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Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 2,267
# 21
10-07-2012, 07:47 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by corsair114 View Post
They wipe attack buffs and over-time offensive powers just as fast as they wipe heals and resistances.

They are utterly degenerate in their design and implementation and do not expand or enhance PvP mechanically in any way, shape, or form. If healing is over the top, making a DOff everyone should use to counter it, one which greatly degrade's the usefulness of a Captain in a team composition, is not the right ****ing answer to the problem.

[edit]

JM2c.
Absolutely what Corsair114 stated. Right there.
Commander
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 270
# 22
10-07-2012, 08:04 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by drkfrontiers View Post
Absolutely what Corsair114 stated. Right there.
I agree, this is not the solution to the problem. I have illustrated the problem more accurately in my last post.

This was a poor effort to getting around an issue and now it has come to bite us all in the community.

Surely more effort and more assets can be put in to PVP, but yeh, at this moment I could care less.

One thing that I do find ironic is that I brought this issue up long ago. I was then attacked on these forums for even mentioning that SNB had issues and that healing and mitigation needed to be looked at... and here we are like a year later and the SNB issue has multiplied as well as the healing/mitigation issue.
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 2,267
# 23
10-07-2012, 08:10 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by freedumb4eva View Post
I agree, this is not the solution to the problem. I have illustrated the problem more accurately in my last post.

This was a poor effort to getting around an issue and now it has come to bite us all in the community.

Surely more effort and more assets can be put in to PVP, but yeh, at this moment I could care less.
You intentions are all valid. But, the SNB Doffs are not contributing anything positive to pvp. They merely exasperate the problem.

The doffs and balance in most areas of the "pvp game" are problematic at best.

The classes are too few, the abilities too narrow and in combination only result in cookie-cutter builds.

The devs fix one problem only to unbalance something else, and the cycle repeats itself.

It is too easy and quick to spot the next, sure "thing" that is to be OP in the game and players enmass to respec for it.

Also, look at a game like EVE. There is so much happening in terms of weapons, consoles, abilities, ship types etc etc that to find that perfect build is arduous and something to feel proud of achieving.

In STO, it has nothing to do with that. Anyone, irrespective of skill becomes a hero.

Last edited by drkfrontiers; 10-07-2012 at 08:13 AM.
Commander
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 438
# 24
10-07-2012, 08:17 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by freedumb4eva View Post
...and when is the nerf coming for stacking mitigation and heals?

Nerfing the sub nuc doff without tampering with the mitigation/heals in the game is ridiculous.

Then there is literally no chance of getting through heals/buffs without a sci on the team and waiting for the CD on sub nuc and hoping to alpha strike through twitch reactions of healers...

I guess PVP in STO just isn't for me then. It has become less about skill and more about who can remove buffs or who can apply the most buffs, imo.

The reason that the doff was added was likely due to the ridiculous heals and buffs that are available. There is no other recourse against them for Tactical Captains.
You fix healing balance in this game by fixing healing balance in this game. While i agree that healing in this game needs a balance pass, introducing one broken mechanic to fix another broken mechanic isnt the solution.

If a nerf to doffs (which you apparently don't even own) is all its going to take for you to stomp your feet and quit pvp'ing...then I guess we won't be seeing you around then...
Commander
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 270
# 25
10-07-2012, 08:57 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by drkfrontiers View Post
You intentions are all valid. But, the SNB Doffs are not contributing anything positive to pvp. They merely exasperate the problem.

The doffs and balance in most areas of the "pvp game" are problematic at best.

The classes are too few, the abilities too narrow and in combination only result in cookie-cutter builds.

The devs fix one problem only to unbalance something else, and the cycle repeats itself.

It is too easy and quick to spot the next, sure "thing" that is to be OP in the game and players enmass to respec for it.

Also, look at a game like EVE. There is so much happening in terms of weapons, consoles, abilities, ship types etc etc that to find that perfect build is arduous and something to feel proud of achieving.

In STO, it has nothing to do with that. Anyone, irrespective of skill becomes a hero.
That is exactly my point, those people asking for a nerf to SubNuc DOFF without asking for a look at the OVERALL PROBLEM are just causing more people to not be able to kill the unkillable targets.
Commander
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 270
# 26
10-07-2012, 08:59 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by falloutx23 View Post
You fix healing balance in this game by fixing healing balance in this game. While i agree that healing in this game needs a balance pass, introducing one broken mechanic to fix another broken mechanic isnt the solution.

If a nerf to doffs (which you apparently don't even own) is all its going to take for you to stomp your feet and quit pvp'ing...then I guess we won't be seeing you around then...
You are 100% missing the point and probably not reading my posts then.

Nerfing the SubNuc DOFFS is nerfing the bandaid to the healing/mitigation problem thereby causing the original problem to inflate.

SubNuc DOFF cannot and should not be nerfed until healing has been balanced BECAUSE SubNuc DOFF was inserted into the game to bandaid the healing issue.

The side-effect is that targets who are not being bombarded with healing and mitigation are helpless and just get aced.

SubNuc DOFF was NOT the solution to be added to PVP. Healing and mitigation in PVP is out of control, but probably balanced against ELITE BORG STF... this is a major problem and the BANDAID SubNuc DOFF does not fix it.

Yet, nerfing the bandaid makes the problem in PVP worse.

I would really like to know with all of the money put in to this game, WHY isn't there a larger effort to bring balance to PVP... the only conclusion, there is no DESIRE to do so... in which case /quit PVP

PVP in STO seems to have been, from the onset, something tacked onto a specifically PVE oriented game that pacifies the potential outcry of, "WHAT!? No PVP???" This leads to my outcry of, "WHAT!? This is your idea of PVP???"

Last edited by freedumb4eva; 10-07-2012 at 09:07 AM.
Captain
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 13,988
# 27
10-07-2012, 10:06 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by freedumb4eva View Post
PVP in STO seems to have been, from the onset, something tacked onto a specifically PVE oriented game
Has that ever been in doubt though?
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 514
# 28
10-07-2012, 10:08 AM
Ugh do u guys never get tired of this discussion...

Yes, SNB doff doesnt add any value to PvP. Players stay crap, pugs stay crap.
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 514
# 29
10-07-2012, 10:10 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by freedumb4eva View Post
SubNuc DOFF cannot and should not be nerfed until healing has been balanced BECAUSE SubNuc DOFF was inserted into the game to bandaid the healing issue.

you really believe that? So they made a subnuc doff and couldnt simply adjust the healing in this game a bit? Cmon. Rediculous statement.

Its a solution yes, but a very crappy solution, no crappy PvPer really gets better by using them, pvp is more then equipping effective chance based factors to your ship in order to gain yourself a nice advantage.

Adding anything chance based with such a powerful effect (simply adding the best science captain skill to your build at random activation) is just stupid and won't add to the value and integrity of PvP, there could've been other solutions.
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 797
# 30
10-07-2012, 10:44 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by virusdancer View Post
Has that ever been in doubt though?
there was that season when they added all the global cooldowns.... that was quite the cocktease.
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