Captain
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 2,912
# 171
10-04-2012, 01:23 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by bitemepwe View Post
Out of curiuosity, did your first one not help? at all?
Not really, I found the cycling EPtX really failed dismally in my hands, I trid to do it but I always found the next one in line to be on cooldown or I got blown up because I needed something that was unavailable to me. I find I can usually put a hole in those build though, there is usually some weakness (usually warp plasma) that I exploit the moment it shows up and while it isn't a game ender it's enough to keep a stalemate going
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 597
# 172
10-04-2012, 01:24 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by baudl View Post
the assesment of bombers being "armed to the teeth" must be seen in another light. The guns of a bomber were not designed to destroy incoming enemy planes, but to force them off their attack vector. The cannons on those fighters had superior range by far...but it was difficult to aim in those plains, and even harder when fired upon and doing evasive actions.
Alse the incredible numbers of those bomber squads asured that not all could be taken down before reaching the target.

the fighter escorts of those bombers actually took care of enemy fighters. Once those fighters had to return due to fuel capacity, the bomber squads suffered heavy losses due to fighter attacks.
In general though it can be said that 1 fighter against 1 bomber was death sentense for the bomber.
the light armament of bombers were never intended to take down enemy fighter planes (although they did of course) rather to make it more difficult to shoot at them.
numbers actually indicate this, that most of the luftwaffe was shot down by other fighter aircrafts.

but to your problem of keeping enemies off your back:
use vent plasma, it's a great dmg ability and clears your tail mercyless and has the escort captain rotate in his seat for sure
Tractor beam repulsor is great if you use a more sci oriented cruiser
chroniton mines or torps in the rear work excellent
full stop and reverse
you also have 4 device slot for a reason...use the deuterium surplus, not for running away but to run circles around the escort for a change
there is also this very cheap console, subspace jump, a real burner, if you don't have it up to now, get it.

and now here is the number one burner, escort captain will hate me for this: If the advantage of the escort is it's turnrate...then take it from her. Thats the secret actually, immobilization!
do not try to smash firepower against firepower, search the weakness and exploit it.
Leave it to someone like yourself who doesn't know bullistics, to tell me what guns will do and won't do. I shot many calibur weapons for 13 years because it was my job. Not only did I shoot them but had to know the mechanics of the weapon, affecective ranges and damage done by these weapons. I shot 5.56, 7.62, 9mm, 50 Cal., 25mm, 30mm, 40mm, and 120mm. I ran ranges and did battle damage assesments in the US and in Iraq. If it has anything to do with grunts and tankers, I did it. The planes are armed with 30mm machine guns in those days. The size of one round is as thick as 3 of your fingers together will make a hole in 12 inch thick aluminum armor of a M113, large enough to put you head through it. That's a light, medium armored army vehicle, so imagine the round going through a thiner skin plane with wind speeds 200-300 mph. If the holes don't split your wings, the wind will finish the job. Fighter planes's structure can't stand the 300 mph wind pressure after it's structure beams have been split by 30mm bullets. The planes will decentergrate after the pressure, so if you think those guns can't destroy planes, you are sadly mistaken.

I don't think taking some of the turn rate from the escort will solve the problem because there ships like the Galaxy types that are at the bottom rung of the turn rate latter. We players has been asking for a turn rate boost for the Galaxy types since the game's launch, yet the Devs don't think we need one. I sight balancing the weapons as a better way to even the playing field without making all the ships totally identical in performance.
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 2,228
# 173
10-04-2012, 01:28 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by alexindcobra View Post
You forgot about the lockbox shipa which are mostly escorts: D'kora, Jem'Hadar Attack Ship, Orb Weaver, Wells Class, Mobius Class, Korath Class, Krenn Class, and A Qin Raptor. Thats a hell of alot more escorts than cruiser coming out as of recent. The new assault cruiser is the only new cruiser on the that has come out.

For as the other statement about escorts supposed to be more powerful, there is no manual or canon material that says so. Don't be so caught up in the BS that Cryptic feeds you because they are not feeding you with information from any Star Trek canon site. They are making up stuff as they go along just because they are the Devs. I have read the sites on cannons and phaser banks and arrays. I have read sites on the smaller attack ships and the regular cruisers.

"In starship classification, an escort vessel was a starship whose primary purpose is to accompany other vessels as a means of protection. Escorts typically protected lesser armed vessels, or vessels carrying an important cargo.

In 2154, Degra's ship was protected by two Xindi-Reptilian warships, which served as escort ships, during the proving ground Xindi superweapon prototype test mission in the Calindra system. (ENT: "Proving Ground")

In 2368, a radical faction based on the Beta moon of Peliar Zel intercepted the Federation shuttlecraft Hawking claiming to be an escort vessel. (TNG: "The Host")

The Defiant-class, originally developed to counter the Borg, is officially classified as an escort vessel, but was unofficially a warship. (DS9: "The Search, Part I")."

Ref:http://en.memory-alpha.org/wiki/Escort_vessel
Half the ships you just described are not escorts. Some of them are sci ships and cruisers. If you are trying to play them as escorts you are doing it wrong.

Also, by that same argument Cryptic just released 9 cruisers. The Oddy + Oddy Package and the Bort + Bort Package + Regent
Captain
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 2,912
# 174
10-04-2012, 01:32 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by drkfrontiers View Post
Half the ships you just described are not escorts. Some of them are sci ships and cruisers. If you are trying to play them as escorts you are doing it wrong.

Also, by that same argument Cryptic just released 9 cruisers. The Oddy + Oddy Package and the Bort + Bort Package + Regent
and even a "noob" who "suck"s can beat the oddy (with and without full oddy console set) in an excelsior the day they got it using a tac RA and nothing better than Mk VIII on the ship and can put the regent to shame with an engineer VA in an Excelsior with most stuff at Mk XII (consoles being the only exception)
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 2,228
# 175
10-04-2012, 01:37 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by adamkafei View Post
and even a "noob" who "suck"s can beat the oddy (with and without full oddy console set) in an excelsior the day they got it using a tac RA and nothing better than Mk VIII on the ship and can put the regent to shame with an engineer VA in an Excelsior with most stuff at Mk XII (consoles being the only exception)
Thats odd. Some of the best PvP players in the game fly the Oddy. And they don't sux.
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 597
# 176
10-04-2012, 01:39 PM
[quote=bitemepwe;5953241]
Quote:
I've PvP'ed in the BortasQu in both Kerrat and the Ques. I know just how slow a Cruiser can be on its on without using something to boost thier speed and turn.

I never said you had to run form an escort to let them get in your six, only that once there they are happy becuase all you can do is try to run and shoot at them with just 4 Beam Arrays, some mines, etc.
Still just jumping to conclusions, you are.




So you lack the ability to imagine hypothetical situations?

and thanks for the romp down memory lane.
Well, it sounded like you implied that i fly with my backside facing my opponents on purpose.

I don't have to imagine a military versions of a plane because know military tech and civilian tech. There couldn,t be a military version of it without changing the whole wings of the plane thus changing what it does. If you made the 787 a military plane, it would have to be a new type of AWACS because that plane don't make manuvers that are drastic from civilian airliners.
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 2,228
# 177
10-04-2012, 01:40 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by zubo100 View Post
I think you misunderstood my first point. Only cruisers would get this weapon multiplier and not escorts.

And the weapons are not really that different. Sure a beam array does far less damage than a cannon, but then you can shoot 8 at the same time, but only 4 cannons. If you do a plain dps calculation (without any mods etc.) you will see that a 4 cannons 3 turrets vs. 8 beams setup is only ~15% different.

My second suggestion would improve an 8-beam setup in such a way that it would actually be superior to a cannon setup in terms of raw dps. What makes escorts so powerful are still the BOs and the console slot...
You weren't around during the early days were you?

Back in those days cruisers were the only ship + FAW the only ability. People were very, very glad to see that end. Even cruiser pilots.
Captain
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 2,912
# 178
10-04-2012, 01:41 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by drkfrontiers View Post
Thats odd. Some of the best PvP players in the game fly the Oddy. And they don't sux.
In all fairness when it comes to my fleet I am the one with the most PvP experience, I have dabbled in it and survived better than I expected, I became a better team player as a result.

I will admit the only ones I have fought were those of my fleetmates and they really can't handle the shield strip of 6 tetryon beams but all their builds presented weaknesses that I exploited, one was in his skill cycles, the regent was the metryon gas, a little metryon gas plus warp plasma = premature detonation = decent damage to the regent, lay down some tetryon fire on the rear shield and you can really punish the pilot.
Captain
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 2,912
# 179
10-04-2012, 01:44 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by drkfrontiers View Post
You weren't around during the early days were you?

Back in those days cruisers were the only ship + FAW the only ability. People were very, very glad to see that end. Even cruiser pilots.
Does that mean there is a chance for the age of escort domination to come to an end at some point?
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 597
# 180
10-04-2012, 01:47 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by drkfrontiers View Post
Half the ships you just described are not escorts. Some of them are sci ships and cruisers. If you are trying to play them as escorts you are doing it wrong.

Also, by that same argument Cryptic just released 9 cruisers. The Oddy + Oddy Package and the Bort + Bort Package + Regent
Nice try, hahaha. Reselling us the Oddy, 4 times don't count as bringing us new cruisers, same as the extra Bortas as well.

Name a cruiser from my list?
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