Lieutenant
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 48
# 21
07-01-2012, 10:26 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by mikewendell View Post
Actually I told the poster to create their own because they were looking for something specific that wasn't met with what was currently available. I can speak for myself. Thanks.

I've used both doff channels and I have to admit that (I'll be good here) well they weren't what I was looking for either.

Of course the abuse I got when I asked for the non-bit.ly url the spreadsheet didn't help much either.

Please kindly don't give another player crap when your own house isn't smelling too rosy either.
My house is just fine - I've maxxed out my XP three or four months ago and have 350+ purple DOffs thanks to the spreadsheet and the channel. They obviously work.

You were not the only one who said "create your own", or implied as such, and I did not quote you in my post - so not sure why you got all defensive on me, but I guess my statements above apply to you as well.

I'm sorry you had someone "abuse" you - that's what ignore is for. It's going to happen in any public channel that you have less than desirable people at times. But then again - your question was one of the redundant/unneeded ones that lead to the complaint of the OP. Want to know what the URL is? I can see some responses being, "Look it up". The bit.ly URL was made up so people didn't have to keep typing out the whole dang name to save time when the question is asked every five minutes. Asking what it leads to kind of defeats the purpose, especially when anyone with a web browser can find out where it leads in three seconds. So yeah, I can see that getting a bit of...feedback, LOL.



Basically, it all boils down to this: the channels and the spreadsheet are there. The OP is miffed because he asked a question in the wrong channel, which is expressly why the channel was set up was to NOT have those questions there. The question would have been answered in DOFFJOBS, and if you had to overlook some noise to get it, so be it.

Kind of like your situation - just because a few people in a channel at a given time give you a hard time for asking a questionable question, doesn't forever "taint" it, nor does it mean the functions this community has overall implemented are going to change because of it.

But that's a discussion that could go on forever, and I'm sure neither of us have the time. I don't completely disagree with you, either - DOFFJobs is messy now, for me it's all the lockbox whining - but it does the job and it gets it done. So does the call channel, which yes, if you break the rules for you will get crap. ("But it was just a simple question..." - if everyone thought that way, it would become DOFFJobs.) It just smacks of entitlement ("No questions allowed, but surely my question is OK...").


I think you two should start your own channel. All seriousness. If the existing ones are not your "preference" to use, that's great. I wish you luck in it, because it takes a large community effort to document DOffing, and basically you have to eliminate/not pay attention to the crap to have access to that. It's kind of like going to the library - one day, someone is rude and bumps into you in the stacks. You leave, vowing never to go into the library again because someone was rude to you.

Your choice then really becomes - deal with it, and do what you can to avoid it in the future, returning to the library...or start your own library. Since the reason most people go to the library is to get or view materials without charge, starting your own library seems like the opposite way to go, as you would not only have to provide books for yourself, but everyone else. Hire your own staff, enforce policies, etc., etc.

Seems a lot more simple just to shrug off the rude person and go back to the original library.
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 904
# 22
07-02-2012, 07:55 AM
I am considering starting a channel yes.

But I'm not sure if I want to do so, given the problems with moderating EliteSTF.
Two channels might be more stress then I can handle.

I've mentally drafted a guideline/rulebook in my head though, even have a name for the channel.

But it's mostly up to the players, I don't want to start another channel that nobody uses!

We have 2 Doff channels already and the one I'm considering is geared towards a specific purpose, but is it 1 channel too many?
Starfleet Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 220
# 23
07-02-2012, 09:04 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by tilarta View Post
I am considering starting a channel yes.

But I'm not sure if I want to do so, given the problems with moderating EliteSTF.
Two channels might be more stress then I can handle.

I've mentally drafted a guideline/rulebook in my head though, even have a name for the channel.

But it's mostly up to the players, I don't want to start another channel that nobody uses!

We have 2 Doff channels already and the one I'm considering is geared towards a specific purpose, but is it 1 channel too many?
with all respect to yourself tilarta i feel you people over at elitestf should stay away from doffs and focus on STF's, after all thats what you do best and i dont think 2/3/4 channels would be a realistic job for you and the other elitestf admins. Also if you were to launch a doff channel and it became popular what happens when there is no moderation (as happed with elite stf a few months ago) and the admins/mods that were there did nothing to moderate the channel aka brokenmirror im not going to do anything i cba moderating

Stick to elitestf and the good job you and the mods do there
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 904
# 24
07-02-2012, 01:56 PM
Oh, this is just an idea I had off my own bat as it were.

I haven't mentioned it to any of the other Admins of EliteSTF, nor asked for their involvement at this time.

But yes, you have a valid point.

I can't admin all the time, as that would necessitate being online 24 hours a day, 7 days a week.
And obviously, that's not possible.


So, I would need other Admins and operators to supervise during the time I'm not online.


And I can personally assure you I will not let what happened to EliteSTF happen again in any channel I moderate.

I don't wish to discuss the reasons, but I took some time off from moderating EliteSTF and when I returned, I was horrified to find out how it had gone downhill.
And that's when I started getting in back the way is should be.
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 2,007
# 25
07-02-2012, 03:35 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by anagrojaneway View Post
I'm sorry you had someone "abuse" you - that's what ignore is for. It's going to happen in any public channel that you have less than desirable people at times. But then again - your question was one of the redundant/unneeded ones that lead to the complaint of the OP. Want to know what the URL is? I can see some responses being, "Look it up". The bit.ly URL was made up so people didn't have to keep typing out the whole dang name to save time when the question is asked every five minutes. Asking what it leads to kind of defeats the purpose, especially when anyone with a web browser can find out where it leads in three seconds. So yeah, I can see that getting a bit of...feedback, LOL.
Thank you for proving my point. If you're not interested in helping folks, please kindly don't pretend that you are.

The biy.ly redirect doesn't work on many public networks. It as well as many other redirection services are blocked because they're used to hide sex/porn links. I explained this and politely asked for the real link. The response I received that less than polite. Much like your response here.

The link does not work for "anyone".

Would take less than a minute for someone to buy a domain and create a redirect with that. I politely suggested that as well which was met with much rudeness.

edit: And this is the second time you've been rude to me in these forums. Maybe you need to take a step back and reconsider your actions.
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Last edited by mikewendell; 07-02-2012 at 04:09 PM.
Commander
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 413
# 26
07-02-2012, 04:55 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by mikewendell View Post
The biy.ly redirect doesn't work on many public networks. It as well as many other redirection services are blocked because they're used to hide sex/porn links. I explained this and politely asked for the real link. The response I received that less than polite. Much like your response here.

Would take less than a minute for someone to buy a domain and create a redirect with that. I politely suggested that as well which was met with much rudeness.
If you're the one who can't access bit.ly because you're on a network that restricts it (ie, you're looking up a videogame spreadsheet while you're at work), maybe you should be the one that spends money on a domain name instead of telling "someone" to.
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 904
# 27 Here is your channel
07-02-2012, 06:22 PM
Okay, I eventually decided to make the channel and hope it proves useful:

DOFFchains info thread
Lieutenant
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 81
# 28
07-02-2012, 11:31 PM
Here is the thing. Over time, it becomes harder and harder to find chains. that is because the dedicated doffers finish them early and then can't see assignments anymore. They also can't update the sheet with information that no one has. Doffjobs is crowded but if you mute the political/TV/religious/etc chat, you can get an answer, even if that answer is no one can see it.

If you don't want to use the sheet, thats fine, but your missing out. If you don't want to use the crowded, off topic channels, thats fine too. But a dedicated channel with no one in it, isn't that helpful either.

Here are the best strategies for finding chains/assignments you need.
1. Do the legwork and look yourself
2. Go to all invites and just double check that someone else doesn't have it that can't see it, has it on cd, or isn't to that stage yet. Many a time I have located assignments not advertised for on others bridges.
3. Just let nature take its course and you will find it eventually. Chains aren't going anywhere so sometimes not looking for it will get you there faster than a dedicated search. A watched pot never boils.
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,503
# 29
07-07-2012, 10:14 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by tilarta View Post
1. No random chatter.
2. No discussions of how to DOFF or how to maximize crit chance etc.
3. Allowed to ask if a particular assignment is running.
4. Active members/significant playerbase.
1. DOFFCALLS
2. DOFFCALLS
3. DOFFJOBS
4. both


asking where a assignment is, is the very reason i made the bit.ly/DOFFS sheet to begin with so people can stop asking and just look on the sheet instead, if it's not there chances are no one has seen it / called it out,
i found it utterly silly that every 2 - 5 minutes someone asked where the Resettle Colonists assignment is...

... that gets old real fast.

i rather make a mark on a sheet and everybody can look there for the rest of the 4 hour cycle.

having the info on the sheet for 4 hours where everybody can look is imho preferable to answering the same question every few minutes.


if you like none of the infrastructure options that we've build
well, *shrug* can't make everybody happy.


but i agree that there is too much Zonechat in DOFFJOBS,
that was so before the sheet too,
i brought some order to chaos with my sheets.

Sadly the channel is not moderated, whoever created it is long gone,
there is no way to take over an existing channel with an inactive owner, the GM's won't hand it over either (didn't even react to my ticket...).
Result: a few arguing users can bring the whole channel off topic rather fast.

We tried to pull the *discussions* out of DOFFJOBS by creating DOFFCHAT -> didn't work, people did not jump for it.
So we created DOFFCALLS to get the calls in a clean channel for everyone who wants to see them and NO chit-chat and for our Editors to edit them into the sheet, or even as an option to highlight the calls in bright **** color between the chit chat.

All options are there.


DOFFCALLS is moderated and has strict rules, NO CHIT-CHAT, NO DISCUSSIONS (that includes asking where assignment XYZ is ) -> go to DOFFJOBS for that, but even there you may be told to look at the sheet.
Teach a man to fish and all that...

Bridge Invites are also allowed in CALLS (it's in the channel description), but the users usually prefer to keep them in JOBS to not distract the Editors.


...i think thats all there is to say about that.
Starfleet Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 412
# 30
07-09-2012, 08:23 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by mikewendell View Post
The link does not work for "anyone".
True - I have given the full link to DoffJobs spreadsheet to many friends because they could not access it (or did not care to use) the bit.ly/doffs link.

I understand that it can be challenging to ask in the DoffJobs channel to get the full link, or to get an answer other than 'check the sheet' if you're asking about a particular assignment. I also understand it is equally challenging if you're in the DoffJobs channel and constantly seeing the same question every few minutes.

@Z3R0B4NG & @LucasPurcell have done an outstanding job with the DoffTrekker spreadsheet, link also found on that url. It can take some time to set up, but is an excellent way to track your toon's DOffing, and links to the spreadsheet in real time, so if you're looking for a particular assignment you will know when it's been reported.

It's still very important that people who utilize these tools also give 'clean calls' in the DoffCalls channel, otherwise none of the tools will work.
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