Empire Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 2,202
# 11
09-16-2012, 04:43 AM
Well sometimes we can get the feeling that the reviewer should know more about the Foundry but it also gives us clues about what we should do with this tool too.

"Data doesn't look familiar, it's a saurian" in one of my missions. I had to do this to respect the EULA, but taking the player to the bridge of the USS Enterprise D was a mistake. I won't do it anymore. A good story never requires that. If the story is good enough, the player will think it's a good Star Trek story; characters from the series are pure fluff.

At first glance it looks like an unfair review because one could think this player is telling me to break the EULA but it's not. I should have build my story differently (and at some point I will but I have too many current projects to do it now).

"Too many typos". This is often the first review I get. I'm stupid. I always build mission in my native language and then I translate them because I think english-speaking players can enjoy it. Half of them don't because I can't catch all my mistakes. I could put a disclamer saying "f**k off if you don't like typos" but I don't because I know how important this issue can be. If I don't want bad reviews I just have to stop translating my missions, and that's something I consider from time to time anyway. Again I'm responsible of my bad reviews here.

It can be unpleasant but it's also important to know what the players expect in our missions.
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 2,228
# 12
09-16-2012, 12:17 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by slickrick1707e View Post
Yea same here, thanks for this post. Here is what I find, most of the positive reviews I get are from actual Star Trek fans that know what I am trying to do. The trolls and D!cks are not. It is a good thing that we do not know who these people actually are. Reason being is not only am I a damn good foundry author I also slaughter in PVP. If I ever knew who these trolls were I would hunt them down and repeatedly emasculate them in PVP.
Me too bud. I think half the trolls were names I recognized from PvP
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 2,228
# 13
09-16-2012, 12:20 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by drazursouthclaw View Post
I couldn't agree more with the OP!

Now, here's my tuppence worth (probably an accurate appraisal!)

Here are some examples for us to examine, if we wish:

1: "There are way too many Romulans."

Long story short: I recently published a set of 3 (one ground map each) dailies to go alongside the ingame KDF Empire Defense missions.

Kahless/Federations: 6 groups.
Azure/Romulan: 6 groups.
Chos/TrueWay: 7 groups.

Kahless gets 5 stars.
Azure gets 1.
Chos gets 5.

Okay, says I. Azure must be broken.

Check out the review. Nope: "Way too many Romulans."

My first response is "NO. There are not. See for yourself. There are 6 groups, just like on the Federation mission that you just gave me 5 stars for. THIS is the type of review to I would like to ignore completely. Someone who understands how the Foundry works would not have left this review."

BUT

We cannot force people to use the Foundry (nor should we), and so we cannot avoid reviews like this. I am going to ask the person what they meant, and maybe see if they might change the rating if I can change it, or whatever.

Did the map itself simply feel cluttered?
Were the respawn points poorly placed?
Did they mean that the placement was crowded?

Because they're all completely different issues.

But they don't know that. They're using the terms that they do know to communicate what they thought was wrong with it. And what more can they do, really? As the Author, it's in my benefit to find out what they meant.

So I would LIKE to ignore it, but it's an opportunity for education: Mine, as to what the person means, and the person's, because they might learn something about the Foundry. Or not, or whatever. The point is that it's done in the spirit of cooperation.

Also, in this example: I've overlooked the fact that the person also gave me two 5 Stars, and that they played 3 of my missions the first place - they spent time on my work (getting it closer to leaving the review stage), and gave me some attention and feedback. Really, that's kinda neat (as Archie Andrews might say, if he played STO).

Don't overlook stuff like that. It's important, because you need to look at the good stuff too. It's important for your sense of worth as an Author. Don't overlook stuff that makes you feel good! Not to sound like a Deferi, but balance is important.

And just like you spent time making it, they spent their time playing it. They could have been farming STFs or lockboxes instead. Yes, you probably spent more time making it, but they definitely spent their time playing it. As a Consumer, they just want a product that they enjoy. As an Author, it's up to us to give it to them, overcoming all the restrictions that are in our way. Even when 'their knowledge of the Foundry' is one of the restrictions.

You don't need to know how a music studio works to know whether or not you like a piece of music, and this is essentially no different.

2: "Your time limit is wrong"

I had no idea what this meant, so I mailed the person and asked them. They replied "You say it takes 45 minutes, but it took me well over an hour."

Firstly: They played my work for over an hour. I want to give THEM dilithium, dang it! Can I give THEM 5 Stars? AWESOME. Credit where it's due, eh?

Secondly, no matter what excuses you use (valid or otherwise) you cannot control other people's experience of your work, only influence it. That's part of being a creator. It's the best part, I think - everyone gets a different experience, because everyone is different.

Finally, in both cases (1 and 2), they didn't make it a personal attack. They simply said what they thought the problem was, and left it at that. That's how do it: Stay classy, reviewers.

In conclusion, I would like to state that I don't know how to close essays properly but I've said everything I wanted to.

(*PLUG* Defense Extra: Azure is the KDF one with "way too many Romulans", if you wanted to judge it for yourself. Currently still in review stage. *PLUG*)
Very cool bud. Thanks
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 2,228
# 14
09-16-2012, 12:23 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by diogene0 View Post
Well sometimes we can get the feeling that the reviewer should know more about the Foundry but it also gives us clues about what we should do with this tool too.

"Data doesn't look familiar, it's a saurian" in one of my missions. I had to do this to respect the EULA, but taking the player to the bridge of the USS Enterprise D was a mistake. I won't do it anymore. A good story never requires that. If the story is good enough, the player will think it's a good Star Trek story; characters from the series are pure fluff.

At first glance it looks like an unfair review because one could think this player is telling me to break the EULA but it's not. I should have build my story differently (and at some point I will but I have too many current projects to do it now).

"Too many typos". This is often the first review I get. I'm stupid. I always build mission in my native language and then I translate them because I think english-speaking players can enjoy it. Half of them don't because I can't catch all my mistakes. I could put a disclamer saying "f**k off if you don't like typos" but I don't because I know how important this issue can be. If I don't want bad reviews I just have to stop translating my missions, and that's something I consider from time to time anyway. Again I'm responsible of my bad reviews here.

It can be unpleasant but it's also important to know what the players expect in our missions.
What I always do is use word when I am writing and set the language to US, because I know 90% of the audience is American. It helps me catch all the little spelling mistakes.

I use the FreeMind tool to map out my story too.
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,875
# 15
09-16-2012, 01:11 PM
Well I remember that I got between 2 and 7 1-stars from some anonymous vandals on a mission, Exploratory Crisis, that received about the same amount of 5-stars, half of which came with good, proper reviews. The earliest players also said stuff like "Short." or "Too short." for good reason, as it was literally an alpha stage. The unfortunate parts are:

1. The above-mentioned scoundrels have forced my map out of circulation, preventing it from getting any new reviews.

2. The early players never came back to see what became of the mission, leaving their reviews relatively low.

The first taught me only that some people can't appreciate effort.

But the second taught me not to release my missions so early.
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Oh, lovely, I can't even requote the Douglas Adams quote I used to have here I WANT IT BACK!!!!
Dalo Lorn
DaloLorn, StarCraft 2 Roleplayer and proud of it.
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 5,435
# 16
09-16-2012, 01:25 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by diogene0 View Post
Well sometimes we can get the feeling that the reviewer should know more about the Foundry but it also gives us clues about what we should do with this tool too.

"Data doesn't look familiar, it's a saurian" in one of my missions. I had to do this to respect the EULA, but taking the player to the bridge of the USS Enterprise D was a mistake. I won't do it anymore. A good story never requires that. If the story is good enough, the player will think it's a good Star Trek story; characters from the series are pure fluff.

At first glance it looks like an unfair review because one could think this player is telling me to break the EULA but it's not. I should have build my story differently (and at some point I will but I have too many current projects to do it now).

"Too many typos". This is often the first review I get. I'm stupid. I always build mission in my native language and then I translate them because I think english-speaking players can enjoy it. Half of them don't because I can't catch all my mistakes. I could put a disclamer saying "f**k off if you don't like typos" but I don't because I know how important this issue can be. If I don't want bad reviews I just have to stop translating my missions, and that's something I consider from time to time anyway. Again I'm responsible of my bad reviews here.

It can be unpleasant but it's also important to know what the players expect in our missions.
Did you explain Data looking like a Saurian? What mission is this?
Empire Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 2,202
# 17
09-16-2012, 03:20 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by stoleviathan99 View Post
Did you explain Data looking like a Saurian? What mission is this?
Yes I did, I said he was trying some sort of new head for science purpose or something like that. I don't remember how I did that exactly but there is a reason. Probably not valid for my reviewer. Now I have some more experience with the foundry, I can't really disagree with him. Immersion is always a critical issue.
It's in the second part of my very first mission: you won't be borg 2/2.

But as I said earlier I consider adding him a mistake now. You need too many workarounds not to break the EULA and it looks artificial and uneeded.

Last edited by diogene0; 09-16-2012 at 03:26 PM.
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 844
# 18
09-16-2012, 08:30 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by diogene0 View Post
Yes I did, I said he was trying some sort of new head for science purpose or something like that. I don't remember how I did that exactly but there is a reason. Probably not valid for my reviewer. Now I have some more experience with the foundry, I can't really disagree with him. Immersion is always a critical issue.
It's in the second part of my very first mission: you won't be borg 2/2.

But as I said earlier I consider adding him a mistake now. You need too many workarounds not to break the EULA and it looks artificial and uneeded.
Yeah, I'd say it's better not to show a character at all, rather than show that 'character' with a different appearance. In the end the characters from the show aren't vital to making a ST story. You can create new characters that are somewhat derivative from the ones in the shows to capture the feel.


Click here for my Foundry tutorial on Creating A Custom Interior Map.
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 47
# 19
09-17-2012, 08:20 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by drkfrontiers View Post
I just don't see the point in personally insulting people who have put in effort and time creating Foundry missions.
This is exactly the problem. You don't see the point in insulting people while some people live to insult people. I doubt Cryptic would do anything against them, but if any reviews insults you on a personal level I think that is something you can and should report.
____________________________________________
The poster formerly known as LordOfPit, and his blog.
* Dec 2007 (CO)
* Oct 2008 (STO)
Commander
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 303
# 20
09-25-2012, 05:35 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by slickrick1707e View Post
Yea same here, thanks for this post. Here is what I find, most of the positive reviews I get are from actual Star Trek fans that know what I am trying to do. The trolls and D!cks are not.
Some truth here, I think. I just recently published my first foundry mission. Reviews:

5 Stars - "An astounding mission. You could have written an episode."

1 Star - "to(sic) long boring and stupid"

As another review stated, it's a "creative, fun Trekkish" story. So, yeah, I guess if you are not a fan of Star Trek...
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is Off
HTML code is Off


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 01:58 AM.