Empire Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 2,202
# 1 A dev ion twitter
10-21-2012, 03:47 AM
https://twitter.com/CaptainGeko/stat...41429137469440

Most interesting excerpts:

As a forum user, "you look petulant", and you're "looking like a poo-flinging monkey".

When you ask for features, " I want to know what you're smoking, and where I can get some".

And remember: "(Almost) no one cares about the forums". So, if you don't like something and would like customer service to know it, "Frankly, the forums and the game would probably be better without you [...] Really, the door's over there; don't let it hit your posterior on the way out."

Why? Because "Game forums in general are known to be stereotyped as the place where petulant man-children rant and rave about everything that's "wrong" with the game".



Now I'm wondering who looks "petulant" and immature: someone who can't stand people not praising what he does at work or people saying what they want politely. Sure, some posts aren't that smart and some can be ludicrous, but most of the times, people will say it politely.

Now if you don't like what you're doing or the people you're supposed to entertain, a frendly advice would be to move on and find a place where everyone would be happy when you come from the clouds to reveal the Truth. For sure it's "just a video game", and it's also "just your job".

Also, not blaming your management for what YOU do (no, PWE's boss will not write any line of code) would be the first step toward maturity.
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 901
# 2
10-21-2012, 03:54 AM
Diogene: YOU and people like you are why we developers in big corporations rarely engage with users. I hope you're ashamed.
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 901
# 3
10-21-2012, 03:59 AM
And to provide some much needed context, Al Rivera basically just linked to the following contributor's page on STOWiki: http://www.stowiki.org/User:Archabaddon

Quote:
Obsidius' Rules of the STO Forums

As a guy who's lurked and participated on various online forums, I've come up with rules that will help in partipating in the STO forums, or any MMO forum in general. I'll add more when they come to mind or as I come across them. Enjoy.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Forum posts are not legally binding contracts.

You wonder why devs don't talk about a lot of stuff on the forums? Because every time they talk about something in development that doesn't actually make it into they game, it bites them in the ass. But when they do, don't hoist it on your shoulders like the Ten Commandments, Moses. Sometimes stuff just doesn't pan out in the long run. Anything a dev "promise" on the forums isn't actually a promise (unless they actually use the word "promise" in their posts, which is pretty farking unlikely). But seriously, Cryptic and PWE don't guaranty the legality of anything said on the forums, so deal.

Why haven't the devs put in <insert feature here> yet?

Priorities. In Dev Land, you have to get the most bang for your buck with the resources at hand, and there's usually not enough resources to do everything at the same time. It gets frustrating when the feature you want keeps getting pushed back, but it's probably because the devs have to concentrate on different priorities set upon them by higher-ups (see Calling the devs lazy is lazy, below). Sometimes devs will work on personal projects outside of the normal scope of their work, but usually it means that particular items will take longer to see the light of day, if it ever does. Remember, forum posts are not legally binding contracts (see above), and that the schedule constantly changes. Just deal with it.

Demanding a Cryptic or Dev response in your thread is a good way not to get one.

The community forums are for the community. Sometimes, you'll get a dev to chime up about something. They do this during their free time, out of "the kindness of their hearts". They get paid to develop MMOs, not sit around on the forums all day (aren't you supposed to be working, buddy?). So demanding a dev response from anyone but the community representative just makes you look petulant. Your supper-important issue will be addressed when it's prudent to do so, and when there aren't a lot of more important things ahead of it on the schedule.

Why don't the developers post more?

See the above rules. They're probably busy - you know - developing things. Or making sure they don't post any "promises" or anything else that can be taken completely out of context by players.

Calling developers lazy is lazy.

If you think developers are "lazy" just because they haven't inserted whatever feature or function you've been holding your breath for, there's probably a better reason than lethargy. Unfortunately, you're probably too lazy yourself to consider things like demand of the player majority, budgets, timeframes, other things in the developers' schedule, adding things that benefit the greatest amount of the playerbase, etc. Congratulations, lazy thinker. You win teh interwebz.

The truth is: you are probably placing the blame on the people who have the least amount of control over the schedule. Developers tackle the schedule delivered to them by the lead developers; who in turn answer to the studio managers, publisher, investors, etc. If anything, any blame should be with their higher-ups. And it's honestly not a question of laziness, rather than player demand and priority. However, if you can convince them, in a civil fashion, that something is in demand, it might help to increase the priority. But slinging insults (ie: calling people lazy) at the people you're trying to sway to your point of view is probably the worst way in which to accomplish this.

Don't Nitpick.

If you seriously believe that fixing every last window on a Galaxy class star cruiser or fixing some deflector art on a drop-box unlocked ship is the top priority of the art team, I want to know what you're smoking, and where I can get some. Well, I guess you can nitpick, but it won't get you very far and will probably just chafe the people that can actually "fix" your "problem". Just ask CapnLogan. Go ahead, send him a PM about a weapons hardpoint. Oh wait, you can't, because he got tired of all the nitpicking and left STO (damned if you do, damned if you don't I guess).

Do you ask loaded questions because you eat babies?

See what I did there? I hope so. The devs sure love to respond to threads entitled "Devs: why do you hate <insert faction or gameplay here>?" OK, not really. If you want to get a serious response to your thread, maybe even by an actual developer, instead of just looking like a troll, leave your questions unloaded. Don't be "that person".

Calling someone a fanboy is usually the last sad desperate act of a losing argument.

You've just used the word "fanboy" to describe a fellow poster. My compliments on using the most clich?d insult in the history of Internet fights. You've gone with the lowest-hanging fruit on the debate tree, and made yourself look like someone who can't win an argument without going for the ad hominem. Perhaps you should look towards actually debating facts with facts, instead of looking like a poo-flinging monkey. It will probably go a long way towards making yourself looking cogent and knowledgeable instead. Even if the person is an actual sycophantic lapdog to whom the development team or publisher could do no wrong, there are a million other ways to point it out, instead of using the same tired insult that's been tossed around so much that it's become a joke.

Asking for compensation is overt entitlement.

So the servers were down for a few hours, or someone hacked into your account. Besides restoring your account to a previous state, you're not entitled to anything. Look it up on the End User License Agreement and the Terms of Service. You know, those things you agree to whenever you log into the game. Don't ask for something not owed to you.

Threatening to leave for <insert game here> really shows your lack of maturity.

You're mad and upset about something the developers have (or haven't) done in the game. You start dropping names of a studio or a game in context such as "<Insert game here> is coming out next month, hope you like loosing customers" or "I guess not everyone can be like <insert studio or developer here>".

Congratulations. Perhaps the grass will actually be greener on the other side. But what you're actually saying isn't very constructive; it's just trolling, plain and simple. Frankly, the forums and the game would probably be better without you, so please go over to your new-found love, and try not to let the novelty wear off too fast, lest you simply repeat this same process on that title's forums. After all, if that other title is so perfect and incomparable, why bother even posting here, unless your only point is to call the devs lazy or just troll for the sake of trolling? Really, the door's over there; don't let it hit your posterior on the way out. Just remember that the only thing worse than insulting a game as you leave for a "better" one is the shame of crawling back when all your dreams and novelty are tarnished and shattered.

(Almost) no one cares about the forums.

Game forums in general are known to be stereotyped as the place where petulant man-children rant and rave about everything that's "wrong" with the game. Therefore, there's no such thing as "bad press" on the forums, because by association, forums are known to be nothing but the home of ranting tirades. Rarely, someone in the game press will refer to a game's forums, but only to reinforce something already in a story. Press or breaking info rarely starts wholly from the forums (usually Marketing posts something elsewhere first or in conjunction with a thread), because, by their reputation, no one but die-hard fans and community reps read them.

Get some perspective - it's a video game.

People will complain incessantly on the forums about even the most trivial things. Look, I understand that you're upset about your ship's turn rate or the latest "nerf" for whatever. It doesn't main you have to go on a tirade every chance you get. You're in your 30s for crying out loud, be mature and realize that it's just a video game. Otherwise you just end up getting wrapped around the axle and looking like this guy, getting kicked off the forums and keeping track of every little developer-induced injustice from your secret underground lair (read: mother's basement). Is this how you want to live your life? Or would you rather enjoy a warm summer day with friends and/or loved ones and blow up some Borg when you want to relax and put your feet up? That's what I thought.
And not a single word of a lie was said.
Empire Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 2,202
# 4
10-21-2012, 04:00 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by walshicus View Post
Diogene: YOU and people like you are why we developers in big corporations rarely engage with users. I hope you're ashamed.
And if I was trolling the people I am working with like Gecko did I'd be fired faster than light. He's lucky to be able to do so without any kind of consequence, that's just a friendly reminder. I see no reason being insulted and when people say they don't like something it's rarely because they like to troll.

Being able to understand that YOUR concerns aren't more critical than anyone else's ones is also a step toward maturity. If players should understand that the devs should too.
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 901
# 5
10-21-2012, 04:05 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by diogene0 View Post
And if I was trolling the people I am working with like Gecko did I'd be fired faster than light. He's lucky to be able to do so without any kind of consequence, that's just a friendly reminder. I see no reason being insulted and when people say they don't like something it's rarely because they like to troll.

Being able to understand that YOUR concerns aren't more critical than anyone else's ones is also a step toward maturity. If players should understand that the devs should too.
Bloody hell. He DIDN'T troll his bosses. He "approved" of a STOWiki user's assessment that 99% of the time development priorities are approved at a level above the developer's paygrade.

And I don't know what arse-backward company you work for. Sounds like you need a better job.

People like you - *excrement stirers* - just really hack me off. Grow up.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 176
# 6
10-21-2012, 04:06 AM
Gecko has done nothing wrong and I don't understand what the problem is. The dev's get insulted more everyday on these forums than I've ever seen them be even a tiny bit mean to any forum user.
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# 7
10-21-2012, 04:07 AM
And I'm just going to put the little lock icon on this now before this goes beyond out of hand..


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