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Lt. Commander
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 118
Hello, I am currently using my first VA cruiser build by using a MU Assault Cruiser on my VA 50 TAC. Here is my load out:

http://img441.imageshack.us/img441/6...2072212532.jpg

(Be ware, I am slowly upgrading to MK XII once i get enough salvage)
Weaponry:
Fore:
Quantum Torpedo Launcher Mk XII [Borg]
Dual Antiproton Beam Bank Mk XII [Borg]
Antiproton Beam Array Mk XII [Borg]
Antiproton Beam Array Mk XI [Borg]

Aft:
x3 Antiproton Beam Array Mk XI [Borg]
Quantum Torpedo Launcher Mk XI [Borg]

Systems:
Borg Deflector
Borg Engine
Assimilated Module
MACO Shield (recommended by Cedric in DOFFJOBS)

Consoles:
TAC:
Warhead Yield Chamber Mk XI (Blue Quality)
Zero Point Quantum Chamber MK XI (Green Quality)
Antiproton Mag Regulator (Common)

ENG:
Ablative Armor
Parametallic Hull Armor
Electroceramic Hull Armor
RCS Accelerator (all Rares)

SCI:
Assimilated Module
Antimatter Spread

So what do I improve? I want to run STF's, but I have alot of survivability and durability, and firepower if possible.
Survivor of Romulus
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 1,419
# 2
07-22-2012, 09:49 PM
It's an Assault Cruiser just do a search there have been hundreds of threads about how to build them.

The only difference between the Mirror Universe Assault and the normal one is how it looks.
I was once DKnight1000, apparently I had taken my own name so now I'm DKnight0001.
If I ask you a question it is not an insult but a genuine attempt to understand why.
When I insult you I won't be discreet about it, I will be precise and to the point stupid.
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 658
# 3
07-22-2012, 10:10 PM
Yes, there are indeed a lot of AC related threads but since its a MU ship I like to outfit it more aggressively than normal.


I will start by saying that OP has what my fleet calls a 'standard starfleet cruiser doctrine' type loadout with single fore and aft torpedo tubes, and 5BA/1DBB for primary weapons.


This loadout is perfectly feasible and easy to use, however your Tactical Console setup may need optimization.

For ships with less than 4-5 tac consoles, you may wish to try putting all Antiproton consoles for maximum primary weapon damage. This will allow you to increase your beam weapon damage (unbuffed) to somewhere very near to 1000 damage per shot or more if your Captain skills are specced for max damage.

The Borg 3 pc set gives you excellent auto repair and there is nothing wrong using the MACO shield for a power boost during combat maneuvers. (Power Conduit Link). Infact this is the most reliable recommendation for cruisers.

For armor setup I would recommend you take a review of the common threats you will be facing.

If it's STFs, save yourself a few bucks and use Electroceramic and Monotanium, because

1) Plasma weapon proc is deadly in Season 6 and EC armor gives you 35-38 specialized plasma resistance.
2) Monotanium is cheap anti torpedo defence.

However, for Fleet Actions you will now need to spec for variable threats per mission, thus 2-3 Neutronium Armor is recommended for versatility. Alone, a single N armor is not effective, but 2-3 stacked will give you at least 30-40 (depending on quality and captain skills) resistance to everything.

Lastly, you will need to shield tank a lot in a cruiser, and I strongly recommend considering putting Emitter Array, Field Generator, or Shield Emitter Amp in your Science consoles to increase your shield healing. In particular Emitter Amp allows more useful 'natural' shield regeneration in combat at 125 shield power.

FG increases shield capacity while emitter array slightly increases your EPTS, ST1, etc single-shot shield heals.
Feel free to experiment with either regen tanking (using 125 pwr and regen over time buff like TSS2 and Brace for Impact with shield distribution officer), or brute heal tanking or a combination thereof.

Finally, I would dump the RCS accelerator console as if you really want turnrate and fast attack capability, use the Omega 3 pc set for 15 deg/sec turnrate in combat plus a tactical cruise speed of impulse 28. Plus.. can't go wrong with Tetryon Rider.

To compensate for lack of tanking ability my MUAC is specced to rapid fire single copies of every shield buff and regen power there is, and all Tactical bridge officer power recharge times are only 9 to 15 seconds (as opposed to 30 for normal).

This coupled with extremely high standard combat speed and turnrate allows for much more effective tanking and offensive capability than the usual MACO setups... enough to run continuous cannon rapid fire (alpha strike in excess of 2.2k DPS) with polaron weapons.

As a defense suppression vessel polaron procs (especially from Phased Polaron from "Boldly They Rode" has the potential to create massive debuffs and can literally shut down PvE enemies with just a few salvoes, since Flow Capacitors captains skill enhances all those power drains. This with the effective CRF1 recharge time of less than 9 seconds, created a much more effective "destroyer" ship than just relying on Antiproton criticals.
STF Flight Instructor since Early 2012. Newbies are the reason why STO lives and breathes today. Do not discriminate.

My Youtube Channel

Last edited by carmenara; 07-22-2012 at 10:20 PM.
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 538
# 4
07-22-2012, 10:50 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by dknight0001 View Post
The only difference between the Mirror Universe Assault and the normal one is how it looks.
Not entirely true. The Mirror Assault has the Star Cruiser's +200 crew advantage.
Lieutenant
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 43
# 5
07-22-2012, 11:24 PM
first off you need at least one tac team 1. second, you need 2 emergency power to shields. 3rd and most importantly drop the boarding party! like wow I cant stress it enough, drop the boarding party.

Since you are a tac you could try out DEM3 or warp plasma 3 instead of 2. Or even aux2sif3 if you need some more hull heals.

something like

tac team 1, high yield 2
fire at will 1

shields 1, rsp 1, warp plasma 1, dem 3
shields 1, eng team 2, aux2sif 2

hazard emitter 1, transfer shields 2

this is a really basic setup. You could try swapping a few things around, like aux2sif 3/dem2.
You could also try 2 power to weapons 1 with 2 power to shields 2.


Consoles,

Eng: whatever plasma resist is x3, borg console
Sci: field gen "for extra shields" and either another field gen, or whatever p2w you have in there.
Tac: 3x antiproton


The turn rate console is a waste of time, you turn slow! a console isnt going to help.


3 more things, try out all beams and grab a beta 1. Whatever you do please answer this one question, what is power to aux 2 doing for you???? and 3rd, the name SFC3 as in star fleet command 3!
Koopa27 -X-treme
Survivor of Romulus
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 1,419
# 6
07-23-2012, 12:58 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by carmenara View Post
For armor setup I would recommend you take a review of the common threats you will be facing.

If it's STFs, save yourself a few bucks and use Electroceramic and Monotanium, because

1) Plasma weapon proc is deadly in Season 6 and EC armor gives you 35-38 specialized plasma resistance.
2) Monotanium is cheap anti torpedo defence.

However, for Fleet Actions you will now need to spec for variable threats per mission, thus 2-3 Neutronium Armor is recommended for versatility. Alone, a single N armor is not effective, but 2-3 stacked will give you at least 30-40 (depending on quality and captain skills) resistance to everything.
I very much disagree with the Electroceramic and Monotanium combination, 2 Neutronium are much better than either of these and suited to ever situation and also help against the Borg's Shield ignoring Antiproton beams.

Quote:
Originally Posted by matridunadan1 View Post
Not entirely true. The Mirror Assault has the Star Cruiser's +200 crew advantage.
You have got me there but 200 crew in a game where crew have little effect isn't such a big deal.
I was once DKnight1000, apparently I had taken my own name so now I'm DKnight0001.
If I ask you a question it is not an insult but a genuine attempt to understand why.
When I insult you I won't be discreet about it, I will be precise and to the point stupid.
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 658
# 7
07-23-2012, 01:56 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by dknight0001 View Post
I very much disagree with the Electroceramic and Monotanium combination, 2 Neutronium are much better than either of these and suited to ever situation and also help against the Borg's Shield ignoring Antiproton beams.

EC (rare) = +35 Plasma / Tetryon Resistance, dirt cheap
Mono (rare) +35 Kinetic Resistance, dirt cheap

N (varying quality = +16 to +18 to all resistance, for a new player, he has to fork out quite a lot or know where to get them as mission rewards.

For a pure STF ship or a non-fleeted player learning STFs for the first time, he does not need to spend upwards of 400k (depending on seasonal variation) for a set of Neutroniums.

It is also proven that in pre S6 double or even triple Monotanium can almost torpedo proof a ship and this can be very useful to create adaptive resistance loadouts running a combination of Neutronium and focused resistances versus specific threats, at the player's discretion. In post S6, plasma resistance becomes important due to the plasma fire proc improvements.

There are many cases where you are going to expect to face certain enemy types in certain campaigns or scenarios.

For players like you and I who have been around for a while, we can afford Rare or Very Rare Neutronium for primary ships, and I do run 2-3 N armor at all times for the fleet actions for the reasons you mention.

That's all well and good provided the toon in question is rich and overflowing with EC.

For any other cases and especially for the newer pilots amongst us it's much cheaper to armor against certain primary threats - such as the insane projectile damage from PvE enemies, and ignore stuff that doesn't pose a threat, such as antiproton beams from Borg Cubes. They do so pitiful damage that a single A2SIF can out-heal the beam effectively.

Neutronium armor, esp. multiple copies thereof is definitely very effective.

But just like there are many ways to combine a variety of tactical, eng and sci solutions to create a powerful combat vessel, there's a lot more to starship defence than just "Neutronium everything", or at least, I do hope that the OP will approach starship design with an open mind instead of conforming to rules that he/she does not yet realize or comprehend.

Many players do take ideas off the forums for their own builds. Some do wholesale copies in the hope they are the top dog in combat performance.

Others take in the ideas involved in starship construction. They experiment, compare notes, review strategies and create their own custom high performance solution.

Ideas make for highly effective Captains who then go out to teach other newer players the art of starship construction, and explain why certain trends are popular and how to achieve goals using a variety of methods.

Like all my current STO related activities, I don't tell people "run DHCs and turrets only". STO is structured in an open and (outside of certain modes of gameplay) experimentation-friendly format that it'll be a waste to dumb it down to one or two strategies that everyone reports "noobs failing" on.

But of course, I am taking this stand because I've seen a lot of cases where a radically different idea starts to take a foothold in a certain department and start to grow into a viable strategy through collaborative input and sharing of ideas.

And that's what I'm here to do. I don't tell people learning the game (as OP obviously is doing, judging from the Bridge Officer setup alone) to run Neutronium and put a full stop to that.
STF Flight Instructor since Early 2012. Newbies are the reason why STO lives and breathes today. Do not discriminate.

My Youtube Channel
Survivor of Romulus
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 1,419
# 8
07-23-2012, 10:31 AM
@carmenara your right I have forgotten the high cost of Neutronium armor.

I keep a couple pieces on each character when I win it in STFs for that next ship, Also with the exchange currently bugged to the Delta Quadrant and back I'm finding prices weird and all over the place.

I don't know how fast he can grind Dilitium, but if he's hitting 8k a day it might be quicker for him to get it out of the D-Store than buy it off the exchange.
I was once DKnight1000, apparently I had taken my own name so now I'm DKnight0001.
If I ask you a question it is not an insult but a genuine attempt to understand why.
When I insult you I won't be discreet about it, I will be precise and to the point stupid.
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 3,400
# 9
07-23-2012, 11:51 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by starfleetfc View Post
Weaponry:
Fore:
Quantum Torpedo Launcher Mk XII [Borg]
Dual Antiproton Beam Bank Mk XII [Borg]
Antiproton Beam Array Mk XII [Borg]
Antiproton Beam Array Mk XI [Borg]

Aft:
x3 Antiproton Beam Array Mk XI [Borg]
Quantum Torpedo Launcher Mk XI [Borg]
Stick with 6 beam arrays minimum, 7 would be better.


You're not really going to get very much out of multiple torpedo launchers and you won't have any powers to justify the DBB.


Quote:
Originally Posted by starfleetfc View Post
Consoles:
TAC:
Warhead Yield Chamber Mk XI (Blue Quality)
Zero Point Quantum Chamber MK XI (Green Quality)
Antiproton Mag Regulator (Common)
Tac consoles should be 3x AP Mag Regulator.

Beams make up the vast bulk of your damage output, anything else like a single Torpedo Launcher is a fun diversion at best.

Optimize for your beams.

Quote:
Originally Posted by starfleetfc View Post
ENG:
Ablative Armor
Parametallic Hull Armor
Electroceramic Hull Armor
RCS Accelerator (all Rares)
Switch to 2 to 3 Neutronium MK XI as soon as you can farm them (I forget which episode you can get this from).

4th slot I would put the Borg console.

RCS accelerator isn't useful or needed, and with more beam arrays not even a concern.

Quote:
Originally Posted by starfleetfc View Post
SCI:
Assimilated Module
Antimatter Spread
Switch to 2x Field Generator as soon as you can craft or afford them.

Antimatter Spread is not really useful in PvE, is overpowered in PvP and is the exact opposite of what you want out of a console as a Cruiser.

What I mean by that is part of what Antimatter spread does is placate enemies.

You don't want them placated, you want them shooting at you and not not the Escorts and Sci ships on your team.


If you can't craft Field Generators yourself, and can't afford them from the exchange you can send me a tell or mail in-game @USS_Ultimatum and if you provide the unreplicatable materials then I'll craft them for free.

Here is a BOFF template for you to work from:

MUAC BOFF Template


You'll notice some slots are left blank, this is on purpose.

Some suggestions:

1 Open Tac Power: APB 1 or BFAW 2 or APD 1 (APD only if you have threat control, if you're focusing on PvE and you are in a Cruiser you should have Threat Control)

Open Eng powers

Either 2x EPTS 2 or 2x EPTS 3 or a combination of EPTS 2 or 3.

Two copies of EPTS regardless, but you have flexibility here.

Other powers:

RSP (good on Elite STFs)
Extend Shields (good for allies, blockade, no win situation)
Eject Warp Plasma (good for blockade, STFs, most fleet content)

Last edited by ussultimatum; 07-24-2012 at 02:40 PM.
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 658
# 10
07-23-2012, 09:19 PM
Might want to go through some power management strategies before proposing the 8 beam loadout.

It has a lot of awesome sauce potential but if done wrong it will have problems killing anything with substantial hitpoints.

In PvP, sure, ditch the quantum torpedoes, they're not very useful in that context due to different engagement parameters.

By contrast most of the high performing teammates in PvEs, ESTFs and new fleet actions do use torpedoes effectively for coordinated burst damage.

DPS is not the only thing that matters in that environment, and I would simply ditch the threat control function altogether if OP is still learning his Boff setup.

There are many ways to use these ships. Stereotyping them as function X or function Y simply kills the possibility of a less inexperienced pilot appreciating the diversity of STO starship construction.

The strategy for OP's experience level would be : -

Keep the functional BA / DBB / torpedo loadout.

Explore a higher survivability Boff power setup, including RSP, Aux2SIF3, EPTSx2, ET1 with supporting Science powers for improved shield resistance.

Slap on a Shield Redistribution Officer so Brace for Impact is another shield booster.

Give him as much survivability as possible so he has room to play.

He will get his 8 beam loadout for optimal DPS and he will get his Threat Control by himself through gameplay experience. He will extend shields or supply team heals in future through his own initiative and efficient piloting methods that no longer require a dozen self defence options.

Asking the OP to max out Threat Control right now will lead to him having huge difficulties in any PvE situation. He will have to either get a crash course in uber tanking filling in a role he is unprepared for, or give up and get an expensive respec so he doesn't get killed 500 times per Fleet Alert.

The important thing to consider is this: -

Does OP run premade teams with specialist team roles in fixed strategies? No, or not all the time.
Is OP capable of surviving aggro from either i) a whole Fleet Alert enemy wave or ii) 5 Elite Borg Spheres simultaneously. No.

Ditch the threat control and let him learn boff power synergy gradually, to work up to the required competency for TC tanking.


So this is what I propose: -

There are already a lot of good ideas in this thread featuring multiple paths of development each focusing on a different aspect of the game.

We are not going to tell him how cruisers should be used.

What I want to hear is where the OP wants to go next, because if we would listen to the 'client' here, we will avoid the sort of massive confusion and conflict of priorities that are all too common in any ship discussion thread.

Person A would say, I have this ship, I kinda like it and would like to see if others can help make it better.

Person B comes along, says, no you're doing it ALL WRONG, do it this way instead.

What does this conversation chain accomplish? Nothing. Confusion and player development never takes place due to that rude interruption, that's what happens.

OP already has good ideas on how he wants his ship to be setup. I would propose listening to him first and foremost, to help him find his niche, and plan out a path to development for that 8-AP beam crit monster that in open team gameplay, is very elusive for a reason : -

It needs appreciation for min-max synergy and a specialist engagement style to make it work. Newer or less experienced players will not attain that synergy immediately.

So stick to the loadout OP has, is familiar with, and work on the next issues one step at a time.... which is bridge officer setup.
STF Flight Instructor since Early 2012. Newbies are the reason why STO lives and breathes today. Do not discriminate.

My Youtube Channel

Last edited by carmenara; 07-23-2012 at 09:24 PM.
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