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Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,241
Seems the devs forgot about the pancake of doom when they made the fleet ship system.

Yes, they are in the fleet system ship list but they forgot one tiny little thing:


Players already PAID for both of these ships.

In essence the tier 5 nebula is already the Tier 3 Nebula upgraded to 'fleet' in both console slots,shield and HP. Their unique consoles ceased working (as in, in practical application) after F2P patch.

The Nebula ships, unlike all other ships, are not 'free' token ships. The tier 3 ship had to be purchased and the tier 5 had to be purchased. Now the tier 5 nebula has to be paid for a third time to upgrade it to a fleet version and gain... very little in return.

I would suggest the devs make an exception for this unique c-store only (all versions) available ship.

- allow owners of the tier 3 nebula to 'turn it in' to pay for the tier 5 upgrade.
- Give the fleet tier 5 nebula a special ability when it equips both the tier 3 and tier 5 nebula consoles..just like the jemhadar ship gets a bonus when the jemhadar set is used.

That bonus should be sensor/countermeasures oriented. For example, have the 2-console 'bonus' be to double the effect of sensor analysis while either console is activated.


... minor changes to the consoles require their effect to last for 60 seconds each and change their bonuses from increasing sensor strength (which does nothing but increase the chance of detecting cloaked ships...which is a BROKEN mechanic since F2P and there is no timeframe on when and if that will be fixed, if ever) to being a bonus in countermeasures (jam sensors, scramble sensors).

The fleet nebula should have the following changes:

1 less tactical console and be given a fifth science console. Total 4 engineering, 5 science, 1 tactical.

Change the universal boff station allocation. Instead of the Lt station being the universal, have the Lt. Cmdr be the universal.

So the boff stations would remain the same except it would be : Cmdr. Science, Lt Cmdr Universal, Lt Engineering, Lt Science, Ensign Science

What this would do:

It fixes one MAJOR issue with the Tier 3 nebula purchase: Pre-F2P we were told that those who bought the Tier 3 nebula would receive it account-wide as if it was a cstore ship. This wasn't done and today you cannot make a new character and have it able to claim the tier 3 nebula since the pre-f2p unlock is not granted.

It fixes the fact that those who paid for the tier 3 nebula pre-f2p and post-f2p wont get screwed over three times by this new minitransaction scheme.

It fixes the fact that the nebula consoles are useless.

It makes the Fleet Nebula an incredible support ship and crowd controller. A true science ship worthy of the canon role and presence of the Nebula starship type.
http://media.tumblr.com/160cacdb395f8340dac90864182ebe16/tumblr_inline_mx9yxhItkb1qg9pkt.jpg
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,241
# 2
07-15-2012, 06:30 AM
So many views and no comment from devside. hmm...
http://media.tumblr.com/160cacdb395f8340dac90864182ebe16/tumblr_inline_mx9yxhItkb1qg9pkt.jpg
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 460
# 3
07-15-2012, 06:51 AM
may be because it's like - the weekend. you know these guys have a life outside cryptic's office yeah?

There are several ships which do not have a fleet equivalent so i can only assume this is a design decision rather than an omission.

In Game: @Liath | STO Join Date: Jan 2012 | PWE Join Date: Feb 2009
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,241
# 4
07-15-2012, 10:08 AM
There is only one fleet version of the nebula yet there are two c-store purchased nebula class ships.

Players who purchased both don't know which one is being upgraded and worse, are not really receiving much of a benefit for having purchased the two ships. Since it is the only c-store exclusive ship in the game sold in tier 3 and 5 it should get something nifty in the fleet version.
http://media.tumblr.com/160cacdb395f8340dac90864182ebe16/tumblr_inline_mx9yxhItkb1qg9pkt.jpg
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 460
# 5
07-15-2012, 10:09 AM
not correct. Excelsior is available in T3 and T5 and i don't believe it even has a fleet version at all.

In Game: @Liath | STO Join Date: Jan 2012 | PWE Join Date: Feb 2009
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 235
# 6
07-15-2012, 01:00 PM
In the shipyard, my nebula is already discounted, as I bought the higher-tier version, so at least that is okay but...I see your point. If people buy the lower-tier C-Store ships, at this point the dev's are saying you're paying $10+ for a skin and console; if you want a tier 5 ship, you'll have to fork over $20 more. Not cool at all.

As for your changes, it's interesting to note that with your proposed station changes, you can turn the Nebula into the fleet versions of the Nova, Intrepid, and Hope...sans turn rate and consoles, of course. I actually like it, though I would still utilize the universal for a "tanky" 2-station engineering Nebula. But remember, the Nebula is pretty much the replacement for the Miranda: a workhorse vessel capable of molding into any role. It saw a lot of action in the Dominion War, just like its bigger brother, the Galaxy (why that ship isn't as modular in the game is beyond me).

So, throwing in 5 science consoles would be best suited for the LRSV, given the station setup for that vessel. If you've seen me post before, you'd have noted I propose switching the LRSV console setup to the Nebula, Nebula to the DSSV, and DSSV setup to the LRSV. The Nebula should be able to pick up any role and do it fairly well, so giving it a 3/3/4 console setup grants it that, while still staying true to the game's idea of it as a science vessel (it's actually more like a cruiser/science hybrid, like the Vesta). It might not have the weapon setup the Galaxy could muster, but it still packed a powerful punch. 4/2/4 makes sense for the tanky DSSV, and honestly 3/2/5 makes sense for either the Hope or Intrepid.

As for the consoles that come with the Intrepid, I think the current RA Nebula console should have gone to the T3 Nebula, since the latter's console is worthless; at least the detection grid has a good use in PvP. The RA Nebula's console should actually be three, each one based of off its pod. Or, be an innate ability that has toggle between sci/engi and tac, like the D'kora. This might help the ship sell a lot more than it is, which is perhaps why they just don't seem to give a damn about another iconic vessel from TNG. So really, if the T3 Nebula's console was actually useful, that would fit right in line with the dev's selling you a console when you buy a lower-tier vessel even if it was focused more on PvP than PvE.

Just a few thoughts.
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,241
# 7
07-15-2012, 03:13 PM
detection grid does not work in pvp. You can easily test it by having another player with white equipment mk. X who has no bonus capt. points on stealth fly a cloaked ship (klingon) from 10km to 1km range from you at half speed.

With and without the detection console activated the range in which you pick them up is always 3~4km.


Funny thing is... even using both consoles at once and max aux power plus every possible boost you can get to stealth detection...you still will only detect it at 3~4km.

Its a broken mechanic. Since F2P.
http://media.tumblr.com/160cacdb395f8340dac90864182ebe16/tumblr_inline_mx9yxhItkb1qg9pkt.jpg
Survivor of Romulus
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 1,540
# 8
07-15-2012, 06:20 PM
First you do get a discount on the Fleet version for any C-Store ship you own.

Second, have you looked at the BOFF layout of the Nebulas?

Tier 3
***
*

**
**
*
Tier 5
****
*

***
**
**

The Tier 5 and Tier 3 basically have the same BOFF layout but the Tier 5 is more advanced and that's what the Fleet Nebula became.
Disclaimer:While I don't have the Fleet Nebula BOFF layout infront of me here I'm 90% sure it has the T5 Nebula layout.

I will take your word that the consoles don't work, I will take your word that Cryptic broke promises, I play KDF I'm all too familiar with broken promises.

And I'm not sure but I believe the layout your asking for does exist on other ships, with the Fleet Olympic having a Lt.Com Eng and the Fleet Nova having a Lt.Com Tac. Just without the Universal.
I was once DKnight1000, apparently I had taken my own name so now I'm DKnight0001.
If I ask you a question it is not an insult but a genuine attempt to understand why.
When I insult you I won't be discreet about it, I will be precise and to the point stupid.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 235
# 9
07-15-2012, 07:59 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by cmdrskyfaller View Post
detection grid does not work in pvp. You can easily test it by having another player with white equipment mk. X who has no bonus capt. points on stealth fly a cloaked ship (klingon) from 10km to 1km range from you at half speed.

With and without the detection console activated the range in which you pick them up is always 3~4km.


Funny thing is... even using both consoles at once and max aux power plus every possible boost you can get to stealth detection...you still will only detect it at 3~4km.

Its a broken mechanic. Since F2P.
Ah, I stand corrected. Never use it for PvP, only heard rumors that it was "good" for it.

Although now I'm more depressed that they've given the Nebula such a massive shaft.
Captain
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 2,192
# 10
07-15-2012, 10:28 PM
To take advantage of nebula stealth detection you need to be science captain with sensor scan. It all stacks nicely together. But in order to see cloaked ships you would have to equip all +sensors consoles.
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