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Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 525
# 21
10-15-2012, 12:05 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by hurleybird View Post
If you're gimping your DPS in order to get more polaron/tetryon/phaser procs you're doing it very wrong.
gimp? hardly, 10% bonus to crit severity, that's it. vs power drain, shield drain, subsytem shutdown. and on the dual proc weapons? evidently you are one of the ones that doesn't understand why the polaron proc was recently mofified >.> or the phaser proc.

Quote:
Originally Posted by p2wsucks View Post
Weapons' proc is based on volley not the number of shots per volley. There's no benefit to using DCs over DHCs in this regard.
yes there is, ROF for DC's is higher than DHC's. or to put it another way, DC's cycle faster than DHC's. all you have to do is look at DPV vs DPS to know that.
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 883
# 22
10-15-2012, 01:24 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by deadspacex64 View Post
gimp? hardly, 10% bonus to crit severity, that's it. vs power drain, shield drain, subsytem shutdown. and on the dual proc weapons? evidently you are one of the ones that doesn't understand why the polaron proc was recently mofified >.> or the phaser proc.
Of course I know how the procs were modified. If the increased proc rate was worth losing ~10% DPS and a far less busty damage pattern then nobody in the PvP community would be using DHCs. Even with the hybrid weapons, it's not worth it. Now if you're running a glider build, that's another story entirely.
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Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 2,988
# 23
10-15-2012, 01:40 AM
I run 3 SC and a DBB on my Bug (turrets rear). I sacrifice the DPS for wider arc. It means I don't have to worry about lining up and can keep my speed and hence defense very high and still hit my target. To date no other bug has beat me although there have been a few draws. A 10% dmg boost to my SC would be most acceptable lol!

Agreed with doing something about DC, they don't seem to have a niche, if you're going for a 45 deg arc you may as well have DHC. I'd go 45 deg for DHC, 90 DEG for DC and 180 DEG for SC, seems to fit nicely, adjust damage to suit.


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Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 525
# 24
10-15-2012, 02:08 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by hurleybird View Post
Of course I know how the procs were modified. If the increased proc rate was worth losing ~10% DPS and a far less busty damage pattern then nobody in the PvP community would be using DHCs. Even with the hybrid weapons, it's not worth it. Now if you're running a glider build, that's another story entirely.
it's not 10% dps, the crit severity only counts if you crit...so it's your crit chance that determines what potential loss of dps is. for ex: on my tac's it's pure DHC, as attack pattern alpha boosts crit chance/severity, along with accuracy bleed over and weapon specialization. parsed averages out to around 12% to 15% crit rate. AP DHC's being the best option for them.

sci and eng characters that use the dual proc weapons they don't get that bonus to crit chance from APA. their only hope is through weapon specialization, accuracy bleed over, and borg console. glider build or not, -49 power and -619 all shield facings per proc is not minor. or a suddenly disabled subsystem. the one tet build i'm still running is only because i don't feel like running boldly they rode again (already ran it 20+ for my other toons)

their average crit rate for them is around 7% and only 1 build thus far is pure dc (phased polaron w/the drains outlined above), the others have 1 dhc in the mix. so overall not an extreme loss in dps.

and as to 'it's not worth it' the changes you suggest would affect PvE as well. so instead of altering the current dc's stats...better to just create a new weapon. or several. dual cannons already have a niche...just not many understand it.
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Join Date: Jun 2012
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# 25
10-15-2012, 02:22 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by deadspacex64 View Post
it's not 10% dps, the crit severity only counts if you crit...so it's your crit chance that determines what potential loss of dps is. for ex: on my tac's it's pure DHC, as attack pattern alpha boosts crit chance/severity, along with accuracy bleed over and weapon specialization. parsed averages out to around 12% to 15% crit rate. AP DHC's being the best option for them.
Where did I say anything about criticals? The only reason DHCs do more DPS than DCs is because they cycle better together and drain less weapons energy.
Empire Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 7,679
# 26
10-15-2012, 02:33 AM
some one needs to read my post on the first page about DC disadvantages. according to a test mav did, DCs because they drain so much more power basically do no additional glider or dem damage over DHCs. and weapon procs themselves? they arent per hit like DEM and glider, they are per cycle, no advantage to DCs here again. there is not a single redeeming quality for DCs.
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Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 525
# 27
10-15-2012, 03:06 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by hurleybird View Post
Where did I say anything about criticals? The only reason DHCs do more DPS than DCs is because they cycle better together and drain less weapons energy.
power isn't that difficult to keep high. and basing it purely on power the dps loss is marginal. especially on an eng character.

Quote:
Originally Posted by dontdrunkimshoot View Post
some one needs to read my post on the first page about DC disadvantages. according to a test mav did, DCs because they drain so much more power basically do no additional glider or dem damage over DHCs. and weapon procs themselves? they arent per hit like DEM and glider, they are per cycle, no advantage to DCs here again. there is not a single redeeming quality for DCs.
wrong, weapon procs don't need power levels. dc's = more chance to proc than dhc's. and seriously, can't believe you've played the game, or anyone else who thinks there's no difference in ROF between dc's and dhc's. it's not the per hit or tiny little blobs the spew out it's per volley dc's have a higher volley rate than dhc's.

so easy to determine for yourself, look at the weapon stats DPV and DPS. dps is identical on dc's/dhc's...here's what very few are seemingly able to get. dpv on dc's are far lower than dpv on dhc's, now, if if dps is identical, and dpv on dc's are lower than dpv on dhc's what does that suggest?

i'll do it for you, dc's to achieve the same dps fire faster than dhc's because of their lower dpv. that's volleys, so no matter how you try to slice it up, into volley's or shots, dc's ROF is higher than dhc's.

the only drawback is the higher ROF causes higher power drain and less recovery between volley's (as hurleybird stated). this can however be mitigated by a single dhc and/or torp, weapons batteries, eng captain. none of which are even greatly necessary because if you were after pure damage in the first place you wouldn't be using dc's much less worrying about a proc.
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Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 2,988
# 28
10-15-2012, 04:06 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by deadspacex64 View Post
sci and eng characters that use the dual proc weapons they don't get that bonus to crit chance from APA. their only hope is through weapon specialization, accuracy bleed over, and borg console.
Don't forget the new tachyokinetic console


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Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,397
# 29
10-15-2012, 04:27 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by mattjohnsonva View Post
I run 3 SC and a DBB on my Bug (turrets rear). I sacrifice the DPS for wider arc. It means I don't have to worry about lining up and can keep my speed and hence defense very high and still hit my target. To date no other bug has beat me although there have been a few draws. A 10% dmg boost to my SC would be most acceptable lol!

Agreed with doing something about DC, they don't seem to have a niche, if you're going for a 45 deg arc you may as well have DHC. I'd go 45 deg for DHC, 90 DEG for DC and 180 DEG for SC, seems to fit nicely, adjust damage to suit.
Sounds like you need to face MT or Aythani

Agree with your last paragraph.
Rihannsu
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,742
# 30
10-15-2012, 05:00 AM
Long overdue, .... little hope that this gets fixed. Just make all DCs DHC and be done with it.
Joined 06.10
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PvP 2012-2013
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