Lt. Commander
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 132
# 91
08-23-2012, 11:34 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by syberghost View Post
Petition threads are against the rules, but you're welcome to have a discussion about the issue.

Thanks

syberghost
Community Moderator for the STO Forums
Understood and I apologise. The problem is those discussions get heated and messages get lost, while those with the power and/or authority to address our concerns get tired of reading thru the rhetoric and just move on.

The community is starting to very much feel like PWE does not care about it's player base. There are only a few ways we can voice our concerns, here in these forums, or by simply not spending anymore money or time.

Guess which way I'll be voicing mine going forward?
Starfleet Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 891
# 92
08-23-2012, 11:37 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by wilsoncutter001 View Post
The community is starting to very much feel like PWE does not care about it's player base. There are only a few ways we can voice our concerns, here in these forums, or by simply not spending anymore money or time.
Working as intended :-)
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 128
# 93
08-23-2012, 11:37 AM
If they did this on purpose, theyre just bad at this and i need to find something else to play.
Lieutenant
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 75
# 94
08-23-2012, 11:46 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by syberghost View Post
Petition threads are against the rules, but you're welcome to have a discussion about the issue.

Thanks

syberghost
Community Moderator for the STO Forums
I don't have a problem with the rules, I do have a problem with them being vague. If a man starts a thread and he has a bunch of people posting in agreement, then eventually the thread could be considered a petition. Besides any of that, there doesn't seem to be enough forum users to generate more than 100 or so signatures.

Back on topic though, I asked Branflakes and Borticus on twitter yesterday to at the very least explain the intent behind the changes. I asked on the tribble release notes forum. Now I am asking here.

The reason I ask about the intent is that the way this change was structured there is going to be a huge side effect of confusing and frustrating players. Unless the intent was to confuse and frustrate your userbase, I think this was a bad change to make.

How is it going to confuse and frustrate people? Simply put, there are no adequate filters on the exchange to filter out these new duty officers that can't be donated to fleet projects. So if even 10% of the people that were purchasing enough of them to warrant changing them continue to do so in a batch of 20, 30, 80, 100 or however many they were buying, well... then they're just going to be sitting in their roster getting state. Some percentage of them are then going to post them on the exchange.

That, that is when it is going to start making people angry. There is no way to differentiate between the fleet doffs and non-fleet doffs. They don't bind like ferra's do, they don't have any special attributes, nothing. So people are going to buy them, and then they won't be able to use them for... well, unless they were buying them for the effect but that so rarely happens.

BUT, since I have to guess what the intent was... and I hate guessing, I'd wager that the point of the change was to prevent the larger fleets from being able to go purchase doffs and donate them at a rate that made their fleet projects fill up quickly.

The problem there is that the solution they went with was... probably the worst one of the bunch.

They could have removed the common boxes all together and gated them by offering 5 of them as a reward from the officer of the watch quest that nobody does because it only rewards 5 fleet marks.

They could have added in an additional fleet mark cost when purchasing them (5/10/25/75) and that would have slowed down.

There were a ton of options for gating those with either resources or content. Instead Cryptic spent extra man hours making them worthless on the exchange and potentially destabilized ever non-civilian duty officer category on the exchange. I would still really like to know just what the intent was here.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 132
# 95
08-23-2012, 11:47 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by boglejam73 View Post
Working as intended :-)
I saw that coming .

I dare say that with the advent of season 6 and Fleet Money Pits, PWE saw us coming too.
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,173
# 96
08-23-2012, 11:48 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by abcde123123 View Post
I could be wrong here, but basic fed doff pack cost 300 zen (let's say 3 buks) and gives 5 doffs of random quality/specialty. Having opened 10 such packs the other day I got 50 doffs: say 3 blues, 5 greens, the rest is white. Now here's the kicker:

ONLY ONE SECURITY SPECIALTY DOFF out of 50 doffs/10 packs.

That's one security doff for 30 buks. I got 2 sensor doffs too but that's beside the point.

I assume we will never see the stats on how good the doff packs are selling, but you tell me, given the experience outlined above if you need 30 security doffs are you going to spend real money on doff packs?

Seriously?
Hmmmm...I would say that is working as intended!
Lieutenant
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 34
# 97
08-23-2012, 11:50 AM
Ive just gone and tested the Boil and Break using 5 common Fleet DOffs.

This DOES still work, have just done it. Boil up 5 Fleet Commons into 1 Green, and break that green into 3 Whites (which are unbound and "normal").

Still, this means that you're spending 2500 Fleet Credits on 3 White DOffs, and the time/effort spent in having to do it on a large scale for big projects too...
http://sto-forum.perfectworld.com/image.php?type=sigpic&userid=91869635000&dateline=  1343363475
Ninth Fleet - 13 years and still going strong...
Starfleet Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 371
# 98
08-23-2012, 11:51 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by boglejam73 View Post
Man, why don't you just type "moved out of general discussion so it will hopefully quietly die unnoticed by the vast majority of the community this effects...."?

We all are going to assume thats why its moved. The devs are just as capable of clicking on "todays posts" as the rest of us are.
By that logic, we'd just have one massive categroy for the entire forums. Why bother organizing anything at all?

Quote:
Originally Posted by wilsoncutter001 View Post
Understood and I apologise. The problem is those discussions get heated and messages get lost, while those with the power and/or authority to address our concerns get tired of reading thru the rhetoric and just move on.

The community is starting to very much feel like PWE does not care about it's player base. There are only a few ways we can voice our concerns, here in these forums, or by simply not spending anymore money or time.

Guess which way I'll be voicing mine going forward?
Fair enough, but before you jump ship, let's wait to see what the explanation is. I'd like to see what their reasoning is too. Is it to prevent some sort of exploit? To me, just as most people in this thread, it seems counter-intuitive to the system. If one wants to submit SB Doffs into SB projects, it seems like it would just be paying for SB projects with...

Oh, I see...

I wonder if the profit in Fleet Marks for submitting an SB Doff > The cost in Fleet Marks for buying the SB Doff in the first place. Yes, if so, that would be a major exploit. Any other work-arounds besides disallowing them from use in SB projects? I'd have to think about that...

I don't care how long you've been playing. I only care about how you play.
And remember to follow the rules.
Lieutenant
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 34
# 99
08-23-2012, 11:54 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by obsidiusrex View Post
I wonder if the profit in Fleet Marks for submitting an SB Doff > The cost in Fleet Marks for buying the SB Doff in the first place. Yes, if so, that would be a major exploit. Any other work-arounds besides disallowing them from use in SB projects? I'd have to think about that...


Cost of a Common Fleet DOff (random) - 500 Fleet Credit
Cost of a Common Fleet DOff (Eng, Sci or Tac) - 750 Fleet Credits

Reward for donating a Common DOff - 150 Fleet Credits.


I fail to see how that is an exploit, if Im losing 350-600 Fleet Credits per DOff just to help level my own starbase...
http://sto-forum.perfectworld.com/image.php?type=sigpic&userid=91869635000&dateline=  1343363475
Ninth Fleet - 13 years and still going strong...
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 128
# 100
08-23-2012, 11:55 AM
They might as well remove the options to buy tac/sci/eng related doffs for 750 since the ones for 500 are exactly as useful in the grinder.
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