Cryptic Studios Team
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,101
# 1 Opinion Request: Chronitons
06-22-2012, 02:18 PM
What is the real reason for the complaints of imbalance against these:

1) Reliability of debuff

2) Power/magnitude of debuff

3) Lack of defense against said debuff

4) Stackability of debuff

5) Something else, or a combo of the above


The numerous complaints against chroniton procs in general have placed the issue on my radar, but the majority of the posts I read are just complaints without thorough analysis attached. Can some of you regulars shed some light on the core mechanic that is causing this beef?

Thanks!
-=-=-=-=-=-
Jeremy Randall
Cryptic - Systems Design
"Play smart!"
Quote:
Originally Posted by Me
Kurland here...
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 230
# 2
06-22-2012, 02:26 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by borticuscryptic View Post
3) Lack of defense against said debuff

4) Stackability of debuff
These two are the main problem in my opinion. Especially 3).

One second thought: also 2). The duration per proc is a bit long. But this duration thing is even worse for warp plasma / theta which last way too long per application.

Last edited by fakehilbert; 06-22-2012 at 02:30 PM.
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 102
# 3
06-22-2012, 02:26 PM
Simply put, there has never been a counter or clear for chronitons since season 1.

If the proc time was reduced by a second, and polarize + hazard + omega either negated or cleared it, the chroniton would be much more balanced.
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 141
# 4
06-22-2012, 02:30 PM
When I compare Chroni's with Tricobalts, Quantum, Photon, Plasma...everything looks balanced.

Transphasics are underpowered because they generally only help for a few seconds at the beginning of a battle and are simply not worth equipping unless you're in a shuttle.
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 266
# 5
06-22-2012, 02:31 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by aytanhi View Post
Simply put, there has never been a counter or clear for chronitons since season 1.

If the proc time was reduced by a second, and polarize + hazard + omega either negated or cleared it, the chroniton would be much more balanced.
Bingo.

I would further mention that when teams of 5 using chroniton torpedoes combine them with Torpedo Spread, and Torpedo High Yield, the entire other team can be ground to a stop, and never be free of the debuff.

-Joseph.b
Empire Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 802
# 6
06-22-2012, 02:31 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by borticuscryptic View Post
1) Reliability of debuff

2) Power/magnitude of debuff

3) Lack of defense against said debuff

4) Stackability of debuff

In my experiance, those.
Highest proc change of all weapns to apply the buff. Seems to be out of line with the rest of the procs in game.
Reduces defense, and offense of a effected ship because it can move significantly less when effected.
No counter at all against it.
Its prtty nasty when you are in an escort, in a cruiser or carrier, you could step out of the airlock and push, you are moving like a snail.

-= ISE: 12:19 -=- CSE 12:41 -=- KASE 11:59 -=- HSe 8:06 total =-
-= KAGE 5:43 =-
[7:07] [Combat (Self)] Your Dual Disruptor Banks - Overload II deals 123086 (41096) Disruptor Damage(Critical) to Assimilated Carrier.
Ensign
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 19
# 7
06-22-2012, 02:32 PM
The biggest problem with it is that nothing clears it.

The proc rate of 33%, combined with its ability to stack, basically results in a complete standstill with nothing the victim can do to remedy the situation. The stackability, in turn, is compounded by the ability to use spread to fire a bunch of chronitons - which given the 33% proc rate virtually guarantees that the victim will be sitting there.

A fix for maybe two of these offenders would help balance chronitons greatly:
- proc rate too high;
- nothing clears it;
- procs stack.
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 102
# 8
06-22-2012, 02:34 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by alanburch View Post
When I compare Chroni's with Tricobalts, Quantum, Photon, Plasma...everything looks balanced.

Transphasics are underpowered because they generally only help for a few seconds at the beginning of a battle and are simply not worth equipping unless you're in a shuttle.

The underpowered weapons in PVP are currently in a list of ascending from weakest to strongest as folows are Plasma (Energy and projectile due to the item set resistances against plasma weapons) , Transphasics, and tricobalts.

Aytanhi of TSI, TSI fleet founder and leader OrganizedPVP channel Admin
Feel free to ask me about PVP or starship strategies. "No, I am not Borg!"
/channel_join OrganizedPVP If you are interested in learning PVP, looking for a team, or a private match
Banned
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 558
# 9
06-22-2012, 02:34 PM
1 is a problem. It's pretty much guaranteed to hit you. Not so much a proc as a universal constant.

2. magnitude of the buff really is not the problem

3: This one right here Lack of Defense. that APO doesn't actually work on it, (there's alot of things APO doesn't actually work correctly on, but that's another tangent suffice to say APOs descriptor literally says Movement Debuff Immunity 15 seconds and it provides nothing of the sort) Aux Id? No dice either. Evasive? Engine batteries? No dice once you get enough of them stacked on you.

4: This is the second biggest issue. That you can be procced from start to finish of the fight is a little more than much. Most of us call that into the Bull ***** category. There's no immunity grace period afterwards, even merely 10 seconds (15 is asking abit much) would be joyous.

5: Already covered this in the above.

The problem is the debuff, can be stacked, and not only this, but each debuff is rather significant it is entirely possible right now to stop a full engine powered escort for example (even if he is using APO), through sheer chroniton procs. There's no immunity period after it's gone so it can immediately be reapplied. No one is actually using chroniton torps to do damage it's all for the debuff, this is something that direly needs to be looked at. Ironically enough, their output is so low that if it weren't for the proc you would never see anyone using them (and only sci ships really use them. Most procs come from Mines, and the stupid Danubes).

If you like, when I get back in game this weekend, I can post again in this thread with an exact break down of how much each chroniton proc debuffs you. I did the test once before, but I failed miserably to save the results. However each debuff was rather -huge- from what I do remember.
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,494
# 10
06-22-2012, 02:35 PM
The lack of defense seems to be the biggest issue to me. Combined with its stackability and its proc rate, it is inevitable and can be maintained constantly.

Attack Pattern Omega, Aux2Dampeners, Hazard Emitters and Polarize all fail to work against it. At least 2 of these powers (probably APO and Polarize Hull) should provide a defense against it.

The other 3 factors must also be looked into. The defenses cannot be up all the time, so reducing duration and stackability may also be required.

If you reduce the proc rate significantly (say, down to 10 % or so), consider boosting the damage to compensate (that would also make Chronitons more useful in PvE). Maybe instead of changing the proc rate, one could increase the cooldown some more but retain the current DPS - that gives it a stronger burst potential.

It may not require all that much work, before it becomes useless, but:

1) At least two, if not 3-4 counters from the existing movement buffs/hold/repel counters should work against it. If you choose a low number of counters or only rare counters, you should probably remove stackability.
2) The overall reliability on its own may need some downward adjustment - the reliability being a factor of proc change, firing rate and duration.
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is Off
HTML code is Off


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 08:17 AM.