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Career Officer
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 14
The title says it all. Below is a suggestion and rant on how a limit or boundary should be place in order for newbies to attempt normal STFs and not Elite STFs as their first STF experience.

In order to better the quality of Elite STFs instead of wasting 1 hr on something that can be done in 5 minutes in STFs why not introduce a system (perhaps later on when the game engine can support this) that REQUIRES OR REQUESTS THE PLAYER RUN THROUGH at least 3 runs (or some other arbitrary number) on the normal version of the STF. The game would strongly recommend that the player run through the normal version in order for the player to learn how each STF operates.

For me almost every run includes a player that is new to STFs or just don't know how to play the game/STF. You can see this when you see a player run around with 10 critical injuries and a bunch more major injuries, others who run around firing a minigun or pistols, or some who just don't know how ground combat works (flanking, fall off damage of pulsewave guns, which kits to use, etc.)

I've seen so many players just jump into an elite STF at level 50 with no idea what they are doing, and not even playing 1 normal STF. If you force them or oblige them into normals at least they won't clog up as a complete newbie and force players who know what they are doing into a 1 hour STF leaver penalty or a 1+ hour STF for something that should take 20-30 minutes.

Some players can communicate and respond but from what I observe, a lot more players cannot understand you or know that you are communicating to them. Some don't speak english and speak german but even more don't even communicate/listen at all. If more players would communicate I wouldn't feel so inclined to suggest an idea for the recommendation to try normal before elite STFs.

I was also a noob once. And I had no idea what I was doing back then, but those were the days of 100 guys in Gamma Orionis yelling "LFG FED TACT FACT OR FICTION" etc. across a few instances. Those were also the days people took the time to read guides on STFs or where people forced team mates to skim them. Although STFs now are much easier/simplier, people don't read much of guides anymore and thus you see people running around with many crippling injuries holding a minigun and using the support technician kit...

/2cents
/endsuggestion/rant
--Q, Horatio Nelson, Francis Drake Nine of Seventeen--
Crypitic Handle: @Admiral_Drake - PWE:admiralkevin
REAL 1000 day LTS vet since OB.
Commander
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 321
# 2
09-08-2012, 04:26 PM
It's been suggested many times before.

Simple reality is that asking people to do any number of Normals before they do an Elite will not keep n00bs out. They'll just stagger through the Normals for a bit and then join up for Elite when they have 3 or 5 or 20 successes in Normal.

At best, they'll know what the map looks like. They won't know the tactics needed for Elite because Normal PuGs don't bother with them, they won't know about injuries because they're not in Normal and they'll die a lot because of the tougher enemies.
Captain
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 1,738
# 3
09-08-2012, 04:36 PM
I would say that a person must have
A complete set of level 10 or 11 STF gear
Before they have access to elite.

Seems fair to me
Jellico....Engineer.....Stargazer KDF Tac
Saphire.. Science.....Ko'el Rom Kdf Tac
Leva........Tactical.....Mailu KDF Sci

JJ-Verse will never be Canon or considered Lore...It will always be JJ-Verse
Captain
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 2,984
# 4
09-08-2012, 04:40 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by admiralkevin View Post
For me almost every run includes a player that is new to STFs or just don't know how to play the game/STF. You can see this when you see a player run around with 10 critical injuries and a bunch more major injuries, others who run around firing a minigun or pistols, or some who just don't know how ground combat works (flanking, fall off damage of pulsewave guns, which kits to use, etc.)
I will point out that all my characters are fairly decent in elite STFs, 2 have full ground sets and 1 is just starting out in normals, all use dual pistols, and are all quite good at killing borg drones so think about that before you say that dual pistols are rubbish weapons, if the player keeps ontop of their remod requirements dual pistols can shred borg drones with ease

just my experience (one which will likely be ignored/compared to BS)
Commander
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 321
# 5
09-08-2012, 05:05 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by jellico1 View Post
I would say that a person must have
A complete set of level 10 or 11 STF gear
Before they have access to elite.

Seems fair to me
It doesn't seem fair to me.

Sets =/= good players. Someone could grind out the potentially 60 Normal STFs required for their Mk X set and still be garbage. A bad player can be carried on a Normal STF easily. Equally, another person could have the tactics down (especially if they're playing in organised groups) inside 15 Normals. The requirement to keep at them until they get a complete set before being able to do Elites is beyond obnoxious, imo. Why should some players have to put up with that because other players want an ineffective solution to a problem they could avoid by not PuGing?

There's also the fact that the length of time taken to complete varies considerably according to tech drops. So you're not even making people jump through the same hoops. A Normal set is 3-60 STFs. Okay, doing it in less than 20 isn't going to happen that often, but it's still a big luck based variance in the amount of Normal STFs someone actually has to do before getting at Elites. The game's grindy enough as it is, without throwing this **** in.

Quote:
I will point out that all my characters are fairly decent in elite STFs, 2 have full ground sets and 1 is just starting out in normals, all use dual pistols, and are all quite good at killing borg drones so think about that before you say that dual pistols are rubbish weapons, if the player keeps ontop of their remod requirements dual pistols can shred borg drones with ease
You're probably shredding Borg drones because you're good at the game, not because you have Dual Pistols. And I'd bet you'd shred more with a non-burst weapon. The per-hit remod calculation means that the Borg adapt to burst and automatic weapons more quickly, even with the cooldown on the Borg recieving adaption 'counters' that was put in a few months back. I used the Jemmy set for a while and got one secondary fire activation from the rifle before having to remod. Yeah, I could keep on top of it, but it's ineffecient and annoying vs. a pulsewave or a split-beam. And it would've still been inefficient and annoying if I'd had an integral remod. The only plus point I can think of is that you can potentially get multiple exposes from some automatic weapons.

Last edited by skhc; 09-08-2012 at 05:46 PM.
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 779
# 6
09-08-2012, 07:37 PM
they need to start stf's at 40 and elite unlocks at 25 missions
I think this maybe coming in 7 wait in see

I am so tiered of newbs in elite it is getting old
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 514
# 7
09-08-2012, 08:06 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by admiralkevin View Post
The title says it all. Below is a suggestion and rant on how a limit or boundary should be place in order for newbies to attempt normal STFs and not Elite STFs as their first STF experience.

In order to better the quality of Elite STFs instead of wasting 1 hr on something that can be done in 5 minutes in STFs why not introduce a system (perhaps later on when the game engine can support this) that REQUIRES OR REQUESTS THE PLAYER RUN THROUGH at least 3 runs (or some other arbitrary number) on the normal version of the STF. The game would strongly recommend that the player run through the normal version in order for the player to learn how each STF operates.

For me almost every run includes a player that is new to STFs or just don't know how to play the game/STF. You can see this when you see a player run around with 10 critical injuries and a bunch more major injuries, others who run around firing a minigun or pistols, or some who just don't know how ground combat works (flanking, fall off damage of pulsewave guns, which kits to use, etc.)

I've seen so many players just jump into an elite STF at level 50 with no idea what they are doing, and not even playing 1 normal STF. If you force them or oblige them into normals at least they won't clog up as a complete newbie and force players who know what they are doing into a 1 hour STF leaver penalty or a 1+ hour STF for something that should take 20-30 minutes.

Some players can communicate and respond but from what I observe, a lot more players cannot understand you or know that you are communicating to them. Some don't speak english and speak german but even more don't even communicate/listen at all. If more players would communicate I wouldn't feel so inclined to suggest an idea for the recommendation to try normal before elite STFs.

I was also a noob once. And I had no idea what I was doing back then, but those were the days of 100 guys in Gamma Orionis yelling "LFG FED TACT FACT OR FICTION" etc. across a few instances. Those were also the days people took the time to read guides on STFs or where people forced team mates to skim them. Although STFs now are much easier/simplier, people don't read much of guides anymore and thus you see people running around with many crippling injuries holding a minigun and using the support technician kit...

/2cents
/endsuggestion/rant
Simply disallow noobs that run:

- a rainbow build
- dont even fire a single weapon, or 1 every minute
- afk
- dont heal at all
- and dont let them queue up until they did a certain amount of normals, like 10 or 20.
Commander
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 336
# 8
09-08-2012, 09:02 PM
there can be no test.
accolades points? useless
# of normal runs? as someone else stated, useless also annoying if you're running an alt.
mkx or xi gear? also useless

@marctraiderz
seriously you want the server to run through and enumerate, validate every piece of gear on a player ship for every player that queues for an elite stf? seriously? STO's servers? that have issues already just running the game as it is? reality ever sneak up on you much? already covered the whole # of normal runs, stupid, useless, annoying.

simplest solution, solves every problem

don't pug
wow...complicated ain't it...
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 779
# 9
09-08-2012, 09:10 PM
what is with all the mele now it is a wasye of time and best way to run up timer
Commander
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 357
# 10
09-09-2012, 03:57 AM
every day the same flaming and every day it ends in nothing.

if you will have full success runs always do it with your fleet or friends in the private option.

a player who have done 10 or 100 normal stfs is still no grant on a fair run i see every stf players what are over 1 year in the game and they playing like a neewbies what start 1 week ago this game.
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