Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 1 How to tactor a Bugship
06-18-2012, 08:11 AM
A simple premise with an apparently near impossible end goal.

I'm a TB *****, I run double TB with 1-2 hangars of runabouts. I enjoy making sure those pesky little things don't fly off but instead actually die like they are supposed to.

With the re-release of the bugships there numbers of grown rather massively. By and large bugships are the hardest ships for me to lockdown. Every now and then if I try to watch there buffs and time it I can stop them for afew seconds before they are back and flying around like a crack fiend.

When I compare this to most other escorts, cruisers, carriers, etc its somewhat of a unique situation. Most of these other ships get held down nicely barring PH/Omega which is very much temporary, usually it just means I wait abit, pop evasive and stay on them unless they try running out to 20k or so (COWARDS!).

The bugships though... not so much. I think they are using evasive and attack pattern doffs the combination of which gives them lots of uptime for APO and Evasive. I'm assuming they are also chugging engine batteries like mad.
The end result of which when combined with the hyper maneuverable bugship is ship that literally makes TB's feel completely ineffectual.

So maybe its not on the bugships and whatever setup they are running, maybe its on me?
I'm running 2x TB1, 1-2x Hangar of Runabouts (adv), Target Engines 1 (lol), I am at 6/9 in grav skill, total points usually right around 100 depending on if I run a grav console or not.
I've tested TB3's vs TB1's and there is no noticable difference except duration, hold strength seems equal.
Is there anything I could realistically change up to root/tractor someone better than I am currently setup? Some skill, skill points, or "something" I am missing?


So my goal is not to even solo kill a bugship, all I want is to be able to hold it down so other people can kill it. CAN IT BE DONE (consistently)?
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 2
06-18-2012, 08:16 AM
tractor a jem'hadar is the same that tractor any other escort, the ship don't have any special counter against that, is just a normal ship with more turn rate

Stack conn officers can be done with any ship, there is nothing special related with this in the jem'hadar.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 3
06-18-2012, 08:21 AM
i agree the jem hadar somehow can counter every tb spam around there they can just whip out of the tb with evasive and apo x2 and non of the other scorts can basically pull that off


Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 4
06-18-2012, 08:41 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Darkfader1988
i agree the jem hadar somehow can counter every tb spam around there they can just whip out of the tb with evasive and apo x2 and non of the other scorts can basically pull that off


Seriously, the other escorts tend to get TB'd much more easily.
Yeah they run APO, yeah they have Evasive, Batteries, and whatever else but in most cases they are just nowhere near the insanity of the bugships.

I can't point to any stat and go "lol bugships total hax" but seriously go try to TB yourself MT and see if you don't fail miserably. Then go TB some of these new akira's, MVAE's, or any of the larger ships. Those ships get TB'd ALOT more reliably, even when they use skills to break out unless they run I can just get on them again as soon as it ends or if they get subnuc'd.
But when I try this with most bugships its like they just shrug it off keep on flying around like a crackfiend and such. Maybe its just super pimped out doffs, I really have no clue but frankly bugships seem much harder to TB than any other ship out there.

Lets flip this around then if you are so opposed to the bugship being seen in a remotely negative light.

I suck, I can't TB anything, everything escapes my TB's because I suck that much. How do I stop sucking at TB's and actually hold things down?
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 5
06-18-2012, 08:55 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by shelev
Seriously, the other escorts tend to get TB'd much more easily.
Yeah they run APO, yeah they have Evasive, Batteries, and whatever else but in most cases they are just nowhere near the insanity of the bugships.

I can't point to any stat and go "lol bugships total hax" but seriously go try to TB yourself MT and see if you don't fail miserably. Then go TB some of these new akira's, MVAE's, or any of the larger ships. Those ships get TB'd ALOT more reliably, even when they use skills to break out unless they run I can just get on them again as soon as it ends or if they get subnuc'd.
But when I try this with most bugships its like they just shrug it off keep on flying around like a crackfiend and such. Maybe its just super pimped out doffs, I really have no clue but frankly bugships seem much harder to TB than any other ship out there.

Lets flip this around then if you are so opposed to the bugship being seen in a remotely negative light.

I suck, I can't TB anything, everything escapes my TB's because I suck that much. How do I stop sucking at TB's and actually hold things down?
Musth ave been sucky escorts, and dont spec fully for engines/thruster stuff. I can get out of a Tier5 tractor with my Tier3 Akira just by putting engines to 100 level + evasive np. Same story for defiant/mvam/etc.



U dont, omega always counters it, Polarize counters it, Intertial dampeners dont do jack against them so speccing into that is pointless for anyone. But i never had any problem tractoring any1 even a jemmy if he didnt have any counter buffs on him. He can do evasive + full engines that always works no matter how good you skilled ur TB but that goes for any escort in my experience.
just needs good timing and yes, danube spam is just spam, requires no timing etc so thats why people basically hate spam like that

i had enough encounters where i was hold by tb spam and couldnt move and had no omega available. just sit it out and tank.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 6
06-18-2012, 09:12 AM
shelev, if you are refering to that match early yesterday we ran into each other, check MT's thread.

i switched out every single heal i had for a movement buff, your pets still got me. im not sure what you are getting at here. im still figuring my bug out...

every escort can run 2x omega1's, aux2ID1, anh PH1.....making them 100% free of tractors. you just give up heals to do so.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 7
06-18-2012, 09:17 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by CaptainHorizon
shelev, if you are refering to that match early yesterday we ran into each other, check MT's thread.

i switched out every single heal i had for a movement buff, your pets still got me. im not sure what you are getting at here. im still figuring my bug out...

every escort can run 2x omega1's, aux2ID1, anh PH1.....making them 100% free of tractors. you just give up heals to do so.
Its not just you, MT, or any one person. Theres also afew KDF bugs that I think do the whole "lol speed demon" thing abit better (likely due to plasmotic leech and such).

Mostly when I was actually getting you it was from my own TB's, in general the runabouts are just "assistants". I see you pop a buff, wait then evasive (if need be) then jump on with my own TB to stop you.

I mean I really try to root people, its the overall goal I run with most of the time besides healing people. But some people/ships (mostly bugs) tend to just go "whats this movement debuff you speak of?" and fly off like its nothing, more often than not no matter what I try.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 8
06-18-2012, 10:51 AM
I wouldn't be against some test runs in 1v1 to show you i cannot get lose of your own tractor or your danube tractors without omega or evasive+full engine power.

And both of these tactics work on almost every ship.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 9
06-18-2012, 12:30 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by shelev
A simple premise with an apparently near impossible end goal.

I'm a TB *****, I run double TB with 1-2 hangars of runabouts. I enjoy making sure those pesky little things don't fly off but instead actually die like they are supposed to.
I suspect crap like that has warped the meta. Escorts/BoPs/Jemms are running much more gofast/escape skills than they used to because otherwise they'll be sitting still in space staring at a random direction, hitting the fedball with 3 turrets. If you were the only one doing this, I suspect you'd have much more success. Unfortunately, you are not.

I wouldn't be horribly surprised if there was some bug or glitch, because, you know, why not, but I really suspect your issue is just your opponents having to build around runabout hangers if they ever want to turn. Jemmy owners are almost by definition people more invested in the game, as well, so they're probably more likely to be people willing and able to adapt to the meta.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 10
06-18-2012, 12:55 PM
Like horizon, I'm a new bug pilot, and I can tell you without a doubt that the bug is just as easy to grab as any other escort I've flown. Also like horizon said, if you commit your build to it, you can run almost immune to tractors. It takes a BIG commitment though. To be up 100% you need 2x omegas, and 2x ph's. You can rotate between the two every 15 secs giving you 100% uptime as long as no one nukes you. That 40% of your BO abilities committed to defeating tractors which is kinda crazy considering its countering one free hangar bay on a ship which gives up nothing for it if they fly the new light carrier
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is Off
HTML code is Off


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 11:33 AM.