Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 11 reply
06-17-2012, 11:51 AM
what sets them apart for me is the point defense system.i was flying a fleet escort with scorpions and the point defense console from the thunderchild and that was a pretty mean little ship now i switched to the armitage and with its two point defense systems loaded i was able to complete the cure space mission for first time since the respawn stacking timer allowing me to finally get my prototype engine tech to complete my space maco set mark 12s . before this ship came out every the cure i played on elite failed with no rewards even with atrox carriers and odessey class ships in mix. now in the slot i was saving for scorpions i can drop in a heavy phaser platform
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 12
06-17-2012, 12:13 PM
As many have said, the HEavy Escort Carrier is a nasty, nasty piece of work. It's tough, heavily armed, nimble, and equipped with the best crowd control money can buy.

The Atrox is a flying house, but not exceptionally dangerous on its own. Its pets can be potent, but it's no one man army, instead making its team better via its pets and Science Powers.

The Heavy Escort Carrier is one of, if not the, most self-sufficient ships in the game at this point in time. In a team-based competitive game, that makes it monstrously powerful, and definitely overpowered (not OMGWINButton overpowered, but so good that it virtually invalidates the other Federation Escorts, save possibly for the Tactical Escort Retrofit). It needs to give up something for the Carrier ability, as much as I don't want to, I'd say the Ensign Tactical BOff or a Tactical Console probably has to go to bring it to the same level as the Fleet Escort (which it most blatantly invalidates), Advanced Escort, MVAM, and Tactical Escort Retrofit.

/2cents

PS: For those of you in the other Escorts, just remember that the only thing your ships has lost is their relative effectiveness. No actual changes have occurred to them that would make them non-functional or less capable than before.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 13
06-17-2012, 05:51 PM
Been using both of them now and here is my views of the differences from a PvE perspective.

As people have said the Armitage is a nasty nasty piece of work. Decked with MK XII AP weapons the thing dishes out a ton of damage, and that is even before you account for the fighters. But there is a downside to that and that is that in PvE PUG runs of like STFs for instance, Everything and their grandmother is going to come after you. There is not a lot in PUG runs that will come close to the damage and so things will come after you fast. Means also that more often than not, unless I am fast, I will get popped. As an escort, this thing is a monster, and I used escorts all the way through my captain's career.

In the Atrox it is another story. The ship is slow, turns like a pregnant yak in in heat, does nowhere near as much damage, but it can survive a hell of a lot of punishment before it is over for you in that beast. Not even in full shields mode (Meaning 75 in weaps and aux) I can tank quite a bit while unloading some rather interesting damage numbers with full beam broadsides, fighters, and purple DOFF enhanced gravity wells and tractors. If I get attacked by a lot I can pop into 100 shields and go toe to toe with 6 spheres in an elite stf at once. Sure I don't do a lot of damage on the outset but the fact that I can stand there duking it out with them is a testament to the versatility of the vessel I think. It has a lot of little tricks you can load into it to survive some rather stupid times, and PUGs are stupid times for the most part.

Al around the Armitage is going to do a lot of fun stuff, but the Atrox shouldn't be discounted as it has a ton of utility and if built right can dish out a rather impressive amount of damage on your own.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 14
06-17-2012, 11:44 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Raptor63549
My primary ship is a Luna, and I have a Nebula, Destiny and an Atrox. The latter is definitely different than a science vessel.

Science vessels do a fairly large portion of their damage through science abilities if so set up, and their maneuverability allows them to make good use of DBBs. They also have that sensor scan ability that causes their DPS to increase as they keep a target locked. The Atrox lacks the maneuverability to make good offensive use of damage dealing science abilities since they are either close range, or limited to a forward arc. It also lacks the sensor scan stacking ability, so it is reliant upon fighters to do a fair deal of damage. Despite the integral target subsystem abilities and the large number of science boff slots, I'd put the atrox in it's own class; the playstyle is just too different.

The Heavy Escort carrier, on the other hand, most definitely fits right in the escort class of ships
What? The sensor scan ability is usable by any science captain no matter the ship they are in. Also I have absolutely no problems making grav well or tykens rift work. If you can't turn fast enough slam her in reverse and use evasive maneuvers. This can also be accomplished by dropping your speed to about half. Couple that with power siphon, danubes, tractor repulsors, photonic shockwave, and target system engines and you have plenty of ways to keep your forward arc in line with your target. While you don't need all of those a few will work just fine. Oh I forgot to add eject warp plasma. You can skill it with a doff to make it slow your enemies and if you hit evasive maneuvers and fly right at a pack they can't scatter away in time.

Also how is the Atrox not a science vessel? Does it not have the target subsytems just like all other science vessels? The fact that it is a carrier as well does not negate its science status.

While I agree that it flys like a slug and and quite different to other sci ships, that alone is not a valid argument to negate science ship status

I prefer broadsides of beam arrays to all the setups I have tried. I have been quite successful with DBB's cannons and turret setups though you need to play around in regular stfs before you try elites with them. I even have a quantum torp in the front sometimes as I enjoy using torp spread 2 on the waves of probes that fly through the gates.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 15
06-18-2012, 05:10 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by ironyoga
What? The sensor scan ability is usable by any science captain no matter the ship they are in. Also I have absolutely no problems making grav well or tykens rift work. If you can't turn fast enough slam her in reverse and use evasive maneuvers. This can also be accomplished by dropping your speed to about half. Couple that with power siphon, danubes, tractor repulsors, photonic shockwave, and target system engines and you have plenty of ways to keep your forward arc in line with your target. While you don't need all of those a few will work just fine. Oh I forgot to add eject warp plasma. You can skill it with a doff to make it slow your enemies and if you hit evasive maneuvers and fly right at a pack they can't scatter away in time.

Also how is the Atrox not a science vessel? Does it not have the target subsytems just like all other science vessels? The fact that it is a carrier as well does not negate its science status.

While I agree that it flys like a slug and and quite different to other sci ships, that alone is not a valid argument to negate science ship status

I prefer broadsides of beam arrays to all the setups I have tried. I have been quite successful with DBB's cannons and turret setups though you need to play around in regular stfs before you try elites with them. I even have a quantum torp in the front sometimes as I enjoy using torp spread 2 on the waves of probes that fly through the gates.
He meant Sensor Analysis the debuff that inrease DPS the longer you have the target selected it's not on Carriers.

Carriers do have a Science design behind them, but they are designed to be different to both a Sci Vessel and a Cruiser. I consider them Sci ships, but I'm in a Minority and find it easier to class them as Carriers.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 16
06-18-2012, 11:21 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by DKnight1000
He meant Sensor Analysis the debuff that inrease DPS the longer you have the target selected it's not on Carriers.

Carriers do have a Science design behind them, but they are designed to be different to both a Sci Vessel and a Cruiser. I consider them Sci ships, but I'm in a Minority and find it easier to class them as Carriers.
Yeah forgot about the innate ability. However the Atrox is clearly a sci vessel even if she is a carrier. And the Armitage clearly an escort. They both give up something to gain the flight deck(s) though.
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