Career Officer
Join Date: Oct 2012
Posts: 279
# 1991
12-27-2013, 01:38 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by des101 View Post
I was under the impression that once you had that person on your ignore list, you shouldn't be teamed up with said player in the queues.

All it is is an algorithm which checks yours blocked list against those you are about to team with. If a person is on that list, the algorithm ignores their name when looking for suitable team mates and searches for someone else.

Hence, if a person gets blocked by too many people then their queue times go through the roof as the pool of people who will play with said player is greatly reduced.
The plus side of this is that it does (in most cases) improve the overall attitude of the community as no-one wants to be stuck in a queue for hours on end because they've managed to nark off the rest of the community.

Again, no idea if they actually run that algorithm in this game but those I've chosen to ignore, I've never actually been teamed with them again so I've been either extremely lucky or one is in place.

Only the Devs can answer that one.
So it is within the realm of possibility to do what I orginally posted some 192 pages ago... If someone knows a Dev ask them if the algorithm exsists and how plausible would it be to implement this into our ignore system?

[For those wondering a algorithm is not where Al Gore claims to have invented the Internet.]

Last edited by arnthebard; 12-27-2013 at 01:43 PM.
Career Officer
Join Date: Oct 2012
Posts: 279
# 1992
12-27-2013, 01:45 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by arnthebard View Post
We have all been there either in a STF or a PvP. Everybody but one person is pulling thier weight. This person is usually underequipped or inexperienced or just there to farm the reward. Finally I got sick and tired of these types of people and I have devised a simple but elegant solution.

[b]ATTENTION DEVS:[b]

We need to use the ignore list from chat zone to effectively keep people from teaming up. Example: I get teamed up with John Doe, he goes AFK or does some stupid thing like deliberately aggroing enemies. I simply add him to the ignore list, then from now on I can no longer be teamed up with him in a PvP or STF pick up group. This would cut down on a huge number of complaints about behavior and give some relief to players who have the bad luck of being teamed with these AFK'ers. It would be as simple as a few lines of code written into the ignore command. This way these guys will find it harder and harder to do these events because people have blocked them from teaming up. They will eventually change thier behavior or it will take them longer to find a team they haven't made angry. This puts real consequences and accountability back into the game. You screw up you suffer the consequences not the other players who got stuck with you. You have one chance to do the right thing use it wisely....
Here is the original idea for those who don't like having to search the thread.
Empire Veteran
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 473
# 1993
12-27-2013, 03:05 PM
I didn't read the whole thing due to the thread being so old. (This really should be reposted as a newer topic if it is still relevant.)

However I did take a look at some of the more recent posts.

The suggestion that using the ignore list from chat as a way to filter people from grouping is impractical, since the chat part of the client appears to be separate from the actual game client. The chat covers all Cryptic's games, and is usally unaffected by hiccups in the game client (sometimes when I get 'server not responding' I can still chat before I get whacked from the server). Linking the two separate parts is asking for boatloads of trouble and not just for STO.

I made a suggestion for a similar mechanic quite a while ago in another similar thread (http://sto-forum.perfectworld.com/sh...d.php?t=834941). I will post the relevant part here...

Quote:
Originally Posted by abystander0 View Post
~snip~

Another way to deal with the issue is to use a type of tool similar to the chat ignore function. Since chat is separate from the rest of the game mechanics, using an ignore list to keep from being grouped with people a player dislikes would more than likely be quite difficult and have unforeseen side effects.

Instead, create a Do Not Group tool to the queue. This would allow players to designate other players who they would like to avoid for whatever reason. Since it would be part of the queuing system, it would be unaffected by chat ignores. Also such a feature should be activated from within a group setting, and would only take effect once the event is ended, this way the event in progress is not disrupted.

An example of how this might work in practice:

Players A, B, C, D, E, F and G are in the queue.

Player A and G have clear lists
Player B has C and D tagged.
Player C has D Tagged.
Player E has D Tagged.

Players A, F, and G would get in the group with no problems. Player D has 3 players flagging him, player C has B flagging him. So the group that would be formed would be A, C, E, F, and G. B would remain in the queue because he has C flagged, and C has no other flags raised against him. D would also remain in the queue since he is flagged by multiple players.

With a system like this, flagging a player does not affect the player who has been flagged, other than the two players involved will never be in the same public match. It does not add them to the ignore list, it does not bar them from the public queue. The benefit to this is that players can avoid repeat afkers and griefers, and such players will find wait times longer and longer, as the pool of players willing to put up with them shrinks.

As pleasant as this sounds, it can also be a double edged sword. If you have too many players flagged, the chances of you getting into a public match go down with each player added. For things like Crystaline Entity, Mine trap, Big Dig, the 20 man Starbase defense, this would inflate the queue times, and the number of players appearing in the queue.

In the long term this would help weed out the real problem players, those who deliberately grief or routinely go afk. But as with any system, its possible that someone would find a way to abuse it.

I thought I would toss these ideas out as an alternative since 3toK is quite hotly debated.
I keep seeing people bring up the afk issue over and over, but have not seen it myself recently (last 3 months). I queue up for ISE, KSE, Colony Invasion, Fleet Starbase Defense (5 man), and occasionally Storming the spire. I haven't seen anyone afk, but have seen some subpar players. Occasionally the game likes to rearrange hotbars, or send your bridge officers out for drinks when you enter a queued event, and it can take a minute or two to get yourself straightened out, so seeing someone parked at the spawn for a few minutes at the start isn't an issue for me (it is nice when people let others know they are having an issue from the outset so it can be compensated for).
Captain
Join Date: Mar 2013
Posts: 1,318
# 1994
12-27-2013, 03:32 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by tobar26th View Post
So, it's a long despised issue, and I dare say most Endgame players have seen it at some point or other - so let's talk about solutions!

The Problem
Various events - Fleet Activities, PVP Matches, STFs reward players for taking part in them. This reward is given out regardless of player participation so a player can queue up, sit at the Transwarp gate in PVP three times a day and get 1440 Dilithium.

Similarly in STFs, the player can come in, sit at spawn and do nothing, and as long as the match completes, get their two EDCs and 1100 dilithium.

Personal Rant: Played a Khitomer Accord Space Elite today with a PUG group (yes yes I know, don't PUG...but humour me) where I had two 'genius' level players. The first of which sat on spawn for the first five minutes, and when, out of pure spite, I pulled a Cube onto him RAN AWAY to the other side of the match and AFK'd there instead...and the second who came in and after a few minutes said 'what do I have to do?' and when asked if he'd done the normals said 'I didn't see the need, lesser rewards'.....geez!

Anyway off the rant, let's find a solution - now as I see it we have too main issues here - PVP AFKing where there's a winner, and PVE where it's cooperative.

So take a moment, propose your own solution - one for the competitive PVP, and one for the PVE where it's cooperative...

Competitive PVP
I like a particular idea here, and it's something that tech wise should be relatively simple, introduce a new wrapper mission in addition to the current 'play 3' mission. A second wrapper 'Win 3 PVP Matches'.

This way players who are pretty casual can come in, play three matches have some fun and not worry about winning, get their 1440 and go home.

However it should motivate most players to try and win their matches so they can grab the extra 1440 - and if they only win one that day? That's fine, it can roll onto the next day, or they can play another match, and another...think how the Klingon 'Ship hunter' wrappers work I guess.

Cooperative PVE
This I find a bit harder, the optional objective is clearly designed to encourage players to take part - but as we've discovered in our fleet? The optional loot is generally pretty poor, to the stage where we all shrug if we don't get it and move on with no qualms.

I've got a few thoughts here - first of all introduce a small dilithium reward on the optional that ALL players get, 440 or whatever the 'small' dilithium containers contain. That said, I don't like this - it feels wrong. I think there needs to be some sort of scoring in STFs, perhaps invisible, but enough as to split the missions into 'parts' such as they already are, each player must 'score' a certain number of points in each part - nothing major, take down a couple of drones, resurrect a single player, heal X health points, don't take part in all parts? Don't earn at the end. Again messy - but an idea.


So STO community, let's see what you think - how do we deal with these guys without just hiding in private queues?
That's easy.

For Competitive PvP: Get rid of it.

For Coop PvE (STFs): Make them solo-able.
This all happened... more, or less.
Captain
Join Date: Aug 2013
Posts: 4,531
# 1995
12-27-2013, 05:29 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by abystander0 View Post
I keep seeing people bring up the afk issue over and over, but have not seen it myself recently (last 3 months). I queue up for ISE, KSE, Colony Invasion, Fleet Starbase Defense (5 man), and occasionally Storming the spire. I haven't seen anyone afk, but have seen some subpar players. Occasionally the game likes to rearrange hotbars, or send your bridge officers out for drinks when you enter a queued event, and it can take a minute or two to get yourself straightened out, so seeing someone parked at the spawn for a few minutes at the start isn't an issue for me (it is nice when people let others know they are having an issue from the outset so it can be compensated for).
This x 100%. If you're having a tech problem, TELL THE REST OF YOUR TEAM so they don't accuse you of AFKing. I once had the batteries in my mouse die, and I've been known to hit really nasty lag spikes.
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Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,220
# 1996
12-27-2013, 06:19 PM
Holy mother of giant threads, Batman! I'm not reading that!

While AFKers suck, I'd rather somebody AFK then charge into an elite not knowing what the hell they are doing, blowing up the wrong things and totally hosing things.

2 Things. 1. If you do not know the map, run it on normal once or twice. That way you can get a feel for the way the map handles. 2. If you don't know what you are doing still, follow the people who appear to have even a vague idea. Everybody goes left in ISE? Bloody well go left.

Edit: In general, it's slightly better to fail because you didn't do something you should have, than to fail because you did something you shouldn't have.
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Lieutenant
Join Date: Apr 2013
Posts: 87
# 1997
12-28-2013, 01:29 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by arnthebard View Post
So it is within the realm of possibility to do what I orginally posted some 192 pages ago... If someone knows a Dev ask them if the algorithm exsists and how plausible would it be to implement this into our ignore system?

[For those wondering a algorithm is not where Al Gore claims to have invented the Internet.]
One of the biggest MMO's out there does use that algorithm - It's pretty much 2 lines of code.

Someone posted that all PWE games share the same Friend / Block list for the registered user so if that's the case, it may not be down to Cryptic to whether they can actually use that bit of code.

Again, only a Dev can answer that.
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Career Officer
Join Date: Oct 2012
Posts: 279
# 1998
03-27-2014, 04:48 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by des101 View Post
One of the biggest MMO's out there does use that algorithm - It's pretty much 2 lines of code.

Someone posted that all PWE games share the same Friend / Block list for the registered user so if that's the case, it may not be down to Cryptic to whether they can actually use that bit of code.

Again, only a Dev can answer that.
Could we get a Dev to answer that question?
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# 1999 Closing Necro Thread
03-27-2014, 06:41 AM
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