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Lt. Commander
Join Date: Sep 2012
Posts: 118
# 41
09-08-2012, 07:19 PM
a bridge officer telling me something should not decloak my ship its not only wrong but stupid how many times in star trek did a bridge officer speaking decloak the ship. just picture it a Klingon officer says something to the captain and the bop's cloak goes down so do cloaks sense your voice now? the fact that they have asked us to compile a list of missions where contacts should not decloak your ship shows us its not right.

Last edited by dylantrinidy; 09-08-2012 at 07:27 PM.
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,621
# 42
09-08-2012, 07:25 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by dylantrinidy View Post
just picture it a Klingon officer says something to the captain and the bop's cloak goes down so do cloaks scene your voice now?
LOL. That officer would go out the nearest airlock, like someone else suggested.


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Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 189
# 43
09-08-2012, 08:03 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by stoleviathan99 View Post
I think the thing is, PvE is NOT designed around the idea of cloak providing an alpha strike. It would potentially break "Blood of The Empire" if you got one.

Alpha strike via cloak can cause missions to be incompletable.
I'm not sure how an alpha strike via cloak would cause a mission to be incompleteable but I'll take you at your word. Regardless, the way cloaking works in STO is counter intuitive to what people expect, which is why multiple posts on this topic are popping up on the forums.

I would like to see an in game tutorial on how cloaking is supposed to work, as this would at least give us a guideline on how to bug report the missions that are adversely affected by the poor way cloaking was implemented in the game.
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,621
# 44
09-08-2012, 08:20 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by claransa View Post
I'm not sure how an alpha strike via cloak would cause a mission to be incompleteable ...
It shouldn't. I've noticed that some NPCs have health protection. Meaning, that I'll alpha them and get them to 0 health, but they still won't die and the mission will continue on as normal.

If they can do that for some NPCs, then there's no reason they can't apply that to other NPCs.

The alpha strike excuse is bull.


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Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 298
# 45
09-08-2012, 08:47 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by snoge00f View Post
It shouldn't. I've noticed that some NPCs have health protection. Meaning, that I'll alpha them and get them to 0 health, but they still won't die and the mission will continue on as normal.

If they can do that for some NPCs, then there's no reason they can't apply that to other NPCs.

The alpha strike excuse is bull.
/Amen... lol



Yeah, that's right.
Rihannsu
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 222
# 46
09-08-2012, 08:59 PM
If the cloak is soooo hard to fix that they actually have to lie and say its not a bug why not i donno write new code and make a new cloak?!

It would be easier to write a new code similar to the current cloak that provides the same function, uses same stat modifiers but works on its own set of code not linked to maps. Then simply change all the exsisting ships and npcs to use that new code by using a redirect.

There is no reason that the cloak should have ANYTHING to do with the map or npc dialog. As it is its worthless. In pvp/pve the cloak bugs and doesnt uncloak when told to sometimes but you are visable with no shields and weapons offline. Then it opts to disengage randomly almost depending on maps when one of our crew says something. We arent in subs here doing a silent running! There isnt air or water in vaccum of space to transfer sound vibrations any how!
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 203
# 47
09-08-2012, 09:20 PM
Maybe nobody "owns" the cloak anymore, they may have all resigned. That's why he needs a list from us cause they really don't know!

Anybody that has ever flown a bop, and is a dev, should be all over this. The word that came to mind while reading his response was "disingenuous". I got a chuckle though, so thanks for that!
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 20
# 48
09-09-2012, 12:02 AM
Just more shallowness from cryptic. They'll fix it when they know how to get you to open your wallet for it.
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 330
# 49
09-09-2012, 12:06 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by syberghost View Post
No, I'm telling you that when they introduced minicoms, and shortly after that Dan said they had to make per-map fixes for this, and then he comes back and says evidently some people misunderstood him because he wasn't very clear, and here's what he meant, you can put two and two together or you can assume that it was a complete coincidence that mincoms happened right before he said there was a fix that had to be implemented per map, and minicom are a fix that has to be implemented per map.

I'm sure you're right; it's a complete coincidence, there never was a fix, it's just a happy accident that minicoms don't break cloak.

This is why Dan doesn't talk on the forums anymore.
Um, this is all wrong.

It was Salami Inferno who said that they had to go map by map to correct the issue. It was also Salami who said they did that, then later had to recant and say that in fact it was done via a script.

Exact quote on the fix:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Salami_Inferno
The fix for this issue is not as simple as it sounds. It involves touching every single map in the game, which is a ridiculously high number.

That being said, we did it and the fix will be in the next tribble push.
Beyond that, this was never the intention. We learned from Gozer that the intention was to have people decloaked by objective inter-actables.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cryptic_Gozer
When the game was shipped, pop-up dialogs and informational inter-actables did not force ships that were cloaked to decloak. The only thing that would force you out of cloak were mission objective inter-actables.

This was by design. If you could just stay cloaked you could basically just fly to a mission objective, use it, and leave without ever having to fight anything that might be there to protect it.
All of this stemmed from streamlining how things work within the engine, combining all of the ineractable types under one umbrella:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cryptic_Gozer
Somewhere between Season 2 and Season 3 all pop-ups and informational inter-actables were reclassified in the Engine to all work off the same internal engine feature, prior to this change there were separate systems for each . This change was a good thing for those of us that use the tools daily because it simplified our work flow. However, it had the side effect of breaking people out of cloak whenever you use any inter-actable or get any pop-up etc...etc..
When the bug was "fixed" supposedly they added a way to flag interactions so only the APPROPRIATE ONES (read: the ones that did so at launch) decloaked us. They didn't bother flagging anything by hand though (though Salami initially suggested they did), but instead ran a script that should have caught most of the issues... but didn't

According to Gozer they should have been fixing any problems where it wasn't caught, which, you know, was ALL OF THEM, which is what everyone reported.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cryptic_Gozer
There has been new tech added to this system as with the latest build that allows us to flag this stuff now on a case by case basis. We also ran a game wide "fix" script that should have caught most of these with Season 4.

I'm sure that the script probably missed a bunch of edge cases as well, so just report them when you see them and we will crush them as we get the reports.
Of course, nothing was ever done about any of the issues afterwards, and apparently they've now decided that nothing ever will be done.

You can find the Gozer and Salami quotes in this thread in quote format (otherwise attributed to Archived Post).
________________
You'll have to forgive the Zeroes and Lowercase... Perfect World stole my Oh's and Capitals.
Commander
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 273
-Gone Hunting-

Captain: Alight crew, our Bird of Prey has been assigned to the Ker'rat system to salvage borg technology and blow up any Federation petaQs that happen to be in the area.

Crew: [The crew cheers, throws beers, and fires at Will]

Captain: Damnit that was my first officer... anyway. Upon arrival, we'll raise the cloak and go high above the solar plane, then plan our next moves from there.

Conn: We're dropping out warp-Sir! We're surround by Federation ships!

Captain: Engineering, all power to engines. Helm, evasive maneuvers! Get us out of here!

Chief Engineer and Helm: Aye Captain!

Captain: As soon as we clear tractor range... now! Raise cloak, all hands brace for impact!

[Ship escapes, much sighing and counting of stars (lucky or otherwise) ensues]

Captain: Helm, good piloting, take us up and let's see about finding us some prey. Sensors... anything?

Sensor Officer: No sir... wait. Yes, one of the Federation ships has broken off from the group. Trident-class, seems to be making best speed for one of the large Borg nodes. Oh, it's engaged with a Sphere and appears to be struggling a bit.

Captain: Excellent, that shall be our first kill of the day. Helm, vector us to intercept, inform me when we reach optimum weapons range.

Conn Officer: Aye Captain.

[VFx shot, outline of the invisible Bird of Prey lines up on the unsuspecting Trident-class Science Ship as a pair of Defiants decloak and destroy the Sphere that it had been struggling to kill]

Captain: Blast, no honor in committing suicide against such a force. Another opportunity will arise, and now we know there are Defiants about with cloaking devices. We can use this to our advantage. Probably.

Comms: Captain! Our Tactical officer has something he needs to tell you right away! I'm lowering our cloak!

Captain: What the FU-

[VFx shot: The Bird of Prey decloaks and is quickly disabled by the Trident before being vaporized by the Defiants.]

---------------------------------------------

Now. If you had watched an episode of Star Trek that played out like that, would *you* have thought it sensible?
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