Lt. Commander
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 247
# 41
07-10-2012, 12:24 AM
No, the whole point is that they make a shiny new ship, which people will gladly pay for...and then, out of the blue, only a short while after many bought it, anounce that a better version of it will come out for free. But, get this, those that bought the ship will have todo the same gridn just to keep their ship playable.

So basically, the reward their customers with twice the work, while those that didn't buy it only have to grind for it once.

That's a slap in the face no matter how you try to justify it, but then again, hardly a surprise given their current track record.
Don't fall for the fake advertising: Guild Wars 2 is a WoW clone and a poor one too.
Lieutenant
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 39
# 42
07-10-2012, 05:37 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by sotaudi View Post
First of, it is not "free." If someone gets one of these ships, it is because they earned the ship in game. And just because the Armitage can be bought by spending money for C-Points/Zen does not mean that someone cannot likewise earn Dilithium in game and buy it. So even now, the Armitage can be obtained "free of charge" by your own standards. I own the Armitage, but I what I find outrageous is your notion that, just because money can be spent for it, it should be better than anything someone can actually earn by just playing the game. No game should be pay to win, so no paid item or capability should be unavailable unless you pay real money for it. If this game worked that way, I would not play it.

That aside, you seem to be having a problem with the meaning of the term "refit" and "retrofit." "Refit" and "Retrofit" are both terms to describe the upgrading of systems on an existing ship. In other words, you are arguing against your own point. It is far easier, faster, and cheaper to take an existing ship and upgrade its systems and improve its capabilities than it is to build a new one from the keel up. This is especially true in a war. You don't discard your current fleet and start building all brand new ships. You also don't leave your existing less-capable ships to be fodder for the enemy while you build a new fleet from scratch. You take your existing fleet and upgrade their capabilities, adding new ships as you can afford to and as time permits.
You sir, need to take a look at ST canon, in ST canon the Refit versions of a ship are a completely new ship that the older versions still in service can and will be turned into. I just think it is strange that when the Thunderchild and the Armitage, both of a clearly newer and more advanced dsesign are not used in refitting the old ships. Why take the time to refit a ship if not all of the advancements are put into it? To me that seems silly.

Also during the Dominion war it is canon that Utopia Planetia never had its docks filled 100% and I refuse to believe that Utopia Planetia is the only shipyard in the UFP. In my opionion older designs thus should no longer be built but the existing verions of those ships should be refitted into the 2407 version. While this may take longer then a small refit, it will increase combat effectiveness and lifespan.





Anyhow, I just think this action of adding a fleet version of the HEC to be a complete and utter slap in the face of its loyal customers.
Lieutenant
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 97
# 43
07-10-2012, 05:57 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by thibash View Post
No, the whole point is that they make a shiny new ship, which people will gladly pay for...and then, out of the blue, only a short while after many bought it, anounce that a better version of it will come out for free. But, get this, those that bought the ship will have todo the same gridn just to keep their ship playable.

So basically, the reward their customers with twice the work, while those that didn't buy it only have to grind for it once.

That's a slap in the face no matter how you try to justify it, but then again, hardly a surprise given their current track record.
'twice the work'?

I highly doubt you went ahead and grinded ALL that dilithium to get the heavy escort carrier.

Besides, the sheer amount of fleet credits needed to get it will probably rival the dilithium method. Sure dilithium is harder to get and has a cap, but fleet credits don't exactly fall out of the sky like EC, it takes days and days of constant contribution to get anywhere near 20k FCs, and even that is nowhere near the amount needed.

Then add on to the fact that you need to UPGRADE YOUR STARBASE to even get the OPTION to buy it, which will take months in it's own right, and it seems pretty fair to me.

Quote:
Originally Posted by vnixned View Post
Anyhow, I just think this action of adding a fleet version of the HEC to be a complete and utter slap in the face of its loyal customers.
Uhm, no.

If anything, this is showing that cryptic doesn't care just about money, it's giving everyone a fair chance of getting it without even having to grind mindlessly for their store credits. This move shows me that they care about their ENTIRE consumer base, and not just the ones that buys every single one of their pretty expensive ships.

Last edited by abyssinain; 07-10-2012 at 06:00 AM.
Ensign
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 23
# 44 so get this
07-10-2012, 06:25 AM
So instead you have to mine endlessly for a star base that probably is not yours to get FHEC? It seems they want us to play and do nothing else but don't worry once you got it they'll replace it with something on the z-store that's better. Does the idea of that not get to you at all.
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,040
# 45
07-10-2012, 08:04 AM
This royally pisses me off.

That Armitage HEC cost 2000 c-points, which isn't exactly small money these days. Now I'm told it's going to be obsolete come season 6 and I have to grind for months to even have a hope of getting the version that's on par with the fleet ships. Also, depending on any future details, I may actually have to pay even MORE money for it.

The HEC came out just under a month ago, so cryptic must have known how quickly it was going to become outdated.

Meanwhile the Jem'Hadar attack ship, an already overpowered and tanky escort, gets a free buff to hull and shields and an extra console slot.

I have a suggestion for Cryptic - A month or so after season 6 comes out, adjust the HEC so it matches what the fleet HEC is currently on tribble (extra hull, shields and sci console slot). Meanwhile remove the fleet title from the HEC in the fleet store and that way we are all happy as they'll be the same, despite the fact people will be able to get the same ship for almost free, while we paid for it. I sure all of us who have *paid* for it expect this.

(Personally I'd be happy if you removed it's ability to equip danube runabouts)

I'm sorry if this sounds unkind, but this decision has made a lot of us angry.
Previously Alendiak
Daizen - Lvl 52 Engineer - Eclipse
Selia - Lvl 60 Tactical - Eclipse

Last edited by orondis; 07-10-2012 at 08:09 AM.
Ensign
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 23
# 46 Completely Agree
07-10-2012, 09:05 AM
orondis i completely agree with you. They knew well in advance what they were doing and this is wrong.
Survivor of Romulus
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 2,850
# 47
07-10-2012, 09:27 AM
since you have to spend C-points for the Fleet Heavy Escort Carrier Retrofit (best version) I think if you already own said C-store ship, you should just have to pay the Fleet credits for it. or get a really big discount on the token needed.
Banned
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 275
# 48
07-10-2012, 09:40 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by tenkari View Post
since you have to spend C-points for the Fleet Heavy Escort Carrier Retrofit (best version) I think if you already own said C-store ship, you should just have to pay the Fleet credits for it. or get a really big discount on the token needed.
Agreed, but unfortunately, "should" is not something Cryptic practices often.

They release the Armitage, then a few weeks later, its upgrade... both costing CPoints.

Ferengi, thy name is Stahl.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 185
# 49 reply
07-12-2012, 03:37 AM
well i fly an armitage and the stock model is a pretty well rounded escort . her abilty to field several different small classes of fighters and shuttles gives her lots of staying power and hopefully their will be new fighters and hangers to purchase in future but the fleet version while slightly more hull and maybe an extra console slot isnt going to be much diffrence except for the torpedo point defense system that only comes on cstore variant time that with a good quantum torpedo spread and cannons on volley fire you stand to do massive damage.
so buy it from cstore or grind in fleet for slightly better version without torpedo console your choice. i am probably not i will stick with what i already got she has lots of abilities especially with the danubes and their tractor beams
.but 1 or the other minus the 1 console are still going to be pretty enven so buy it or grind it your choice
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 171
I fly an Armitage that is equipped with the Assimilation module and Borg deflector dish and Mark XII Rare Reman Proto-type Shield and Impulse Engine. It is equipped with 3 MarkXII Dual Heavy Phaser Cannons, 3 Mark XI Phaser Turrets, Photon Point Defense System and a Plasma Torpedo. Its fighters are Advanced Peregrine Fighters and I have a Scorpion Fighter or Peregrine Fighter device.
All I can say about the ship is...It is one bad ass little boat. I got console to boost the damage output of the phasers and the torpedoes. Got the console which adds resistance to all and to improve its shields (10,477 right now).

My hopes for the Fleet Heavy Escort Carrier. A Lt. Commander Universal station. another tactical console slot and another fighter hanger slot. Improve its shielding and hull points. I think it would be a well balanced ship. I would use the Universal Lt. Commander slot for either a Science officer of engineer, not another tactical officer. So to improve its recovery of hull and shields.
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