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Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 575
# 71
08-22-2012, 02:05 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by aetam1
The problem is something else. If you do pvp people often see it as a sport. And in sports you expect more or less equal chances due to equipment. If in boxing someone would put spikes on his gloves he would get an unfair advantage. Players want to measure their skills and not lose to a player with less skill because they could not afford some equipment.
Even in sports, you don't do squat if you don't have the financial means. Money makes the world spin around man, lol.
Hear! Sons of Kahless
Hear! Daughters too.
The blood of battle washes clean.
The Warrior brave and true.
We fight, we love, and then we kill...

Last edited by trueprom3theus; 08-22-2012 at 02:08 PM.
Empire Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 366
# 72
08-22-2012, 02:17 PM
Of course in every sport there are different lvls of equipment but for it to remain interesting it should be a measurement of skill not items. If you spend 500$ on a Hockey stick it will only help you if you know how to use it. It might provide an advantage but at a certain skill lvl I suppose all are using something like that. If you could win every game by simply getting a better stick no one would be interested in the sport.

I have no problem with people spending money to get the bug, or AMS, or things like that. I just feel the bug got a little too much love but it is not game breaking.
Empire Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 7,484
# 73
08-22-2012, 03:46 PM
the balance in this game should be like the rules in any professional sport. every conceivable thing is regulated so no one has an unfair advantage. in game there should be parameters that can only be exceeded if you give something up. advantages with disadvantages. something different but not necessarily better. anything less creates a replacement for skill, but if the skilled use that replacement for skill, the fair chance to win is gone. the competitive aspect has been removed and the compotition is made meaningless. the only winning move is not to play.

to go with the beyond parameter offense and mobility, it should have a defensive penalty, thats even canon. say 25k hitpoints and a .83 shield mod. go ahead and have 5 tac consoles, 4 eng consoles and a 20 turn rate, you give something up for that. its still worth trying to get, its offensive ability is unparalleled, just being different and better in a few ways is enough for it to be desirable.

i frankly dont care if all you bug users are of the opinion that it is not game breaking, your definition of game breaking must be very different from mine. removing a fair chance in a situation were you are apposing another ship is game breaking as far as im concerned.


Quote:
Originally Posted by husanakx View Post
Honestly this entire conversation reminds me of when people used to ba ba ba BOP... is BS OP crap. It can out turn anything. Of course after 4 or 5 more ships got released the BOP ain't so OP anymore right.

I will say this... they should have taken the recent bump it got with the 5th console and waited 1-2 months after season 6 to release it... this way they would have had more of the fleet ships in the wild first.... also they may have even sold a few more fleet ship to people that owned bugs... hahaha

Frankly if you don't like the bug don't worry... we are close to another doff pack promotions or something that will drop a small handful of them back into the system... Cryptic will use it to drive a weekend sale here soon enough.

We are most probably a month away from the end of the tholian box as well... the sales are starting to die down... anyone have any bets how good this next lock box Escort is going to be... lets be honest another escort is due up right.
there was frankly rightful cause for the bug to be called op, a LONG time ago now. back when sci could run amok, the long stuns during an alpha were death sentence, there was no distributing TT, shield striping was functional, all that kind of stuff. a bop cant do a quarter of the stuff it used to be able to do, and on top of that there is a federation only escort that can use all the bops best station combinations. claims that the bop was op ALWAYS being bs is an exaggeration. at least in this case the bop gave up a dramatic amount of survivability for its advantages. thanks to F2P and the unchecked power creep, any attempt to balance advantages with disadvantages has been abandon, and the bop is a sad relic of a better time.
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Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,808
# 74
08-22-2012, 06:31 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by aetam1 View Post
Other people might say spending much money on a car is stupid. STO is a hobby and hey even gambling could be a hobby.

A car can get you laid, is tangible, can retain value better and be resold well after it was ceased to be manufactured.

Being an STO packrat just means you spend more money to buy gold, use bots or grind more than others. Hardly anything to be proud of.

Probably the same kind of people who spend 1000+ on gear in Diablo 3.
Banned
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 846
# 75
08-22-2012, 07:14 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by snoge00f View Post
A car can get you laid, is tangible, can retain value better and be resold well after it was ceased to be manufactured.

Being an STO packrat just means you spend more money to buy gold, use bots or grind more than others. Hardly anything to be proud of.

Probably the same kind of people who spend 1000+ on gear in Diablo 3.
Will retain value much better. Can actually Gain in value, with your investments, in addition to those other benefits.
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 668
# 76
08-22-2012, 07:34 PM
Eh the Bug is no more op then any of the 200 cruisers that have been released that are better then the star cruiser.

Honestly you will find me in the ques in my bug... and the first time I get into a match that doesn't have a....

Bortas... Or Oddy.... Or Fleet Vorcha... Or Galor... Or dkora... Or Excel... Or Even a Dread

I'll put my bug in the garage... and get my old advanced escort out... hahaha

You can all look forward to seeing my bug for awhile I think.

Frankly having to fire at a cruiser for 20 min before it gets into any real trouble is far more game breaking then my bug having 7% more DPS then my advanced escort.... well at least till we unlock the Fleet Mvam then you can start complaining about that one.
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 341
# 77
08-22-2012, 07:51 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by husanakx View Post
Frankly having to fire at a cruiser for 20 min before it gets into any real trouble is far more game breaking then my bug having 7% more DPS then my advanced escort.
Except a cruiser is supposed to be a tank. It should have superior defense and hp. The tradeoff is that it's inferior dps against a skilled escort pilot won't put a scratch on it. Even if it does, the Escort Captain can just pop Omega and be out of combat range within 2 seconds. With no chance of a pursuit, the Escort heals up and the Cruiser renews it cooldowns for round 2.

Cruiser defense has since been nerfed into the ground since the days of pre-F2P. Tanking more than 1 skilled enemy isn't really possible anymore and healing a focus-fired teammate is frustrating at best, drawing the focus on yourself at worst.

Until New Maps and Objective-based PvP mechanics are added, this won't change and fighter ships will continue to rule the galaxy.

Superior Speed and Turnrate boosts defense immensely with no tradeoff. That's why I don't understand why everyone cries about a cruiser using FAW and it's "OP'd" accuracy.

Last edited by doomicile; 08-22-2012 at 08:01 PM.
Banned
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 846
# 78
08-22-2012, 07:52 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by husanakx View Post
Eh the Bug is no more op then any of the 200 cruisers that have been released that are better then the star cruiser.

Honestly you will find me in the ques in my bug... and the first time I get into a match that doesn't have a....

Bortas... Or Oddy.... Or Fleet Vorcha... Or Galor... Or dkora... Or Excel... Or Even a Dread

I'll put my bug in the garage... and get my old advanced escort out... hahaha

You can all look forward to seeing my bug for awhile I think.

Frankly having to fire at a cruiser for 20 min before it gets into any real trouble is far more game breaking then my bug having 7% more DPS then my advanced escort.... well at least till we unlock the Fleet Mvam then you can start complaining about that one.
Thing is you are doing far more than a mere 7 percent dps more. particularly if you have XII purps in the consoles.

Not only that but due to the superior speed and agility your time on target is increased by more than 7 percent against fast movers, since they will have a much harder time shaking you. The pivot point is also much more turn friendly than other escorts, particularly the poor Craptor, and MVAM/AE.

Your superior shield and hull mods also gaurantee durability, while having 2 universals to back you up, and Cmdr and Ltcmdr tacs.
Starfleet Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 623
# 79
08-22-2012, 08:22 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by snoge00f View Post
Probably the same kind of people who spend 1000+ on gear in Diablo 3.
Lies, I'm old school :3

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Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 4,899
# 80
08-22-2012, 08:32 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by travelingmaster View Post
Actually, I thought the Mirandas were the most-destroyed ship on screen?

You see annihilated Mirandas in First Contact (battle with the Borg Cube) and pretty much every other large-scale battle scene. They're cannon fodder. . .
Heh, no, even the Mirandas are like the USS Enterprise-E compared to Jem'Hadar bugships. Bugships were destroyed without hesitation on DS9. It seemed like they died by their groups of 3 on a regular basis whenever combat occurred. It was like lemmings jumping over a cliff, that's how frequently bugships were going kaput.

Yet here in STO, they are the most clearly superior ship in the game. Hands down.
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