Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 536
# 21
08-21-2012, 11:38 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by podsix View Post
They do, check out Millenium City in Champions online.. unfortunately in STO, the closest we have to that is "sector space" which no one wants to spend any time in, because it's just the space between missions.

I'd need to dig, but I seem to recall the CO devs admitting to the fact that MC is literally the biggest they can make with the current Crypric Engine, no bigger will be possible without zoning...

I do miss big sandboxes with behind-the-scenes zoning and big issues if you traded something to someone across a hidden server line in your house on Tatooine...
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Starfleet Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 5,747
# 22
08-21-2012, 10:03 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by podsix View Post
They do, check out Millenium City in Champions online.. unfortunately in STO, the closest we have to that is "sector space" which no one wants to spend any time in, because it's just the space between missions.
While they have demonstrated this, they have no willingness in STO. Mainly, because I think they don't know what to put in these cities.

Could you imagine if First City was that size, where the farther you got, the more delapodated the buildings become (I.E. the slums)? Or travelling through Downtown San Fran in traveling across the bay on a transport or even walking to Starfleet HQ or Starfleet Medical from Starfleet Academy? Or walking around the cities of Andoria, Vulcan, or even the resorts of Risa (which isn't Giligan's Island).
NO to ARC!

Season 9.5 = STO's NGE is Coming!
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 47
# 23
08-23-2012, 09:27 AM
I'm excited!
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The poster formerly known as LordOfPit, and his blog.
* Dec 2007 (CO)
* Oct 2008 (STO)
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 2,810
# 24
08-23-2012, 02:59 PM
Ok, first impressions:

I absolutely love the room legos and the doors. That kind of feature would make building sets so much less time consuming. And our sets would actually not be ugly mashes of the same 3 walls that don't fit together.

We absolutely need this for starbase and ship interiors, where I can easily attach an engineering room to a corridor that leads to a turbolfit, etc.

Really, really, really hope that there is someone actually making the legos for sto. But, I wouldn't be surprised if there is not. At the most basic level for sto, if they just ripped apart some interiors and gave the pieces, we'd probably be happy with that.

I also really like the added UA for subscribing to an author.

What really really confuses me is the lack of a popup dialogue in the story board. I can't imagine building missions without it, unless it's something that I add onto the map. In some ways that is much better to work with, since it can be tied into triggers. But I still use a lot of dialogues on the story board. Linking every one into a trigger would be annoying, and there are times when I wouldn't want to do so.

Anyways, I really hope to see some of this stuff make its way back to sto.

Last edited by kirksplat; 08-23-2012 at 03:07 PM.
Lieutenant
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 61
# 25
08-24-2012, 03:07 PM
I'm waiting for a costumization system for the ship interiors using the foundry, but since Cryptic is currently developing, neverwinter, Cryptic doesn't pay much attention to the STO's community, seeing how the neverwinter's foundry works, this give me a little hope...

however I cannot guarantee about a FULL and/or DEEP costumization (making custom hallways, custom lounge/mess hall, crew quarters, shuttlebay/hangars, custom bridges, etc...) but at least creating something more... unique and more according to the players' convenience and creating customs crewmembers (create our crewmembers with uniforms and races that the player's want)

for fleets, this may be also is great oportunity, the Creator of such fleet and High rank members can customize their starbase, aslo creating a proper zone for the starbase (let face it, no all want their starbase in a deep space, others want to their base in an asteriods' belt or orbiting a planet) as their want, making the starbase's interiors and zones more unique and different from others,

but when that happens, the game will be in season 8 or 9

I could be wrong, maybe this will never happens, but everyone has the right to dream.
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 5,425
# 26
08-25-2012, 09:13 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by kirksplat View Post
Ok, first impressions:

I absolutely love the room legos and the doors. That kind of feature would make building sets so much less time consuming. And our sets would actually not be ugly mashes of the same 3 walls that don't fit together.

We absolutely need this for starbase and ship interiors, where I can easily attach an engineering room to a corridor that leads to a turbolfit, etc.

Really, really, really hope that there is someone actually making the legos for sto. But, I wouldn't be surprised if there is not. At the most basic level for sto, if they just ripped apart some interiors and gave the pieces, we'd probably be happy with that.

I also really like the added UA for subscribing to an author.

What really really confuses me is the lack of a popup dialogue in the story board. I can't imagine building missions without it, unless it's something that I add onto the map. In some ways that is much better to work with, since it can be tied into triggers. But I still use a lot of dialogues on the story board. Linking every one into a trigger would be annoying, and there are times when I wouldn't want to do so.

Anyways, I really hope to see some of this stuff make its way back to sto.
The lack of pop-ups is because STO took a shortcut with hailing/combadges.

You'll actually have to walk up to someone to talk to them in Neverwinter and, presumably, stay in close range of them to talk.
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 844
# 27
08-26-2012, 01:34 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by stoleviathan99 View Post
The lack of pop-ups is because STO took a shortcut with hailing/combadges.

You'll actually have to walk up to someone to talk to them in Neverwinter and, presumably, stay in close range of them to talk.
That doesn't make sense to me. Even without hailing there are still going to be times where you need to have a dialogue pop-up. Someone you're passing by might yell for help, or ask you to come over and speak to them.

Not having pop-ups would be very constraining, maybe worse than any of the limitations we face right now in the STO Foundry. It basically means that all NPCs can only be used to react to the player, instead of actively engage the player themselves. (Imagine from the standpoint of the NPC that when a player talks to them a pop-up dialogue appears to them, when you get a pop-up dialogue it's because they acted first and initiated communication with you.)


Click here for my Foundry tutorial on Creating A Custom Interior Map.
Starfleet Veteran
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 110
# 28
08-26-2012, 03:24 AM
It is a shame that they're not implementing a system similar to the NWN1 Aurora toolset which was truly boundless in what you could do. You could even program (in a C++ like language) in what you wanted if it didn't exist. You could add your own models and create your own maps - rather than having to use their limited layouts. It's just sad knowing how amazing it could actually be...

Now that being said - thank goodness they've at least created the Foundry for STO & NWN3 and that there will be community content (unlike so many other games).
There are Four Lights... say no to ARC
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Survivor of Romulus
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 2,639
# 29
08-26-2012, 08:00 AM
If you're a gaming company you would do different things with a single player RPG editor than you would with an MMO. With an MMO you have to be concerned about people cheating and hacking which is why third party modding is generally out except for those games that allow interface editing. So naturally the Foundry for STO and NW is going to be limited. But hey, better than most MMOs, which don't have any sort of UGC editors.

As for the NW Foundry, its actually got me interested in the game, where I wasn't before. I'd love to see more.
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Lieutenant
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 81
# 30
08-27-2012, 12:48 AM
To address the players zorbane, jnohd, and azurianstar above talking about map/city size and zoning etc...

If you recall your GTA 3 to GTA VC, games such as these required splash screens to swap out maps and "rezone" the player. This was virtually done away with in GTA SA, as the only time it occurs is when you enter or exit a building. Then by GTA IV zoning seemed to vanish altogether.

So how was this accomplished? Graphics engineers and model makers now use LOD modeling. LOD is short for Level Of Detail and what we do now is start by making low resolution maps of the entire world with minimal texture. This model shows up in the far distance. As the player gets closer we replace both the mesh and texture with a medium resolution. The section of the map the player is currently working in is the highest detail. As the player moves, the high resolution is replaced with medium and low.

Another "trick" used is to only draw and calculate what is inside the player's view. This can best be seen in GTA SA. Traffic and peds appear from nowhere when your back is turned.

As for shear size, we had an argument at work about which game had the larger map. GTA SA or Morrowind? In the ESM editor manual it stated distance and then we found that GTA SA has a simple way to measure distance walked on foot or driven by car. It turned out the both maps were too close to call. Each 2.5 to 3 virtual miles end to end. However in the end it was pointed out that with the ESM editor that ships with Morrowind it could expand out to infinity, so we agreed that Morrowind won.
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