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Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 11
06-07-2012, 10:15 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Darkfader1988
What about, Bop decloaks, waits for defiant to decloak, jams him. Defiant sciteam's himself, bop nukes Defiant, defiant screwed. (This assigntment Requires a Duty Officer with the 'Noob' trait for Critical Success though

^^
Hehe that works too.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 12
06-07-2012, 11:55 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by CaptainHorizon
im not much of a dueler, but i'd throw my hat in the ring here and there

as for 3v3......keep a close eye on ship and class restrictions, the last thing anyone wants is a 3v3 cruiser snorefest.

either way, anyone who could bring in some structure in this format would be welcomed i think

have fun kill bad guys

horizon
I hear ya, but this was just trying to see if there would be any interest at all in the idea itself before I loaded people down with the rules of each league. As for the 3v3, I had a point system in mind to prevent mega-tank groups or all carrier groups, etc etc etc.

Believe me I'd given this a fair bit of thought before posting and I'm not saying it's perfect, just trying to see if people would even want to do it before I out in the effort of getting things going .

Quote:
Originally Posted by Darkfader1988
Oh Sivar! You know I love 1v1's!

-snip-

Then comes the next question, If we do allow Tier 5 consoles, how would a Bop vs Defiant end? Both cloaked? who will decloak first? Etc etc etc. Its getting a bit complicated this way. I think if this ought to happen we just need some basic rules and be a little flexible in the matches itself. Defiant escort says to Bop: Ok man, i will be the one not using the cloak.
Yeah I'd forgotten about the loss of ship tokens since I'd returned, good point; it was a bit of a stigma to use p2w stuff when I was playing before but now it's just par for the course I guess

As for the double cloak matches, remembering that there needs to be a kill to win the match or it's a tie, but that aside I was thinking of having a random roll by the observer to see who decloaks first and alternate after each kill.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Zorena
sci/zombiecruiser lf1v1?!
Well if there is enough interest and I get this going then maybe it will help Cryptic spot one of the game's problems :p

Quote:
Originally Posted by EmoeJoe
except that the p2w jem ship is far superior alone to every p2w console added together. better idea. no rules, no restrictions on ship/consoles. kkthnks
That could add up into some serious grudge matches with some of the consoles, lol.

In all seriousness though, that was another reason for this thread; to get a feel for people's positions on the C-store items and their use.



Please keep the responses coming, trying to see if it's worth the effort to set up
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 13
06-07-2012, 12:07 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sivar View Post
That could add up into some serious grudge matches with some of the consoles, lol.

In all seriousness though, that was another reason for this thread; to get a feel for people's positions on the C-store items and their use.
A single p2w console is not a huge deal in a 1v1 match (except maybe plasmotic leech).
AMS can be annoying, but without a chorus of chained AMS's its not so bad, you can clear it or tank the damage/wait for abit.
Acetons can get spammy but it really needs afew people doing it, and because they are stationary in an arena you can just run away.

Your main concerns need to be stuff like super drain builds on karfi's, bug ships that can dps with the best escort but self heal for insane numbers, ships that just don't die.

Most of this can be overcome/worked around in a group since there is always the good ol fallback of "focus fire and subnuc it to death". Its really hard to burst down a cruiser or carrier solo, well tanked ones will pretty much NEVER die in a 1v1 barring insane strings of lucky crits.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 14
06-07-2012, 12:27 PM
Points system for team build works nicely, in theory And if you went with that Sivar, I know that I will participate in the action.

I actually think that if you went to a point system for team builds. you could have T5 ship with a few T3s, assuming e can weight each ship apropriately.

Thats just me thinking outside of the box. Cake?
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 15
06-07-2012, 12:59 PM
Most of the problematic abilities only get really problematic if used by teams.

Exception is probably really only self-healing Cruisers. And maybe BoP alpha strikes with every burst console and ability there is?
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 16
06-07-2012, 08:28 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by shelev
A single p2w console is not a huge deal in a 1v1 match (except maybe plasmotic leech).
AMS can be annoying, but without a chorus of chained AMS's its not so bad, you can clear it or tank the damage/wait for abit.
Acetons can get spammy but it really needs afew people doing it, and because they are stationary in an arena you can just run away.

Your main concerns need to be stuff like super drain builds on karfi's, bug ships that can dps with the best escort but self heal for insane numbers, ships that just don't die.

Most of this can be overcome/worked around in a group since there is always the good ol fallback of "focus fire and subnuc it to death". Its really hard to burst down a cruiser or carrier solo, well tanked ones will pretty much NEVER die in a 1v1 barring insane strings of lucky crits.
The problem is, there are no calculations made by any Supercomputer on any aspect of this game to basically give us results on what would be equally fail in 1v1's, or 2v2's or 5v5's for that matter. Its impossible. The variables on all aspects are too complex for that. The best you can do is compare ship by ship, and 1 ship having 42K hull and the other only 32K but with a cloak can completely destroy any reasonable comparision.

Its just impossible. The only thing we have is our own opinions on this. You use the cat carrier yourself, its a P2W ship as well, you obviously use petspam with it as well, (Sorry to call this petspam). But the guy under me might not think its OP, or that its balanced against another ship of a total different pace. The guy posting above me might have 100% different opinion about it.

You get my point. Its so near impossible to make any decent and accurate conclusions on this except for our own subjective opinion. It will be this way, always, in every MMO, in PvP.

Eventually its up to the player to _realize_ that a MMO will never be 100% balanced in every single aspect. Lets drop those numbers back to 50-60% at best. Eventually its up to the player to take what will make him a optimal player and balance the unbalance of this game, any game, in your own favor. yes, eventually this will include a P2w ship or console.

The most reasonable thing to do here is probably set up a voting system on what should, and what shouldn't be allowed, and the participation on this event will be based on that. Unforutnately, even that will most likely be totally subjective, and lets make an example, if 70% of the players that vote on that system have no D'kora, Galor, jemmy, or another Cstore ship, they will most likely vote against the use of any of those ships.

Which will result in 30% players not participating most likely, and this is just for the ship matter, lets move on to consoles now...

You basically _cannot_ exclude anything out of a P2W and F2P game anymore. Everything is now merged, Cstore, Real Money, Dilithium, Energy Credits, at some point they are all related to each other now. There is no more non-pay2win Tier 5 ship, unless you Sub montly or are a lifetimer, wouldn't you call that pay2win either? I know of people who gladly want a Lifetime but they just cannot get the money together for it. I know people who do no longer want to sub because they cannot afford a monthly or they do not think its worth it. Other people who are sub or lifetime get 400 points a month, a few months and u can get a new cstore ship. Etc etc etc. Im not sure on this, but nobody gets any more VA tokens, at least not if u do not sub or have lifetime. Basically all the T5 ships are now P2w, you can bend the fact, you can try and talk your way around it, its the truth. If some f2p'er has no lifetime and doesnt sub, and he dearly wants a B'rel Retrofit on KDF and he pays for it tru the Cstore, he has a p2w ship. Thats that. Just an example. but its too short sighted to just say this is p2w and that is not p2w.

In any case, these are the most reasons why these events mostly end up in failure. I definately do not hope so, but...

/Discuss.


(btw on ur statement on Aceton assimilators, stationary, etc. But if all your systems are drained to 0 you can use anything you want but you cannot get away. Plasmonic leech, energy syphons, stack it all baby yeh. :p

Last time not even my Engine bat worked because somehow it was greyed out. Oh well just saying)

Quote:
Originally Posted by shelev
Your main concerns need to be stuff like super drain builds on karfi's, bug ships that can dps with the best escort but self heal for insane numbers, ships that just don't die..
Sorry but perhaps you should consider getting out of that Cat carrier and go into a escort yourself, Ive seen numberous bugs pop each day including myself, they are far from invincible. Most even take DEM1 as an extra dont let me laugh lol. No offense dude but perhaps you should team up with a decent escort so that he can take them out for ya? And no, that doesnt necessarily have to be a bug in order to win.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 17
06-08-2012, 06:23 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Darkfader1988
Edited for size reasons
I pretty much agree that to a large extent its left to the eye of the beholder, but at the same time certain things just don't work unless you are retarded.

How do you 1v1 with zombie cruisers/super tanks that don't die to a single players damage?
How do you 1v1 "fairly" with ships on both sides that cloak?

If you ban/prevent super tanks, you may aswell all just fly escorts.
An alternating setup of player A decloaks first, then player B, repeat style thing but it still leaves something to be desired.

1v1 in this game just isn't that great.


Quote:
Sorry but perhaps you should consider getting out of that Cat carrier and go into a escort yourself, Ive seen numberous bugs pop each day including myself, they are far from invincible. Most even take DEM1 as an extra dont let me laugh lol. No offense dude but perhaps you should team up with a decent escort so that he can take them out for ya? And no, that doesnt necessarily have to be a bug in order to win.
Karfi's with drain stacking are dumb, you pretty much agree'd in your above post. Well not so much to karfi's in particular but drain stacking and imo karfi's are the best at it.

Unkillable/super tank/zombie/whatever is an issue, and I admit my ship will generally toe this line and barring lag/dc I'm generally not gonna die outside of some serious focus fire with subnucs or getting drained dry. Alot of other people can manage this too, its not something that special which is sorta part of the reason its a problem.

Bugships can get obscene heal values compared to other escorts. While there alphas are pretty much inline with the rest of the gang there self healing is obscene. I've seen bugships finish arena matches with 600k+.
In general bugships also tend to seem like a goodluck charm in Arena's. If the pug I end up in actually has a bugship, more often than not we already won, conversely if the opposing team has a bugship generally we lose. If both teams have one (used to be rare, maybe not so much after this doff event) its the usual crap shoot.
How/why bugships get such huge healing numbers, I'm not really sure statistically they shouldn't be pumping heals like that but they are. Currently I'm guessing its something to do with SDO's, but I'm not really sure.


As to your suggestion of having a pet escort follow me around, I'd love to have one, but I don't play regularly enough (mostly weekends maybe afew hours after work on weekdays), so mostly I can't have that luxury.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 18
06-15-2012, 03:12 PM
Well this hasn't received any responses in about a week so I'm guessing that there isn't enough interest to do a 1v1, 2v2 or 3v3 league?
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 19
06-15-2012, 03:18 PM
if i didnt have a retail schedule across 3 states and a 5 year old, and a demanding wife.....

i'd love to be part of anything like this. heck, ive only been on a full panda team a few times in the past month. it breaks my big sad panda heart.

my opinion is that someone well known needs to spearhead it and sell it like hotcakes. tsi fundays were great.

i would have called them Horizon fundays, but thats just me...
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 20
06-16-2012, 05:11 AM
3v3 for sure , as there is only 3 of us :p

No console ,, and no zombie chains ,, nice and simple


Oh and no pets ,, it is pvp after all
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