do not 'loathe' the devs. I think they are really great. There are some real standouts like Heretic etc and others who we haven't even met no doubt.

I don't think the vast majority of people who would describe themselves as 'disillusioned' or 'disappointed' actually dislike the devs or 'dismiss whatever a dev may say'. Some do, of course, but those people are trolls. It is the internet after all.

However, to the extent that your question is relevant to the much larger group that do respect the devs, and do really enjoy the game but nevertheless express problems with it, I think there is a simple answer as to why they stay. .....

They/We love Star Trek. We are devoted to the IP and we want to see it used in a good way. We also love the game, or at least love an a great deal about the game. People stay because they care. No one would waste their time if they didn't care passionately about Star Trek and about this game.

I tried a browser game called "Edgeworld." It was really, really bad. I didn't say a word in the forums. I just left. I had nothing invested in its the shallow fantasy world. I just left. People feel very, very differently about Star Trek.

Whatever the disagreements that arise on the forums. I think the following should never happen.

GOLDEN RULES

1) If you are totally fine with the game as is, don't respond to somewhat else voicing criticism by saying "If you don't like, why don't you just leave?!?"...or any variation thereof.

2) If you are very upset with the state of the game, don't accuse anyone who is happy of being "A shill for cryptic," or a "Dev Brown noser" or any variation of that. If someone is happy, then Great! They should enjoy the game.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 12
05-30-2012, 08:24 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by CaptainQuirk View Post
I hate the decisions that are being made that give the developers a pass on developing the game...

KDF not played enough and therefore not deemed as profitable? Developers get a pass on developing KDF-specific content towards making the KDF on par with UFP

FE taking too many resources to develop so we're re-evaluating the viability of FEs period? Developers get a pass on developing FE content.

Officially-created mission content to be replaced by Foundry-authored mission content? Developers get a pass on making mission content.

Cryptic has to be the only game developer I have ever known that looks for so many different reasons NOT to develop a game. SOMEBODY at the top needs to make decisions which push development into, I don't know, actually DEVELOPING?

We are two years into STO's live run. Any other developer would have had at least ONE expansion by now, and tons of additional PLAYABLE content. All we have seen is FLUFF and money grabs.

So why am I still here? Because I still see the potential this game has, and will continue to have even to the very instant before they pull the plug. The only thing standing in the way of the game reaching for and possibly even achieving that potential is the decisions that are being made. Get rid of the people making stupid decisions that put the devs in a straightjacket, and maybe something will get done, and maybe STO can become profitable due to other things besides lockboxes.
I am fairly certain there has been more than enough added content since it went live to form at least one expansion pack.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 13
05-30-2012, 08:41 AM
Because I love Star Trek and this is only ongoing Star Trek thing going on so I stay here to support.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 14
05-30-2012, 08:42 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Commadore_Bob
Before you have a conniption, this is another thread based on getting you to think. This is not a criticism of a person or group of people; this is merely me pointing something out.

************************
Why are you still here? You, who so loathe this game and the devs behind it, why are you still posting to the forum?

I once bought a stove from Best Buy and was given a promised delivery date of a month later. That date came and went and I never got a call from them. I had to call them up to find out my stove had been back ordered and wouldn't come for another two weeks. I have yet to even flip through their newspaper flyer since.

When I am mad at a company, I refuse to do business with them. I won't even acknowledge their existence.

So why do you stick around when Cryptic has so upset you? What brings you back to this forum day after day even though you dismiss whatever a dev may say?

I genuinely want to know.
I see why you ask Bob, I've pondered this exact question myself. However I think I have found the answer..

See, what I've concluded is, Star Trek, is a passion for a lot of people. It is not just a game or mild entertainment but a way of life, a way of thinking and behaving and even a moral "yard stick".

There is the problem, we have watched the shows, read the books and enjoyed all the lore that expands the IP. However, there is no game engine that is as good as our own imagination, no writer can measure up to our own creativity.

How many times have we watched shows and then in our own minds run the episode again, but with ourselves as the main character to see how we would have done it - how would it have played out if we had made the choices and would the outcome be the same? or better? or worse?

How can any company live up to the expectations of our own self created Star Trek universe in our heads and hearts?

Star Trek is full of "what if..." but games are not. Games are structured and finite with a start point and end point and for a universe that is without end... any game will fall short of expectations when you reach the "end".
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 15
05-30-2012, 08:51 AM
My response is 4-fold

- Its a Star Trek game, I like Star Trek.
- The Doff system is really quite addictive, at least 50% of my play probably revolves around increasing the number of purple doffs I have. . . . .
- The exchange alone is actually a lot of fun as an economic simulation with real people. Nowt quite as satisfying as making millions of EC in minutes out of idiots.
- Mechwarrior Online isn't out yet.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 16
05-30-2012, 08:54 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Commadore_Bob
Before you have a conniption, this is another thread based on getting you to think. This is not a criticism of a person or group of people; this is merely me pointing something out.

************************
Why are you still here? You, who so loathe this game and the devs behind it, why are you still posting to the forum?
I'm guessing this thread isn't aimed at me, as I do not loathe this game.

Now time, for some nitpicks.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Commadore_Bob
I once bought a stove from Best Buy and was given a promised delivery date of a month later. That date came and went and I never got a call from them. I had to call them up to find out my stove had been back ordered and wouldn't come for another two weeks. I have yet to even flip through their newspaper flyer since.

When I am mad at a company, I refuse to do business with them. I won't even acknowledge their existence.
1) Star Trek is an IP. As an IP, unique and special, people have an emotional attachment to Star Trek. People do not, generally, have emotional attachments to their household appliances.

2) You are upset with and angry at BEST BUY, but do you now hate Maytag/GE (whoever made the stove you ordered)? No, you don't hate the company that made the product you're upset with the merchant who is in charge of getting the product to your door in a timely and professional fashion.

Honestly, your example is not really a good picture of the situation.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Commadore_Bob
So why do you stick around when Cryptic has so upset you? What brings you back to this forum day after day even though you dismiss whatever a dev may say?

I genuinely want to know.
People love STAR TREK, Cryptic is the current custodian of that IP in electronic entertainment form. There is NO OTHER STAR TREK MMO available to go to.


The core mechanics of the game are very good, Star Trek has great retention as an IP - the problems are mismanagement, failure to deliver and turning a beloved IP into a slot machines ONLINE that garners the rage you see constantly.


If this game was "Space Battles Online" with no IP behind it, I believe the servers would have folded long before F2P was even an option.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 17
05-30-2012, 09:02 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by USS_Ultimatum
2) You are upset with and angry at BEST BUY, but do you now hate Maytag/GE (whoever made the stove you ordered)? No, you don't hate the company that made the product you're upset with the merchant who is in charge of getting the product to your door in a timely and professional fashion.

Honestly, your example is not really a good picture of the situation.
Actually, it fits perfectly. Most of the time, you can only buy certain models at certain stores. I don't want a Maytag stove, I want a particular Maytag stove. But because that one store is the only one who sells it, then I guess I'll have to buy the Samsung that looks similar at another store because I refuse to do business with them.


Quote:
Originally Posted by USS_Ultimatum
If this game was "Space Battles Online" with no IP behind it, I believe the servers would have folded long before F2P was even an option.
If you hate Cryptic's interpretation of Star Trek, then why stick around? There are other space adventure MMOs on the market. I know there are no other Star Trek games, but if you think Cryptic doesn't have a "true" Star Trek game, what difference does it make?

Again, not directed directly at you, but there are some people believe this is Generic Space Online with Star Trek costumes.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 18
05-30-2012, 09:02 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Commadore_Bob
Before you have a conniption, this is another thread based on getting you to think.
?? Getting us to think?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Commadore_Bob
I genuinely want to know.
No you don't. You have been here and on the forums long enough to know why people still stay and why people like me, still stay but don't play.

I question your motives, but I think I know them already.

Getting us to think... Shesh.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 19
05-30-2012, 09:04 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Solomace View Post
I question your motives, but I think I know them already.
What else am I thinking? I've never had my mind read by some guy on the internet before.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 20
05-30-2012, 09:04 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Commadore_Bob
Actually, it fits perfectly. Most of the time, you can only buy certain models at certain stores. I don't want a Maytag stove, I want a particular Maytag stove. But because that one store is the only one who sells it, then I guess I'll have to buy the Samsung that looks similar at another store because I refuse to do business with them.

If you hate Cryptic and their interpretation of Star Trek, then why stick around? There are other space adventure MMOs on the market. I know there are no other Star Trek games, but if you think Cryptic doesn't have a "true" Star Trek game, what difference does it make?
So you say you geniunely want to know what people think, but are you infact just wanting to debate and argue with people that don't agree with you?

I geniunely want to know
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